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Round 19 vs Newcastle

Gareth67

First Grade
Messages
7,064
Once again I watched Ramsey’s break on the wing to set-up that idiot Norman and as someone mentioned earlier , when Ramsey came over to congratulate Norman he basically ignore him .

Perhaps I am reading too much into that , but I know that he did not welcome Mitchell Moses when he came to Parramatta .
 
Messages
7,077
Once again I watched Ramsey’s break on the wing to set-up that idiot Norman and as someone mentioned earlier , when Ramsey came over to congratulate Norman he basically ignore him .

Perhaps I am reading too much into that , but I know that he did not welcome Mitchell Moses when he came to Parramatta .

Hook will put an end to that kind of thing.

Like Bea Arthur did to Matterson.
 

Kylez3

Juniors
Messages
298
Another garbage performance from Hunt.

Reminder that Hunt has played in the halves 7 times total this season for 0 wins. He should never play in the halves again. Anybody that thinks Griffin can turn him around are kidding themselves. The guy is 31 years old next season FFS....he is DONE mentally.
 

Spot On

Coach
Messages
13,229
One of the worst performances in the JV era. Newcastle have their own deficiencies which is why they didn’t put on 50+ points on us. We’ve never lost the McKinnon cup before.

A few things became obvious to me today;

- Kalyn Ponga will not have a long career he’s going to get bashed out of the game by continued concussions.

Did he suffer a concussion yesterday?
 
Messages
158
One of the worst performances in the JV era. Newcastle have their own deficiencies which is why they didn’t put on 50+ points on us. We’ve never lost the McKinnon cup before.

A few things became obvious to me today;

- There were some in the rumours thread last week who were saying no to Josh McGuire. FFS we desperately need some mongrel in the middle. Our pack doesn’t have a leader. Paul Vaughan has disengaged when we really need him. I’m generally concerned about Lawrie & Ford maybe they are just no up to it. Hook needs to recruit at least 2 or 3 new hard nut grubs to toughen us up. The current pack is a joke. Perhaps we get back JdB which would be awesome but otherwise He needs to recruit number one priority.

- Kalyn Ponga will not have a long career he’s going to get bashed out of the game by continued concussions.

- All the hype around our youth coming through is real. All faith in Hook to develop them.

- Williame & Fuimaono are jokes, total duds. This is what happens when Millward is left unsupervised with money to spend. Hopefully Hook will stop these antics.

- Hunt had an opportunity to make a statement but he failed. I only remember him taking on the line once in the first half otherwise he was only catching & passing. Even under Hook Clune deserves to be the starting 7. We need a bigger body at 13 so that puts McInnes to 9 & Hunt at 14 or out the team.

- Norman looked better against Newcastle his passing & running game was an improvement. Perhaps Hook can get something out of him next year.

- Lomax is absolute class, our best players in 2020 & one of the better players in the NRL. Still so young with his best years ahead of him. Future Origin rep without doubt.

- Dufty feeling some pressure from Ramsey which is causing him to lift his game. Ramsey I think is quicker & more rounded. Will be fun watching those two fight it out next year

- Any lingering doubts about Dean Young not getting to top job should now be extinguished. He’s currently not a first grade coach.

bring 2021
It cannot be expected that the backs will prosper when the forwards are not doing their job The pack as a whole are woeful with little go forward which puts the backs behind the 8 ball from the start. This produces a double whammy, the forwards feel impotent and the backs as a result lose confidence. The forwards as a whole are too small and lack power. Frizzell is one dimensional and Vaughan seems to lack motivation. Far too much one out running when in possession, no flair among the backs apart from one or two exceptions.
 

Blood Shot Eyes

First Grade
Messages
5,246
To be honest I’m not surprised by today’s performance.
The coaching staff have all been moved on & rightly so & along with Young throwing his toys out of the cot this week I reckon some of the players are well & truly looking for the season to end.
The blooding of more younger players has been needed over the last month in order to try & bring some enthusiasm to the squad regardless of results. If you thought today was bad just wait until next week, especially with Bellamy being disappointed in the storms defence.It will be brutal with the storm preparing for the semis.
I agree mate......imo sadly our blokes are sooks and feel they have nothing to play for....pity they didnt take a leaf out of The Bulldogs gutsy effort this week and play for some pride in their jersey....and we can expect much of the same in 2021 unless some are shown the door
 

Dragons4me

Juniors
Messages
411
Hope you’re right about ford but doesn’t seem to have footy brains to be honest. Lawrie is without doubt the most Lame forward in the comp so disagree there and yes Vaughan terrible this year

Bit harsh mate. Lawrie must love being told to run at brick walls every weekend by the coaching staff. Do nothing else. Don't look for gaps. Don't try a step. For gods sake don't pass the ball ever. Just get smashed. Great development plan.
 

redVinme

Juniors
Messages
1,564
I agree mate......imo sadly our blokes are sooks and feel they have nothing to play for....pity they didnt take a leaf out of The Bulldogs gutsy effort this week and play for some pride in their jersey....and we can expect much of the same in 2021 unless some are shown the door

Funnily you mention that.

Pride in the jersey. Usually instilled by the coach and senior players.

Which senior players do we have now that are dragons juniors? Merrin?

He's the only one I can think of that has debuted. All the rest are blow ins, kids and late starters.

No pride and no care.
 

BLM01

First Grade
Messages
6,526
It cannot be expected that the backs will prosper when the forwards are not doing their job The pack as a whole are woeful with little go forward which puts the backs behind the 8 ball from the start. This produces a double whammy, the forwards feel impotent and the backs as a result lose confidence. The forwards as a whole are too small and lack power. Frizzell is one dimensional and Vaughan seems to lack motivation. Far too much one out running when in possession, no flair among the backs apart from one or two exceptions.

Vaughan's problem is simple. Whether he has been told or not I am not sure but in the last 18 months or so he has developed this running at slight angles instead of straight at the defence and lost his subtle footwork at the line.... and is easy pickings to not make post contact metres or pushed back etc as he was in his very 1st hit up of the day...which unfortunately set up the the poor ground made in our 1st set...well...what transpired after that is now history

Frizzellls problems for us are also simple. Stop cutting back in the middle when we want to expose edges and get quick play the balls.

The forwards whole problem is simple in attack. I have noticed in the main they all run hard with some speed but are not deep enough.
Our backs ATM in the 1st 3 hit ups are not making any yards except for Lomax and Ramsay as lightweights that tried. Again so did Periera but now he has developed now running sideways and stepping all the time instead of running straight.
And as Joey get banging on about. We can not slow down the ruck, win any contact and are one of the slowest to play the ball.
What have these coaches been doing or watching FFS. It is not that hard. Mix it up a little in set restarts.
 
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thebigredv

Bench
Messages
3,394
Is it a problem that Griffin is buddies
/ Has history with hunt and Norman. I know many believe he may get the best from them but neither has been able to rise above the form slumps since joining us. I don't share that belief. They are full of errors and disappointed expressions, and almost never produce the goods.

I think they will do better behind a forward pack but by the time we get that their contracts will be up and I feel both club and player will be glad to cut ties.

Bring in some young halves that want to play this great game. Clune, sailor, Sullivan whoever and cut our losses. Maybe they will get tired and leave, giving us money to spend.
 

True_Believer

Juniors
Messages
1,310
The forwards whole problem is simple in attack. I have noticed in the main they all run hard with some speed but are not deep enough.

And as Joey get banging on about. We can not slow down the ruck, win any contact and are one of the slowest to play the ball.

For me, these points are indeed the key.

Forwards aren't deep enough. They just don't seem to have the speed when hitting the line to do any damage. They get contained easily and put on the ground almost immediately. The opposition week in week out seem to easily make yards even with 3 or 4 of us hanging off them. It's the real life example of men against boys.

And I have said the ruck has been an issue for us for years. How many times yesterday were there players laying on the ground while Newcastle were playing the ball? How many times were we back pedalling when they were playing the ball? I'd say for a majority of the game.

I've done a comparison of our play the ball speed this season and we are consistently slower to play the ball than the opposition. We are bad at the wrestle (which, as much as I hate it, needs to be a part of our game if we are to be competitive), and we need to be more desperate to play the ball. There are far too many players laying on the ground like a wet fish waiting patiently for the opposition to get off them so they can play the ball. And then when he is free to get up and play the ball, I've got time to have a shower and a shit before the dummy half gets the ball in his hands.
 

Dragon David

Juniors
Messages
2,342
After conceding three tries & innumerable occurrences of the gifting of possession I'm glad I then switched off & took the family out instead. It's just too painful to watch.
Yes it was painful to watch. Too many errors and lack of commitment. As redVinme said "which Dragons senior players do we have now" - Merrin - so there is just no care attitude and pointing to their jerseys to show that they are proud to wear them.

We have to build the team with wise selections of players wanting to play for the club and not just to play to earn a buck. Greater use of die hard junior players both backs and forwards mixed with 4-5 newies that can breath fire.
 

Dragon David

Juniors
Messages
2,342
I am of the opinion that our playing squad over the last 7-8 years has never been anywhere near top grade (except for a very few). The recruitment and retention of players over those years, made up mainly of journeymen, rejects, under performers, players lacking in basic skills but being selected, players lacking in size and strength and mobility, etc., has been extremely poor and that responsibility would fall on Millward and the coaches. They have not identified the players that the club needed to be in contention on a regular basis to win games and then lead to finals footy.

The use of the same players over and over again, save for injuries, meant that we were easily read in the sense that the oppositions' game plans were simple in order to beat us.

Now is the time for Griffin to identify the players who will be committed and then arrange recruitment and retention on his terms. If Millward is to remain, he just needs to arrange the signing up and leave the choosing of the players to Griffin.

It will take a long time to correct the wrongs of the past for us to be competitive again.
 

SGMax

Juniors
Messages
316
This season I have been super critical of our backs. I still think its a poor backline overall. However, the past months have shown me that our forwards are also due for criticism. Name me one forward that threatens the line, has an offload, intimidates in defence ?

Then there is the halves. I am willing to give Clune some time. Norman has lost me, and sorry to say, Hunt isn't far behind.

We have a lot of work to do.

Bottom line, the squad needs massive overall. It's not a 1-2 year fix IMHO.

Halves have been very disappointing but, we may be a little hard on them when they are constantly playing from deep in their own territory.
Always under pressure and always having to work it up the field to get maybe one play in the opposition half.

Our opposition will usually start at their 20 or 30m mark, make 50m or 60m including 2 or 3 plays in our territory....when we don't help out with errors and penalties.
Thats a whole lot more comfortable and rewarding for a half.

Get our defence right so that we can be in better territory and pressure the opposition.
Get a few imposing forwards with mongrel and aggression.
Then we will be able to better judge the rest of the team.
 
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Old Timer

Coach
Messages
13,525
For me, these points are indeed the key.

Forwards aren't deep enough. They just don't seem to have the speed when hitting the line to do any damage. They get contained easily and put on the ground almost immediately. The opposition week in week out seem to easily make yards even with 3 or 4 of us hanging off them. It's the real life example of men against boys.

And I have said the ruck has been an issue for us for years. How many times yesterday were there players laying on the ground while Newcastle were playing the ball? How many times were we back pedalling when they were playing the ball? I'd say for a majority of the game.

I've done a comparison of our play the ball speed this season and we are consistently slower to play the ball than the opposition. We are bad at the wrestle (which, as much as I hate it, needs to be a part of our game if we are to be competitive), and we need to be more desperate to play the ball. There are far too many players laying on the ground like a wet fish waiting patiently for the opposition to get off them so they can play the ball. And then when he is free to get up and play the ball, I've got time to have a shower and a shit before the dummy half gets the ball in his hands.
The points you make are indeed very valid.

I have long thought our most of our forwards are ponderous with little speed let alone explosive speed off the mark.

Our forwards are muscle bound and if the don't have a huge and predictable wind up they are totally ineffective.

Hunt & Norman tend to run sideways and use the "dish off" pass which makes the forwards flat footed and magnifies the problem.

As you say we have tacklers laying around the ruck like beached whales with a complete inability to get up and back to the defence line to stop the next wave of attack.

Much has been said about our coaches and the players but I also believe that our strength & conditioning department have a lot to answer for.
 

Adolf_Spritzer

Juniors
Messages
149
A few positives out of that performance..

1. That well and truly sealed the deal on Hunt for mine. I’ve always liked him but he had an opportunity today to show something and despite being behind an insipid forward display which didn’t help his cause, he consistently chose the wrong decision. Even the minuscule amount of pressure to perform and show what you’re capable of and he blew it. That stat of 7 starts for 0 wins says it all. Time to invest in the future, either blood Sullivan or recruit a Maloney type to mentors the young halves coming through.

2. Fegai has it, he just has it. Was made to look silly by that ponga ball but what centre hasn’t in the past two years? Quality contact in defence and moves nicely in attack, I can’t wait to see more of both him and his brother.

3. Call me crazy, but I’m almost positive Ramsey was playing fullback in attack with Dufty in the halves when Hunt came off. Could have sworn I saw him looming around the ruck in the few opportunities we had. That made my day, knowing he will almost certainly be playing there full time next year. And Hooks comment of a fullback being judged on trys saved is the writing on the wall.
 
Messages
4,682
Bit harsh mate. Lawrie must love being told to run at brick walls every weekend by the coaching staff. Do nothing else. Don't look for gaps. Don't try a step. For gods sake don't pass the ball ever. Just get smashed. Great development plan.
Lawrie actually does have a good passing game. It’s a myth he can’t pass, he passes regularly. He does lack an offload though
 

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