Rumoured and Confirmed Signings Part2

[MrBlack]

Our front row stocks are all workhorses. Which is fine. But we need one aggressive forward. A play at Moa would be great. A shame we missed on Mosoe.

 

[mxlegend99]

So far off base. When did previous management ever sign an origin and international player in their prime? When did they ever sign a youngster as highly rated as kikau?
Petero comes to mind. He was arguably the best forward in the game when we signed him. He turned Grant and Mckendry into beasts. seen nothing about Kikau bein any more rated then any of the other signings. Joel Romelo was pretty highly rated, so there's one without having to think too hard. Ben Garcia seems like another Michael Worrincy or Mark O'Halloran.

As for young stars stepping up i think a lot of us have unrealistic expectations. Also our previous coach and investment on developing our young players was garbage. Bryce, RCG, Dallin and Yeo are all coming along nicely imo. Gennings looked great too. Waqa and Rennings have a ways to go but im confident they will come on, those first 3 will all be international in a couple seasons, Dallin already should be.
so we're pinning our hopes on a great group of juniors all succeeding? We tried that with our 2007 jersey flegg side and we got some gems but plenty of disappointments too.

At full strength Api doesn't even make our top 17, he is a back up for us though undoubtedly a FG talent. Even i cant fit docker into our 17 and manu hasn't been in it for a while either. I really am struggling to understand the criticism of our signings, all along Gus has said we want to be a team of players who mostly came through our system which we all loved, now we are obviously transitioning to that and people start complaining we aren't bringing in enough established FGers :crazy:
So we don't want first grade players if they don't make our top 17 now? How's our team going to look if we lose a few of our top squad next year? Given our history it's pretty much a certainty.

The only concerns I have is the halves, and as long as the plan is to move Moylan then i am fine with that. Front row i admit is a worry aswell but we will have to wait and see what they do there.
good thing halves and front rowers aren't important.also lucky to have a halves pairing that never seems to get injured.

It looks like our success next year will be dependent on minimal or no injuries. That's just not likely to happen considering it's a miracle when we go 2 games in a row without injuries.

 

[martielang]

double.

 

[mxlegend99]

Our front row stocks are all workhorses. Which is fine. But we need one aggressive forward. A play at Moa would be great. A shame we missed on Mosoe.

Wish we could get Slammin Sam Mckendry back. He would go a long way to fixing that. Maybe hire Petero to work with out front rowers again

 

[martielang]

Its pretty easy to make everything doom and gloom when you're comparing Ben Garcia, a young, established (and improving) starting backrower/frontrower for Catalans to Worrincy who was a reserve grader and O'Halloran who was a journeyman? Garcia will be in our 17 from the get go next year.

Replacing Api with Katao doesn't seem to be that big a loss. Katao is super impressive and wouldn't take up the same cap space as Api. To say Api is better than Segeyaro is just rubbish. Sege has been ordinary of late but its understandable given his injuries this year.

Brown has performed 1.5 out of 3 years IMO. Would of liked to keep him but that's life. Manly spent big on him.

As others of said, we have Chris Smith, BMM and JFH that all look like they'll make the step up next year. The way Stanton Albert is progressing, it wouldn't surprise me if he makes the step up in the next 12 months. Also hope we keep a hold of Latu.

Agree we're a bit short on halves, but so is every club in the NRL.

 

[mxlegend99]

Its pretty easy to make everything doom and gloom when you're comparing Ben Garcia, a young, established (and improving) starting backrower/frontrower for Catalans to Worrincy who was a reserve grader and O'Halloran who was a journeyman? Garcia will be in our 17 from the get go next year.
so a Frenchman with no NRL experience just walks into a guaranteed top 17 spot? Cartwright, Merrin, Taylor and Peachey should be our starting second row with one on the bench. If we go with a 2 second rower bench then Yeo would surely be ahead of Garcia.


Also Worrincy is listed as having played more than 80 games before we signed him at 24 years of age. Garcia has played less than half that at 22 years of age. Seems about the same to me.

Replacing Api with Katao doesn't seem to be that big a loss. Katao is super impressive and wouldn't take up the same cap space as Api. To say Api is better than Segeyaro is just rubbish. Sege has been ordinary of late but its understandable given his injuries this year.
who said he was better? I certainly don't think he is. But Api is a grand final winning hooker and a quality first grader. Kato is just potential at the moment. Blake and Rennings are potential superstats too. But they haven't been near as good as our proven first graders yet. They have been liabilities at times and too many of them is surely going to have us in the same position the Tigers are in..

Brown has performed 1.5 out of 3 years IMO. Would of liked to keep him but that's life. Manly spent big on him.
he has been good more than 50% of the time. He has been our best on a few occasions also.

As others of said, we have Chris Smith, BMM and JFH that all look like they'll make the step up next year. The way Stanton Albert is progressing, it wouldn't surprise me if he makes the step up in the next 12 months. Also hope we keep a hold of Latu.
What happens if these guys just don't live up to expectations? Or if they take time to deliver? Our 5 year plan surely isn't expecting half a dozen players to come into first grade and fore at the same time.

 

[betcats]

It looks like our success next year will be dependent on minimal or no injuries. That's just not likely to happen considering it's a miracle when we go 2 games in a row without injuries.

Petero was not in his prime and never wanted to leave Brisbane, still a great player but. Honestly you are so pessimistic im not going to bother. Every clubs season is dependant on injuries, saying that like it is unique to us sound so dumb.

 

[Big Mick]

I want to see where it shakes out with our depth players first before making judgement.

 

[mxlegend99]

Petero was not in his prime and never wanted to leave Brisbane, still a great player but. Honestly you are so pessimistic im not going to bother. Every clubs season is dependant on injuries, saying that like it is unique to us sound so dumb.

He was the best front rower in the game when we signed him. Certainly a far better rep player than Merrin is at this point in his career.

How it it pessimistic to suggest that the gains and losses for 2016 are similar to the days before Gus? They are similar.

Yes every team needs luck with injuries. But we go into next season with depth no better than other clubs. We also have a lot riding on young guys improving. Tigers have thrown all their eggs in that basket and it hasn't worked well for them. If we miss the finals this year (blaming injuries or not), our NRL results under Cleary would be about the same as under Elliott. Aside from one epic finals win.

 

[betcats]

You are being pessimistic because you are looking at pretty much the worst scenarios as if they are guaranteed to happen. Yes if none of our young guys step up and we have another bad injury run we will struggle next season, that is obvious. But what happens if they all do improve? Have you considered that?

We were able to have such good depth last year cause we had only a few rep players mixed in with some good young guns on cheap contracts and a few hardworking fringe guys. Expecting us to keep that depth while also extended and upgrading the contracts of the young guns and bring in more established FG players is ridiculous.

Docker was a no name when we got him(whos been bagged for the last two years a lot) but now we have to replace him with a FGer from another club to keep depth?

When Gould said he wants the majority of our FG roster to come through our system how and when did you think that was going to happen? We put a lot of hope in our young guys in 03 as well, unless a bad injury keeps them out most the year its basically guaranteed that Bryce, Dallin, Waqa, Yeo, Rennings and RCG will improve. If we were banking on two 20yo halves learning a new coaches system I'd be worried but we are not in that position thankfully.

 

[mxlegend99]

So we're going to have 1 or 2 year cycles of players then? Bring in rookies or promising players like Docker, Robinson, Simpkins, Korisau, Masoe, Naiqama, Nabouli etc. and keep them for one contract or half the contract and then reboot and do it all over again?

Are we going to do the same with the players bought this year? We still haven't recruited to fix our two weakest positions. We can get by with our current front row, but to be a genuine threat we need an impact prop. Plus we need another half who can be better than Wallace within a year to phase him out. Moylan will eventually end up there, but Soward cant play forever. So we need that someone else sooner rather than later.

 

[mxlegend99]

Anyways thats enough defending my opinion for now. This place feels like PI. God forbid I express an opinion that isn't praising every step in the clubs 5 year plan.

Not sure where paying $750k a season for a forward fits into that plan. But considering our gains and losses i feel it was a poor move unless we're holding a big signing back.

 

[betcats]

Anyways thats enough defending my opinion for now. This place feels like PI. God forbid I express an opinion that isn't praising every step in the clubs 5 year plan.

Not sure where paying $750k a season for a forward fits into that plan. But considering our gains and losses i feel it was a poor move unless we're holding a big signing back.

If you cant handle people commenting on your opinion don't post it ffs its a forum, should I pretend to agree with you so we can all get along? Or should I not post my opinion when it differs with yours? lol grow the f**k up.

 

[Big Mick]

So we're going to have 1 or 2 year cycles of players then? Bring in rookies or promising players like Docker, Robinson, Simpkins, Korisau, Masoe, Naiqama, Nabouli etc. and keep them for one contract or half the contract and then reboot and do it all over again?

Are we going to do the same with the players bought this year? We still haven't recruited to fix our two weakest positions. We can get by with our current front row, but to be a genuine threat we need an impact prop. Plus we need another half who can be better than Wallace within a year to phase him out. Moylan will eventually end up there, but Soward cant play forever. So we need that someone else sooner rather than later.

Well yeah...unless they feel they are incrementally making the team better what is the point keeping players outside of your 17 for more than what the team perceives they are worth. Why would I keep Korisau for $300k per year as a back up hooker? Makes no sense...and you are eating into the cap when it shouldn't be. Now he wasn't on that with us but that's the offer he got from Souths so I assume it's that or more from Manly.

It's stupid to talk about the players you mentioned because NONE of them are in our top 17 and left here because they got good money to go...money that is more that you pay for a depth player.

We did recruit a prop. We got Kikau from Nth Qld who looks likely and pretty good. We may get another prop...who knows. No point really speculating. We also have good young prop in Stanton Albert who may be that impact player by next year.

A half is a trickier story...plenty of teams are looking for a great half but tbh there isn't many around. I know we have made a play for Cornish...whether it's good enough who knows...but we definitely have. But we also have Sam Scarlett and also Nathan Cleary who will be developing over next year or so. Who knows where we get to with halves too.

I trust Gus that he knows where we are short and he is scouring the globe to scout for good value with great talent.

We are losing Moss and maybe Simmo and we've brought in Heffernan from Raiders who they seem upset to be losing...so I trust Gus to manage the roster.

And it should be noted that the guys you have mentioned, aside from Korisau and to a lessor extent Masoe & K.Naiqama were nobodies when they came to us...and Cleary developed them into quality depth players. I trust they can do that with our youngsters and whoever we bring in to be that depth.

But tbh I think we reserve judgement until the end of the year when pretty much all is done and dusted as far as roster for next year.

 

[Panfas]

Well yeah...unless they feel they are incrementally making the team better what is the point keeping players outside of your 17 for more than what the team perceives they are worth. Why would I keep Korisau for $300k per year as a back up hooker? Makes no sense...and you are eating into the cap when it shouldn't be. Now he wasn't on that with us but that's the offer he got from Souths so I assume it's that or more from Manly.

It's stupid to talk about the players you mentioned because NONE of them are in our top 17 and left here because they got good money to go...money that is more that you pay for a depth player.

We did recruit a prop. We got Kikau from Nth Qld who looks likely and pretty good. We may get another prop...who knows. No point really speculating. We also have good young prop in Stanton Albert who may be that impact player by next year.

A half is a trickier story...plenty of teams are looking for a great half but tbh there isn't many around. I know we have made a play for Cornish...whether it's good enough who knows...but we definitely have. But we also have Sam Scarlett and also Nathan Cleary who will be developing over next year or so. Who knows where we get to with halves too.

I trust Gus that he knows where we are short and he is scouring the globe to scout for good value with great talent.

We are losing Moss and maybe Simmo and we've brought in Heffernan from Raiders who they seem upset to be losing...so I trust Gus to manage the roster.

And it should be noted that the guys you have mentioned, aside from Korisau and to a lessor extent Masoe & K.Naiqama were nobodies when they came to us...and Cleary developed them into quality depth players. I trust they can do that with our youngsters and whoever we bring in to be that depth.

But tbh I think we reserve judgement until the end of the year when pretty much all is done and dusted as far as roster for next year.

Well said Mick. Agree 100% as usual

 

[Luke Bowden]

Well yeah...unless they feel they are incrementally making the team better what is the point keeping players outside of your 17 for more than what the team perceives they are worth. Why would I keep Korisau for $300k per year as a back up hooker? Makes no sense...and you are eating into the cap when it shouldn't be. Now he wasn't on that with us but that's the offer he got from Souths so I assume it's that or more from Manly.

It's stupid to talk about the players you mentioned because NONE of them are in our top 17 and left here because they got good money to go...money that is more that you pay for a depth player.

We did recruit a prop. We got Kikau from Nth Qld who looks likely and pretty good. We may get another prop...who knows. No point really speculating. We also have good young prop in Stanton Albert who may be that impact player by next year.

A half is a trickier story...plenty of teams are looking for a great half but tbh there isn't many around. I know we have made a play for Cornish...whether it's good enough who knows...but we definitely have. But we also have Sam Scarlett and also Nathan Cleary who will be developing over next year or so. Who knows where we get to with halves too.

I trust Gus that he knows where we are short and he is scouring the globe to scout for good value with great talent.

We are losing Moss and maybe Simmo and we've brought in Heffernan from Raiders who they seem upset to be losing...so I trust Gus to manage the roster.

And it should be noted that the guys you have mentioned, aside from Korisau and to a lessor extent Masoe & K.Naiqama were nobodies when they came to us...and Cleary developed them into quality depth players. I trust they can do that with our youngsters and whoever we bring in to be that depth.

But tbh I think we reserve judgement until the end of the year when pretty much all is done and dusted as far as roster for next year.

I hope we get Cornish.

 

[mxlegend99]

Well yeah...unless they feel they are incrementally making the team better what is the point keeping players outside of your 17 for more than what the team perceives they are worth. Why would I keep Korisau for $300k per year as a back up hooker? Makes no sense...and you are eating into the cap when it shouldn't be. Now he wasn't on that with us but that's the offer he got from Souths so I assume it's that or more from Manly.
Why release a player from his modest contract to help another club? He would have been a bargain when we signed him. We release him to another club just as he is proving his value. Weakens us and strengthens a competitor.

It's stupid to talk about the players you mentioned because NONE of them are in our top 17 and left here because they got good money to go...money that is more that you pay for a depth player.
why release players early to other clubs when we can and do require them throughout the year? We saw how well it worked when we had a lot of young kids in place of experenced players this year. Why would next year be any different? We have less experienced depth so injuries will be felt a bit more.

We did recruit a prop. We got Kikau from Nth Qld who looks likely and pretty good. We may get another prop...who knows. No point really speculating. We also have good young prop in Stanton Albert who may be that impact player by next year.
We will wait and see. I remember being excited for Moses Pangai from the Cowboys. He was a beast but never kicked on with us. Likewise we recruited BMM, Latu and Anderson from other clubs and they only got called up when we were desperate. We haven't had a chance to see what they can be... or if they could be. Hopefully we sign a hidden gem.

A half is a trickier story...plenty of teams are looking for a great half but tbh there isn't many around. I know we have made a play for Cornish...whether it's good enough who knows...but we definitely have. But we also have Sam Scarlett and also Nathan Cleary who will be developing over next year or so. Who knows where we get to with halves too.
If we land Cornish or Hastings I would see that as a bigger step then these other recruits. An established half is out of the question, so those are our next best choices.

I trust Gus that he knows where we are short and he is scouring the globe to scout for good value with great talent.

We are losing Moss and maybe Simmo and we've brought in Heffernan from Raiders who they seem upset to be losing...so I trust Gus to manage the roster.
Heff just looks like another Will Smith. He might have a bit of talent, but he will likely be a utility fix it in lower grades and not really have a chance to push for a permanent first grade spot.

And it should be noted that the guys you have mentioned, aside from Korisau and to a lessor extent Masoe & K.Naiqama were nobodies when they came to us...and Cleary developed them into quality depth players. I trust they can do that with our youngsters and whoever we bring in to be that depth.
All 3 were developed before we got them. Korisau won a grand final, Mose played a heap of first grade for Roosters and Naiqama was Bennetts mr fix it at Newcastle. If anything he was worse when he was here then he was at Knights and now Tigers

But tbh I think we reserve judgement until the end of the year when pretty much all is done and dusted as far as roster for next year.
im happy to change my opinion as new signings come to light. Just as i have with new losses in Korisau and Brown. A month ago I'm sure most people thought we would keep Brown and not release Korisau. If we come out and sign a gun half or prop i am happy to change my opinion.

 

[mxlegend99]

Also I've been replying that way as it's easier on the phone to do bold text then snippets of quotes. Still a pain but it makes my arvo go by a bit quicker.

 

[Big Mick]

1. Korisau was still on good coin with us. He wasn't a bargain.

2. None of the players you mentioned aside from Korisau / Masoe were released early. Nabuli etc were all off contract. Naiqama I believe had an option and asked for a release. I see this as a moot point. We also may have needed the money otherwise we may not have retained who we did.

3. Pangai was nothing like Kikau. Firstly...totally different position. Secondly, Pangai had started at Raiders and went to the Cowboys with an attitude problem and laziness. Kikau from all reports works his ass off. He may be a hidden gem or he could be a role player we need. You wouldn't have said Latimore was any great signing when we got him but he's turned out pretty good.

4. Let's just see if we end up with a young half. Those guys may be out of our reach with Titans cashed up. But I do know we are looking.

5. If Heff is Will Smith...good. he'd be cheaper than Will and younger with more room to grow too. He may push for a FG Spot if he impresses in trials...who knows. Still very young

6. I said ASIDE from Korisau and lessor extent Masoe & Naiqama. Mose played FG for Roosters but was on the outer because of attitude...Cleary changed that. Naiqama came here because of a log jam and faced another logjam. So he left. But in that point I'm talking Docker, Robinson, Simpkins etc. Those guys who were no one when they came here and moulded them into depth role players.

7. I just think it's premature to go off when we don't know the whole picture yet. I also think it's unfair to compare this regime to the last. When was the last time we had our roster pretty much set half way through the year and only focusing on depth now? In Nov/Dec under previous regime we were signing players for first grade...totally different.

 

[betcats]

Mose was on the fringe of the roosters side when we signed. Matt Robinson is another who came here unheralded and we got good service out of. Isaac John couldnt make firsts in england when we signed him and last year played for the kiwis.