Round 11 Vs Titans @Cbus Super Stadium - Sunday 26th July 4pm

[chrisD]

We don't have a second first grade level hooking option (besides maybe Cleary who isn't moving). I'm happy for Kenny to fill the role due to injury, as he's as good (bad) as anyone else. I wouldn't play May or Burton there.

If Api is out in the finals I think we'd be f**ked and there'd be nothing we could do about it.

 

[herbert henry1908]

I’m sure Ivan and his support staff all recognise Matt Burton is potentially a far greater talent than Caleb Aekins.

However, for this week they are running with Aekins and surely they are better placed to make such decisions than we are as fans?

I’d like to see Dane Laurie get a debut, but that is just me as a fan.

I’ll put my faith in Ivan and his crew they surely know best and seem to be doing OK thus far in 2020 albeit there could be some testing times ahead now we are impacted with unforeseen injuries.

How many times are you going to trot out this tired line?!

For the millionth time, the whole point of these boards is discussing what the fans think, not for sticking our tongues up the arses of the coaching staff.

 

[herbert henry1908]

That is the unknown. Ivan keeps eluding to him playing in pack there must be a reason why

Because Ivan has a thing for back rowers, always has. It would be criminal to put someone with the hands and skills of Burton in the back row this early in his career, he needs some space to create.

 

[herbert henry1908]

Do you think you are better placed to make such decisions as opposed to our head coach and his team?

You have your opinion, I have mine, but you have to support the decisions of our head coach and his team, surely.

The. Whole. Point. Of. These. Discussion. Boards. Is. To. Give. Our. Opinions.


If all we did was sit around and agree with coaching staff it’d be a mighty boring discussion. Surely you can grasp this simple idea?!

 

[franklin2323]

Because Ivan has a thing for back rowers, always has. It would be criminal to put someone with the hands and skills of Burton in the back row this early in his career, he needs some space to create.

Centres do very little these days
You don't get many if any 100kg Fullbacks
So if the halves are set then leaves only backrow if he is too start

 

[herbert henry1908]

Centres do very little these days
You don't get many if any 100kg Fullbacks
So if the halves are set then leaves only backrow if he is too start

We’ve got a centre who’s the second top try scorer, there’s plenty of potential in the position if you have the right game plan and skill set.

Not sure where you’re getting 100kg from, he’s nowhere near that.

Anyway, centre would only be a holding place for Burton until a spine position came up. If he puts on the bulk for the back row he might find it difficult to revert to the halves.

 

[franklin2323]

We’ve got a centre who’s the second top try scorer, there’s plenty of potential in the position if you have the right game plan and skill set.

Not sure where you’re getting 100kg from, he’s nowhere near that.

Anyway, centre would only be a holding place for Burton until a spine position came up. If he puts on the bulk for the back row he might find it difficult to revert to the halves.

Then Staines misses out.

I'd have this backline:

Edwards
Staines
Naden
Crichton
To'o

I see Martin better as a middle. Don't re-sign Tamou. Push him up and leaves the 12 for Burton. Another pre-season will add more bulk and can use him as a play maker still

 

[herbert henry1908]

Then Staines misses out.

I'd have this backline:

Edwards
Staines
Naden
Crichton
To'o

I see Martin better as a middle. Don't re-sign Tamou. Push him up and leaves the 12 for Burton. Another pre-season will add more bulk and can use him as a play maker still

I could see Burton surpassing Naden. Maybe not this year, but eventually. But Staines could also play FB until Edwards is back.

They should give strong consideration to resting Edwards for as long as possible. Add a couple of weeks on if Staines or someone else handles FB from next week. We really don’t want Edwards inured for the finals, and those hamstring injuries are a bitch.


I reckon forcing Burton into second row is the same as forcing him out the door. The pay difference between an elite second rower and an elite spine player is massive. His manager will make that clear.

 

[herbert henry1908]

I’d almost prefer Burton go somewhere else and realise his potential as a half than play for us in the second row. Such a waste of his skills.

 

[mxlegend99]

How many times are you going to trot out this tired line?!

For the millionth time, the whole point of these boards is discussing what the fans think, not for sticking our tongues up the arses of the coaching staff.

These same coaching staff have f**ked up many times before aswell. Fullback required injuries to get it right before.

Cleary had Whare and Naiqama as fullback options ahead of Moylan who never would have gotten a run if not for injury.

Obviously Edwards is our best number 1 today. But Aekins is average and I could easily see either one of Burton or Laurie being able to exceed what he is capable of. Playing it safe against one of the worst teams in the competition makes no sense. With injuries its the perfect time to give someone else a chance to be our backup fullback.if we lost Edwards for the finals we need someone better than Aekins coming in.

Sadly hooker is just a position where we have no one. We're only back to what was probably our best option in 2019... But its an enormous downgrade. I expect to see us look alot more 2019 like losing 2 spine players that had helped ignite our attack. Theres a handful of teams bad enough that it shouldn't matter and luckily Titans are one of them. But we shouldn't waste this opportunity to try improving positions or atleast improving our backups. We know what Aekins offer.

Hopefully Ivan is sheltering Burton or Laurie by not naming them. But I am expecting Aekins will play.

 

[The_Frog]

I’d almost prefer Burton go somewhere else and realise his potential as a half than play for us in the second row. Such a waste of his skills.

If that has to happen surely we get someone of equivalent potential in return.

 

[The_Frog]

Cleary had Whare and Naiqama as fullback options ahead of Moylan who never would have gotten a run if not for injury.

Gus would have been in on this too. He was the reserve grade fullback right through 2012 but didn't show enough to make the top 25, as it was then, to the point the club signed Wes Naiqama. He took off unexpectedly in 2013.

 

[herbert henry1908]

If that has to happen surely we get someone of equivalent potential in return.

It’s for these situations I wish there was a trade option in the NRL.

 

[franklin2323]

I could see Burton surpassing Naden. Maybe not this year, but eventually. But Staines could also play FB until Edwards is back.

They should give strong consideration to resting Edwards for as long as possible. Add a couple of weeks on if Staines or someone else handles FB from next week. We really don’t want Edwards inured for the finals, and those hamstring injuries are a bitch.


I reckon forcing Burton into second row is the same as forcing him out the door. The pay difference between an elite second rower and an elite spine player is massive. His manager will make that clear.

Still plays regular footy and depends if he wants to go to a weaker team ( Where he may end up as a forward when he stops growing anyway )

 

[franklin2323]

I’d almost prefer Burton go somewhere else and realise his potential as a half than play for us in the second row. Such a waste of his skills.

The only position he would be wasted is wing. Every other position can have an impacf

 

[Pomoz]

I could see Burton surpassing Naden. Maybe not this year, but eventually. But Staines could also play FB until Edwards is back.

They should give strong consideration to resting Edwards for as long as possible. Add a couple of weeks on if Staines or someone else handles FB from next week. We really don’t want Edwards inured for the finals, and those hamstring injuries are a bitch.


I reckon forcing Burton into second row is the same as forcing him out the door. The pay difference between an elite second rower and an elite spine player is massive. His manager will make that clear.

Burton is already 88kg (I suspect that is not correct and he is already heavier) and at 6'3" if he has another off-season he is likely to get to 100kg. That isn't a problem if he can retain his agility and speed over 40m.

Since 1980, the tallest 100m Olympic champion was Usain Bolt at 6'5", he weighed 94kg which is also the heaviest weight. What is interesting is that there has been several 6' plus champions including Christie, Lewis, Gatlin and Bailey. The heaviest of these is Christie at 92kg and the lightest was Lewis at 80kg. Clearly, if he is given the right training Burton could be fast. He will need to do the sort of explosive weight training Christie did if he needs to get stronger for the NRL. If he puts on too much weight, even if it is muscle, he will turn into Mansour, slow down and limit his effectiveness as a half. History doesn't lie. Fast means relatively light if you are tall, stocky if you are short.

Burton's weight will be a massive factor In respect of agility as well. A bigger mass is harder to move and his ability to twist, step and move laterally will become more difficult the bigger he gets.

I say all this to point out you cannot predict what your genetics will deliver. He might grow another two inches. He might have the physique of a Cheetah, a la Carl Lewis and Usain Bolt or the powerful broad build of a Linford Christie, Ben Johnson type. Whatever it is he will need to be strong enough to take the impacts so he isn't injured all the time. At the moment he sort of looks like Steve Menzies in build and not the type who gets really bulky.

Once this genetic lottery plays out and provided he gets the right training, he might still be nimble and fast enough to be a half. If not, then a fullback, lock or second rower is more likely. Brad Fittler moved between lock and five eighth and he was 6'1 and 96kg. He was never fast but his ball playing made him a pretty handy player. If Burton keeps developing his skill but the genetic lottery slows him down, he could be a brilliant lock and still get paid a mozza. I agree that second row wouldn't utilise his ball playing and kicking skills. Why would anybody do that? Greg Inglis was a 6'5" 155kg fullback, so Burton could play that position as well. Greg wasn't fast, but he was powerful and skilful.

I'll go out on a limb here and say the club won't try and turn him into a second rower and will want to utilise his skills at lock, five eighth or fullback.

 

[herbert henry1908]

The only position he would be wasted is wing. Every other position can have an impacf

No one is suggesting he play wing full time, just as a fill in. But I do strongly believe it’d be a waste of his talents to move him to the back row so early in his career. He has hands better than many if not most existing halves.

I don’t think moving to a struggling side is a big consideration for someone who’s only 20. Long career ahead, winning right now isn’t essential.

 

[herbert henry1908]

Burton is already 88kg (I suspect that is not correct and he is already heavier) and at 6'3" if he has another off-season he is likely to get to 100kg. That isn't a problem if he can retain his agility and speed over 40m.

Since 1980, the tallest 100m Olympic champion was Usain Bolt at 6'5", he weighed 94kg which is also the heaviest weight. What is interesting is that there has been several 6' plus champions including Christie, Lewis, Gatlin and Bailey. The heaviest of these is Christie at 92kg and the lightest was Lewis at 80kg. Clearly, if he is given the right training Burton could be fast. He will need to do the sort of explosive weight training Christie did if he needs to get stronger for the NRL. If he puts on too much weight, even if it is muscle, he will turn into Mansour, slow down and limit his effectiveness as a half. History doesn't lie. Fast means relatively light if you are tall, stocky if you are short.

Burton's weight will be a massive factor In respect of agility as well. A bigger mass is harder to move and his ability to twist, step and move laterally will become more difficult the bigger he gets.

I say all this to point out you cannot predict what your genetics will deliver. He might grow another two inches. He might have the physique of a Cheetah, a la Carl Lewis and Usain Bolt or the powerful broad build of a Linford Christie, Ben Johnson type. Whatever it is he will need to be strong enough to take the impacts so he isn't injured all the time. At the moment he sort of looks like Steve Menzies in build and not the type who gets really bulky.

Once this genetic lottery plays out and provided he gets the right training, he might still be nimble and fast enough to be a half. If not, then a fullback, lock or second rower is more likely. Brad Fittler moved between lock and five eighth and he was 6'1 and 96kg. He was never fast but his ball playing made him a pretty handy player. If Burton keeps developing his skill but the genetic lottery slows him down, he could be a brilliant lock and still get paid a mozza. I agree that second row wouldn't utilise his ball playing and kicking skills. Why would anybody do that? Greg Inglis was a 6'5" 155kg fullback, so Burton could play that position as well. Greg wasn't fast, but he was powerful and skilful.

I'll go out on a limb here and say the club won't try and turn him into a second rower and will want to utilise his skills at lock, five eighth or fullback.

He might eventually be a back rower, all I’m saying is it’s a mistake to make him one right now.

How many people are still growing height wise at 20? That’d have to be pretty rare

 

[The_Frog]

Greg Inglis was a 6'5" 155kg fullback

I think you mean 115kg. 155kg would give him a BMI over 40. Even Sam Thiaday was only around 34.

Interesting Fittler is mentioned. His potential was recognised very early but it was more his step. Ball playing and to a large degree RL smarts came later. He could pass the ball though, evidenced by getting the try assist that broke the '91 GF open. When he was Burton's age he wasn't a patch on what he would become.

 

[herbert henry1908]

Turbo is 102kg, 6’4

RTS is 93kg but 6’0

Tedesco is 95kg and 6’0


Can’t see a reason someone who is 6’3 couldn’t play FB in the 100-105kg range