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Prepare for some news

ozbash

Referee
Messages
26,922
The other issue people ignore is there is a serious shortage of big Props in the Aussie game....there is a shortage in our local game...

The game is evolving away from the big beefy props, we are now looking at faster agile 80 minute front rowers..
 

Rich102

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
11,760
The game is evolving away from the big beefy props, we are now looking at faster agile 80 minute front rowers..

If this is the case how come all the Grand Final winners since Adam was a boy have strong, powerful props? Also, the years when we made the Grand Finals, we had size in the front row.

The game may be evolving but give me horsepower in the front row anytime.
 

KeepingTheFaith

Referee
Messages
25,235
The game is evolving towards props and second rowers being interchangeable. Second rowers these days are big and strong enough to be props, and props are fast enough to be second rowers.

There will always be exceptions, but the gap between prop and second row is closing all the time.
 

JJ

Immortal
Messages
32,588
They need to be mobile - my concern has been that all 17 players are gradually shifting towards the same body type...

But, in this years' finals the last 4 standing all had big packs, the mobile packs (e.g., Manly) simply ran out of steam. Souths were awesome tbh, just smashed everyone whether they had the ball or were defending...
 

sup42

Juniors
Messages
2,466
Size and make up of props is an interesting one.

Size versus mobility......Fitness / Technique.

It is a continuum.

It is easy too get bogged down in one end of the size continuum versus the fitness and technical side of the Game.

People will cite this team having Big Props versus that team having mobile long minute Props.

Others will cite teams with super fit high output props.

The truth is it comes down to the quality of the individuals and having the mental part right ahead of any considerations toward Size or long minutes.


The Melbourne Storm are the most successful Dynastic club of the modern era.

They are not renowned for big forward packs, rather they are associated with technical brilliance and fitness.

As others have stated the Rabbitohs and Roosters have challenged that model....even the Dogs have.....with monster packs.

If you look at those teams and consider the most important forwards in them who include these interchangeable backrow prop types:

Souths:
Sam and George Burgess ( the big and the long minutes of the continuum )

Manly : Watmough / Stewart

Melbourne : Bromwich / Harris

Roosters: ( their winning 2013 side ) JWH , Moa , Sbw

Dogs: James Graham, and a cast of big forwards.


In all those teams the key forward is the smaller forward, however it is not as simple as isolating them as a sign of the ' new direction' of the game....because all of those lead forwards ( Sam Burgi / Stewart/Watmough/Harris / Proctor / Moa / SBW / Graham ) are counter balanced by big men like ( George Bergi, JHW, Kassiano, Rose in Manly's winning year ).

The club that stands out is the Storm. Bromwich is rare in terms of his out and out size ( Lazurus was a big prop for them but he also invented big minutes for fat men under the ten meter rule ).


So all the years I've watched this game all I see now is trends, no absolutes.

Trends come in and out of vogue.

The absolutes of rugby league are mental toughness , footballing intelligence, and raw talent last.

Fitness....is a state of being that becomes possible with mental fitness . strength / resolve.

The most successful pack the Warriors have ever fielded was also their biggest pack. Little wonder Warriors fans obsess over the size dimension.

Remember too...that the most successful Warriors pack ever had a small forward will the biggest ticker (Kevin Campion) driving it.

Not to mention that 2002 side came unstuck against the fittest most mobile pack in the comp in 2002.

Balance.

Tough smaller guys who are alpha males are the pitbulls of the League world, they are worth gold backed up by some big Mastiff types.

The thing that is easily overlooked when talking about go forward is the Hooking role.

If you have a smart hooker....a director of your pack....you will get more out of any given pack on any given day from a top rank hooker.....ergo Smith has afforded Bellamy employing people like Lowrie.

Daniel Anderson managed to assemble the likes of Campion, Feka, Seuseu, Villisante, Tooki, and drive them all with the brains of Marsh.

Ivan Cleary did the opposite...by copying Bellamy's mould of tackling forward plays long minutes...people Like Luck and Mannering and Taylor became the new Kevin Campions.....people like Rapira / Lillyman and Friend, became the defensive clean up guys of Ivans style.
Ivans dummy half options only peaked for ten minutes of either half when Lance Hohaia added dynamism to a bog standard regular hooker.
So what do we need today ?

A couple of Big explosive forwards, Hoffman fixes the long minutes with Mannering and Lillyman...most of all they need a Marsh instead of a Friend.

If you paid special attention to the Sterlo clip of Shaun Johnson....you would have heard him directing the lines the forwards run....that is a hookers job ( not looking for Friend fans to quote and find argument...just making a point which is evidenced based and not anti friend or anecdotal).
 
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mt.wellington

Juniors
Messages
109
So... how long do we keep preparing? Anything new happening or we still in prep mode???

Skeleton-on-Computer2_zpsea469e49.jpg
 

KeepingTheFaith

Referee
Messages
25,235
Would not complain.

He looked to have potential in 2011, and has had 3 years to mature since.

To me though he always looked like a second rower playing centre. Not sure of his speed.
 

Mike0070

Juniors
Messages
197
Saw Elijah Taylor with his manager in Auckland on Monday , later I asked his manager if Elijah was coming back or staying at the panthers and he replied no and no.

He Said Iro was in pretty close contact with Taylor now he was back with warriors and that there was always a chance that he could come back now they have a decent coach. He did mention that Gould and Cleary would be pretty reluctant to have him go anywhere though.

Didn't give away to much but I thought it was pretty cool for him to take the time to talk to me.
 

jaseg

Juniors
Messages
2,274
ATG does look a good one, but as long as we hold on to Sam Lisone and Ray Faitala-Mariner, I'm not too disappointed in losing other fringe squad forwards. They are far and away the best prospects through the centre and on the edge respectively, for me.
 
Messages
17,768
Wonder how the player swap is going? Manly seems to have their end in Mateo, do we get Steve or Anthony? No one wants Nielson?
 

Iron Lion

Juniors
Messages
1,216
hahaha wow when I bought this news it was for a trade between players and $, I swear that this means Matai is coming here otherwise honestly the Warriors are the joke of the NRL ala Dean Bell
 

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