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Rumoured/Confirmed Signings 2011/2012

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Stagger eel

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Staff member
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65,641
He's a very good player but he's also a big name which means he'd want more money. I'd say his name's bigger than his ability at the moment. Just like Mortimer.

outside of Hopoate he's probably one of the best outside backs currently available which will make his price tag bigger than it should, I think Hodges and Boyd are also off contract but I would imagine that the futures would be sorted at Newcastle and Brisbane respectively
 

boxhead

First Grade
Messages
5,958
I wonder though, with Loko being brought up, are we looking to sign just one quality centre and one quality winger? Or two centres/two wingers?
I'd expect at least three players to definitely be in the back-line next year; Hayne, Burt and Sandow. That leaves two open centre positions, a wing spot and a five-eighth spot.
Getting just one of Champion/Hopoate/Lafai in the centres would do me. Folau is the pipe-dream :D
Seeing as we are looking at Hopoate as a centre (from reports), I'd expect the real contentious area we don't know about in regards to recruitment options is the other wing spot.
 
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Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
88,785
I wonder though, with Loko being brought up, are we looking to sign just one quality centre and one quality winger? Or two centres/two wingers?
I'd expect at least three players to definitely be in the back-line next year; Hayne, Burt and Sandow. That leaves two open centre positions, a wing spot and a five-eighth spot.
Getting just one of Champion/Hopoate/Lafai in the centres would do me. Folau is the pipe-dream :D
Seeing as we are looking at Hopoate as a centre (from reports), I'd expect the real contentious area we don't know about in regards to recruitment options is the other wing spot.

I think the idea is to sign players with a view to being able to tell them where they'll be playing - you can't just sign a bunch of guys and tell them they'll be fighting for a spot, because most of them won't come.

So at this stage I'd say these are the incumbents for next year:

1. Hayne
2. Burt
6. Mortimer
7. Sandow

We can say what we like about Burt and Mortimer - that there are better options available and that we could replace them as early as next year - but the fact is they're contracted next year, they'll be counted under the salary cap next year, therefore we may as well play them next year and not waste cap money making them redundant.

I'm certain Burt won't be retained after his contract expires, and if he doesn't improve, neither will Mortimer. But next year they're both still here so I'd say they'll both start unless somebody already at the club forces them out of their spot. But we won't be recruiting to replace them. Not with a salary cap to think about.

So that leaves a winger and 2 centres.

Kearney might be assuming that one of Loko or Morgan will tie a centre spot up by the end of the year - Morgan is safer but Loko could be anything. Anyway, both will probably still be here next year, either to keep fighting for a spot or just to provide depth.

We've also still got Walker, Atkins and Uaisele next year, and we've signed Vaivai. Then you've got guys like Filiga and Sio - who knows what will happen with them. If they're still contracted for next year they'll at least play for Wenty.

Off-contract are Reddy, Hicks and Whatuira. We know Phats is gone. Even if he stays for the rest of the year he won't be retained. Hicks would have to be in the same boat. I'd say if we don't get Hopoate we'll probably keep Reddy. If we get Hopoate we mightn't be able to pay Reddy as much as he wants and he'll (probably) leave. I'd be very surprised if we chased Champion, and if we did get him I'm sure Reddy wouldn't be retained.

At this stage these are the outside backs contracted for next year (alphabetically and not including fullbacks):

Atkins
Burt
Loko
Morgan
Uaisele
Vaivai
Walker

That's seven blokes. For a top 25 you wouldn't want to carry much more than seven outside backs. One or more of them could also cover for Hayne at fullback. I'd say we're looking at signing one more outside back, tops.

I reckon it all depends on Hopoate. If he signs with us then Reddy's gone. If he doesn't then we'll probably offer Reddy what he wants. Of course Reddy and his manager won't be happy with having to wait for Hopoate to decide, which is why they're making noise in the media. Fair play to them. In the off chance we miss Hopoate and Reddy signs elsewhere then we probbaly will chase Champion, unless he's already signed somewhere else.

But if we sign Reddy or Champion then we should forget about Hopoate because we'll have too much salary cap tied up in outside backs. I'm certain we're only looking for one more for next year's squad.

In that case the backs look like this for next year:

1. Hayne
2. Burt
3. Hopoate/Reddy/Champion
4. Loko/Morgan/Walker/Vaivai
5. Whoever's left over

There's also the chance we'll miss out on all three of Hopoate, Reddy or Champion. That's the risk you take I guess.

In that case Loko, Morgan, Walker and Vaivai will probably fight for two centre spots and we'll find somebody else to fill the squad out - somebody like Joe Tomane, Esi Tonga or Bronx Goodwin. Tomane and Tonga would also be options at centre.

Of the other outside backs off contract, there's Justin Hodges, who is probably the second-best centre in the game. I'd be surprised if he wanted less than $400k which puts him out of our price range - with three players on $350k+ we don't need another one.

There's also Jharal Yow Yeh. He's an international now, and soon will be an Origin player. He's probably asking more than we'd be willing to pay though. He's as good a winger as Hopoate but without the versatility - we're chasing Hopoate as a centre or even as a fullback if Hayne tries to bankrupt us when his contract's up.

Other off-contract outside backs who would be certain starters are Junior Sa'u and the Williams brothers (David and Tony) from Manly. Bear in mind, Manly are probably waiting for Hopoate's decision as well, before re-signing their other outside backs. It's a bit of a merry-go-round.

These three would want first-grade money and only Junior Sa'u is a first grade quality centre, which is what we need. He'd only really be an option if we missed on on Hopoate and Reddy. Sa'u and Champion are probably plan C. Or they could be plan B with the re-signing of Reddy being plan C. If that's the case it's no wonder Reddy is unhappy.

One thing for sure is that Hopoate is plan A and everything else hinges on him. I wonder what kind of deadline the club has allowed, and if Hopoate's management has been made aware of it.

Either way, we're almost certainly allowing for one centre spot to be filled by one of the guys already contracted here next year - there's too many in the squad for them to all be back-ups.

That leaves the other centre spot open to somebody on $200k or more - Hopoate, Reddy or someone else.

I don't think we're really looking for wingers; we have enough guys in the squad who can fight for one of the spots, and Burt is certainly keeping his position until his contract's up. That, along with his injury issues, rules David Williams out.

Tony Williams is probably a wing option but only because he can also play in the wide back-row spot.
 

caylo

Bench
Messages
4,870
I think the idea is to sign players with a view to being able to tell them where they'll be playing - you can't just sign a bunch of guys and tell them they'll be fighting for a spot, because most of them won't come.

So at this stage I'd say these are the incumbents for next year:

1. Hayne
2. Burt
6. Mortimer
7. Sandow

We can say what we like about Burt and Mortimer - that there are better options available and that we could replace them as early as next year - but the fact is they're contracted next year, they'll be counted under the salary cap next year, therefore we may as well play them next year and not waste cap money making them redundant.

I'm certain Burt won't be retained after his contract expires, and if he doesn't improve, neither will Mortimer. But next year they're both still here so I'd say they'll both start unless somebody already at the club forces them out of their spot. But we won't be recruiting to replace them. Not with a salary cap to think about.

So that leaves a winger and 2 centres.

Kearney might be assuming that one of Loko or Morgan will tie a centre spot up by the end of the year - Morgan is safer but Loko could be anything. Anyway, both will probably still be here next year, either to keep fighting for a spot or just to provide depth.

We've also still got Walker, Atkins and Uaisele next year, and we've signed Vaivai. Then you've got guys like Filiga and Sio - who knows what will happen with them. If they're still contracted for next year they'll at least play for Wenty.

Off-contract are Reddy, Hicks and Whatuira. We know Phats is gone. Even if he stays for the rest of the year he won't be retained. Hicks would have to be in the same boat. I'd say if we don't get Hopoate we'll probably keep Reddy. If we get Hopoate we mightn't be able to pay Reddy as much as he wants and he'll (probably) leave. I'd be very surprised if we chased Champion, and if we did get him I'm sure Reddy wouldn't be retained.

At this stage these are the outside backs contracted for next year (alphabetically and not including fullbacks):

Atkins
Burt
Loko
Morgan
Uaisele
Vaivai
Walker

That's seven blokes. For a top 25 you wouldn't want to carry much more than seven outside backs. One or more of them could also cover for Hayne at fullback. I'd say we're looking at signing one more outside back, tops.

I reckon it all depends on Hopoate. If he signs with us then Reddy's gone. If he doesn't then we'll probably offer Reddy what he wants. Of course Reddy and his manager won't be happy with having to wait for Hopoate to decide, which is why they're making noise in the media. Fair play to them. In the off chance we miss Hopoate and Reddy signs elsewhere then we probbaly will chase Champion, unless he's already signed somewhere else.

But if we sign Reddy or Champion then we should forget about Hopoate because we'll have too much salary cap tied up in outside backs. I'm certain we're only looking for one more for next year's squad.

In that case the backs look like this for next year:

1. Hayne
2. Burt
3. Hopoate/Reddy/Champion
4. Loko/Morgan/Walker/Vaivai
5. Whoever's left over

There's also the chance we'll miss out on all three of Hopoate, Reddy or Champion. That's the risk you take I guess.

In that case Loko, Morgan, Walker and Vaivai will probably fight for two centre spots and we'll find somebody else to fill the squad out - somebody like Joe Tomane, Esi Tonga or Bronx Goodwin. Tomane and Tonga would also be options at centre.

Of the other outside backs off contract, there's Justin Hodges, who is probably the second-best centre in the game. I'd be surprised if he wanted less than $400k which puts him out of our price range - with three players on $350k+ we don't need another one.

There's also Jharal Yow Yeh. He's an international now, and soon will be an Origin player. He's probably asking more than we'd be willing to pay though. He's as good a winger as Hopoate but without the versatility - we're chasing Hopoate as a centre or even as a fullback if Hayne tries to bankrupt us when his contract's up.

Other off-contract outside backs who would be certain starters are Junior Sa'u and the Williams brothers (David and Tony) from Manly. Bear in mind, Manly are probably waiting for Hopoate's decision as well, before re-signing their other outside backs. It's a bit of a merry-go-round.

These three would want first-grade money and only Junior Sa'u is a first grade quality centre, which is what we need. He'd only really be an option if we missed on on Hopoate and Reddy. Sa'u and Champion are probably plan C. Or they could be plan B with the re-signing of Reddy being plan C. If that's the case it's no wonder Reddy is unhappy.

One thing for sure is that Hopoate is plan A and everything else hinges on him. I wonder what kind of deadline the club has allowed, and if Hopoate's management has been made aware of it.

Either way, we're almost certainly allowing for one centre spot to be filled by one of the guys already contracted here next year - there's too many in the squad for them to all be back-ups.

That leaves the other centre spot open to somebody on $200k or more - Hopoate, Reddy or someone else.

I don't think we're really looking for wingers; we have enough guys in the squad who can fight for one of the spots, and Burt is certainly keeping his position until his contract's up. That, along with his injury issues, rules David Williams out.

Tony Williams is probably a wing option but only because he can also play in the wide back-row spot.

The way SK talks about Loko is he is in the team more for next year. I see it as

1 Hayne
2 Burt
3 Loko
4
5
6
7 Sandow

Now for the winger and centre options we have at the club nest year (or likely atleast): Morgan, Sio, T.Jennings, Atkines, Walker(??), Filiga and Vaivai. Now we will probably look atleast to sign one experienced player esp if we are losing Reddy but no more then one. They may look to pick up some jnr players to fill in for depth that can also press for a spot.

The 5-8 is still up for grabs, Mortimer has done nothing to suggest he is capable of holding that spot down and if he doesn't improve I highly doubt he will be here next year irrespective of the $$.

Current possible options for next year are: Mortz, Robson, Humble, Murray, Webhe and Babar. Now those choices don't look flash to say the least so they may invest in a cheap option like Roberts or a jnr who has performed well but the person to wear the #6 jersey is the one that performs the best. At the moment its still wide open.

If you think there is 600K-1mil under the cap remaining I imagine they will look to pick up Hoppa (275-300K), a backrower (Dwyer) and a cheap 5-8 (maybe if affordable).
 

Binga

Juniors
Messages
576
Joeseph Tomane and Esi Tonga are both off contract at the titans. Would both be worthwhile presuing IMO.
 

Joshuatheeel

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
19,907
I think the idea is to sign players with a view to being able to tell them where they'll be playing - you can't just sign a bunch of guys and tell them they'll be fighting for a spot, because most of them won't come.

So at this stage I'd say these are the incumbents for next year:

1. Hayne
2. Burt
6. Mortimer
7. Sandow

We can say what we like about Burt and Mortimer - that there are better options available and that we could replace them as early as next year - but the fact is they're contracted next year, they'll be counted under the salary cap next year, therefore we may as well play them next year and not waste cap money making them redundant.

I'm certain Burt won't be retained after his contract expires, and if he doesn't improve, neither will Mortimer. But next year they're both still here so I'd say they'll both start unless somebody already at the club forces them out of their spot. But we won't be recruiting to replace them. Not with a salary cap to think about.

So that leaves a winger and 2 centres.

Kearney might be assuming that one of Loko or Morgan will tie a centre spot up by the end of the year - Morgan is safer but Loko could be anything. Anyway, both will probably still be here next year, either to keep fighting for a spot or just to provide depth.

We've also still got Walker, Atkins and Uaisele next year, and we've signed Vaivai. Then you've got guys like Filiga and Sio - who knows what will happen with them. If they're still contracted for next year they'll at least play for Wenty.

Off-contract are Reddy, Hicks and Whatuira. We know Phats is gone. Even if he stays for the rest of the year he won't be retained. Hicks would have to be in the same boat. I'd say if we don't get Hopoate we'll probably keep Reddy. If we get Hopoate we mightn't be able to pay Reddy as much as he wants and he'll (probably) leave. I'd be very surprised if we chased Champion, and if we did get him I'm sure Reddy wouldn't be retained.

At this stage these are the outside backs contracted for next year (alphabetically and not including fullbacks):

Atkins
Burt
Loko
Morgan
Uaisele
Vaivai
Walker

That's seven blokes. For a top 25 you wouldn't want to carry much more than seven outside backs. One or more of them could also cover for Hayne at fullback. I'd say we're looking at signing one more outside back, tops.

I reckon it all depends on Hopoate. If he signs with us then Reddy's gone. If he doesn't then we'll probably offer Reddy what he wants. Of course Reddy and his manager won't be happy with having to wait for Hopoate to decide, which is why they're making noise in the media. Fair play to them. In the off chance we miss Hopoate and Reddy signs elsewhere then we probbaly will chase Champion, unless he's already signed somewhere else.

But if we sign Reddy or Champion then we should forget about Hopoate because we'll have too much salary cap tied up in outside backs. I'm certain we're only looking for one more for next year's squad.

In that case the backs look like this for next year:

1. Hayne
2. Burt
3. Hopoate/Reddy/Champion
4. Loko/Morgan/Walker/Vaivai
5. Whoever's left over

There's also the chance we'll miss out on all three of Hopoate, Reddy or Champion. That's the risk you take I guess.

In that case Loko, Morgan, Walker and Vaivai will probably fight for two centre spots and we'll find somebody else to fill the squad out - somebody like Joe Tomane, Esi Tonga or Bronx Goodwin. Tomane and Tonga would also be options at centre.

Of the other outside backs off contract, there's Justin Hodges, who is probably the second-best centre in the game. I'd be surprised if he wanted less than $400k which puts him out of our price range - with three players on $350k+ we don't need another one.

There's also Jharal Yow Yeh. He's an international now, and soon will be an Origin player. He's probably asking more than we'd be willing to pay though. He's as good a winger as Hopoate but without the versatility - we're chasing Hopoate as a centre or even as a fullback if Hayne tries to bankrupt us when his contract's up.

Other off-contract outside backs who would be certain starters are Junior Sa'u and the Williams brothers (David and Tony) from Manly. Bear in mind, Manly are probably waiting for Hopoate's decision as well, before re-signing their other outside backs. It's a bit of a merry-go-round.

These three would want first-grade money and only Junior Sa'u is a first grade quality centre, which is what we need. He'd only really be an option if we missed on on Hopoate and Reddy. Sa'u and Champion are probably plan C. Or they could be plan B with the re-signing of Reddy being plan C. If that's the case it's no wonder Reddy is unhappy.

One thing for sure is that Hopoate is plan A and everything else hinges on him. I wonder what kind of deadline the club has allowed, and if Hopoate's management has been made aware of it.

Either way, we're almost certainly allowing for one centre spot to be filled by one of the guys already contracted here next year - there's too many in the squad for them to all be back-ups.

That leaves the other centre spot open to somebody on $200k or more - Hopoate, Reddy or someone else.

I don't think we're really looking for wingers; we have enough guys in the squad who can fight for one of the spots, and Burt is certainly keeping his position until his contract's up. That, along with his injury issues, rules David Williams out.

Tony Williams is probably a wing option but only because he can also play in the wide back-row spot.


I wouldn't mind Tony and David Williams. Tony has the ability to play in the backs and forwards which gives us some flexibility, plus in he is now in the stage of his career where he could be considered an experience NRL regular and he wouldn't cost the world. He would add some nice depth to the squad for the backs and forwards.

David Williams while he has had injury problems also would not cost the world, but is also a very good winger who can play centre. I am thinking he wouldn't cost more then we offered Duffie maybe a little less. He is due for some luck regarding injuries.

In fact chasing Hopoate is a win win situation we offer a very good contract thus manly need to match thus they would have less money to spend on signing the two Williams. In fact I think we could almost sign both Williams for the dollars we offer hopoate and I reckon they would be a better option. While Hopoate looks like a very good player in the making just have some concerns with offer a rookie with less then 10 games the rumoured amount of 300k to 350k, a little to much may be.

PS FYI they are not brothers
 

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
88,785
The way SK talks about Loko is he is in the team more for next year.

Yeah I think so. I'd say he has a spot tied up for next year even if he doesn't stay in first grade for all of this year.

He's only going to get better.

Now for the winger and centre options we have at the club nest year (or likely atleast): Morgan, Sio, T.Jennings, Atkines, Walker(??), Filiga and Vaivai.

Are you sure Filiga and Sio are contracted after this year? Because if they're not I doubt they'll be offered renewals. Wenty might offer them something, which I guess makes them second-tier options.

You've also left out Uaisele and Walker who are both definitely contracted for next year.

Don't discount the importance of a contract - it's a legally binding document that also directly affects the salary cap. If a player's contracted he'll be here next year. If a player's off contract and there's already enough blokes at his position then he won't be re-signed unless he's a guaranteed starter in the NRL team.

Now we will probably look atleast to sign one experienced player esp if we are losing Reddy but no more then one. They may look to pick up some jnr players to fill in for depth that can also press for a spot.

Yeah that's what I said. If we don't get someone better we'll re-sign Reddy. If we do get someone better then Reddy will be released.

The 5-8 is still up for grabs, Mortimer has done nothing to suggest he is capable of holding that spot down and if he doesn't improve I highly doubt he will be here next year irrespective of the $$.

I'm certain he'll be here next year because he's under contract. If we f**k him off his contract still counts under the salary cap. If another club picks him up then we'd still have to pay the difference and it would count under the cap.

He'll still be here next year. After that who knows.

Current possible options for next year are: Mortz, Robson, Humble, Murray, Webhe and Babar. Now those choices don't look flash to say the least so they may invest in a cheap option like Roberts or a jnr who has performed well but the person to wear the #6 jersey is the one that performs the best. At the moment its still wide open.

That's also what I said - if Morts is replaced it will be by somebody already at the club. If none of them can do it now then there's no reason any of them will be able to do it next year - any physical growth by the juniors will be matched by Morts, who will still only be 22 at the start of next season.

And physical growth notwithstanding, I doubt Tom Humble will still be here next year.

You need four halves in your top 25 and we'll have Sandow, Mortimer and Murray. The fourth could be Robson if he's willing to stay or it could be one of the NYC players. Are any of Bruest, Wehbe or Barba too old for NYC next year? If so they're a candidate. I know Barba just re-signed so they've obviously got plans for him - either another year in NYC or as a top 25 backup at either fullback or the halves.

If you think there is 600K-1mil under the cap remaining

With all the guys off contract for next year it could be even more than that. It depends how much of this year's spare cap was taken up with front-loaded contract extensions.

I imagine they will look to pick up Hoppa (275-300K)

We know they're after Hopoate and they probably won't make any other recruitment/retention decisions until he makes up his mind.

a backrower (Dwyer)

We do need a back-rower but I'm certain Dwyer's still under contract. It's a shame because he's excellent. Adam Blair would be perfect but he's surely asking for too much money. Tony Williams would be a good option to bring off the bench, but for the money he's probably asking we want a guy who defends well or can play 80 minutes. There's also Sika Manu and Todd Lowrie off contract.

and a cheap 5-8 (maybe if affordable).

I doubt we'll sign any more halves for next year. There's Mortimer and Murray, and Sandow on his way. With Robson and Humble off contract, there's only really room for one more. I'll be amazed if Humble is retained. That leaves Robson, if he wants to hang around as a backup. There's also whichever of the NYC halves is too old for Toyota Cup next year, if the club wants to hang onto any of them.

It probably depends on what we're doing for hookers. McGuire and Mitchell are both off contract and I doubt Mitchell will be retained. Robson might also be a hooker option but you'd think Kearney will go for specialist dummy-halves, although blokes who can play both are ideal squad players. You want no more than 6 halves/hookers in your 25 man squad - a couple of really versatile players, or an 80 minute starting hooker, can drop that to 5 in the squad.
 

caylo

Bench
Messages
4,870
Yeah I think so. I'd say he has a spot tied up for next year even if he doesn't stay in first grade for all of this year.

He's only going to get better.



Are you sure Filiga and Sio are contracted after this year? Because if they're not I doubt they'll be offered renewals. Wenty might offer them something, which I guess makes them second-tier options.

You've also left out Uaisele and Walker who are both definitely contracted for next year.

Don't discount the importance of a contract - it's a legally binding document that also directly affects the salary cap. If a player's contracted he'll be here next year. If a player's off contract and there's already enough blokes at his position then he won't be re-signed unless he's a guaranteed starter in the NRL team.



Yeah that's what I said. If we don't get someone better we'll re-sign Reddy. If we do get someone better then Reddy will be released.



I'm certain he'll be here next year because he's under contract. If we f**k him off his contract still counts under the salary cap. If another club picks him up then we'd still have to pay the difference and it would count under the cap.

He'll still be here next year. After that who knows.



That's also what I said - if Morts is replaced it will be by somebody already at the club. If none of them can do it now then there's no reason any of them will be able to do it next year - any physical growth by the juniors will be matched by Morts, who will still only be 22 at the start of next season.

And physical growth notwithstanding, I doubt Tom Humble will still be here next year.

You need four halves in your top 25 and we'll have Sandow, Mortimer and Murray. The fourth could be Robson if he's willing to stay or it could be one of the NYC players. Are any of Bruest, Wehbe or Barba too old for NYC next year? If so they're a candidate. I know Barba just re-signed so they've obviously got plans for him - either another year in NYC or as a top 25 backup at either fullback or the halves.



With all the guys off contract for next year it could be even more than that. It depends how much of this year's spare cap was taken up with front-loaded contract extensions.



We know they're after Hopoate and they probably won't make any other recruitment/retention decisions until he makes up his mind.



We do need a back-rower but I'm certain Dwyer's still under contract. It's a shame because he's excellent. Adam Blair would be perfect but he's surely asking for too much money. Tony Williams would be a good option to bring off the bench, but for the money he's probably asking we want a guy who defends well or can play 80 minutes. There's also Sika Manu and Todd Lowrie off contract.



I doubt we'll sign any more halves for next year. There's Mortimer and Murray, and Sandow on his way. With Robson and Humble off contract, there's only really room for one more. I'll be amazed if Humble is retained. That leaves Robson, if he wants to hang around as a backup. There's also whichever of the NYC halves is too old for Toyota Cup next year, if the club wants to hang onto any of them.

It probably depends on what we're doing for hookers. McGuire and Mitchell are both off contract and I doubt Mitchell will be retained. Robson might also be a hooker option but you'd think Kearney will go for specialist dummy-halves, although blokes who can play both are ideal squad players. You want no more than 6 halves/hookers in your 25 man squad - a couple of really versatile players, or an 80 minute starting hooker, can drop that to 5 in the squad.

First sorry I forgot at Etu, add him to the list and I mentioned walker with a ? because i was unsure of his status. Filiga and Sio both are off contract this year but I think both would probably stay under 2nd teir contracts but that stuff isnt usually determined until very late hence why i said probably not certain.

For the halves, humble would probably stay if he ever gets on the field. They would defiantly keep him over Robson IMO but realistically they need a cheaper option, you say there is no room but NRL squads often consist of 35 players and in ther atleast 4-5 halves and 2-3 hookers. If we lose Mitchell and Robson as reported and keep humble that leaves us with 3 NRL experienced halves and 2 NRL experienced hooker. Bruest, Wehbe and Barba will still be eligible for NYC so wouldnt count and thus you have room for at least one half but they would have to be relatively cheep because of Sandow's price tag.

I personally was under the impression Dwyer was off contract this year but I may very well be wrong, IMO we need a wide running backrower because Smith, Horo and Lasalo are all to inconsistent ATM. Tony Williams is no backrower, he is the laziest footballer on the planet IMO, i would prefer to persist with what we have now.
 

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
88,785
I wouldn't mind Tony and David Williams. Tony has the ability to play in the backs and forwards which gives us some flexibility, plus in he is now in the stage of his career where he could be considered an experience NRL regular and he wouldn't cost the world. He would add some nice depth to the squad for the backs and forwards.

I reckon he would be after more money than he's worth. He's a player with obvious strengths and glaring weaknesses - those kinds players are never worth as much as they think they are. Look at Feleti Mateo.

David Williams while he has had injury problems also would not cost the world, but is also a very good winger who can play centre. I am thinking he wouldn't cost more then we offered Duffie maybe a little less. He is due for some luck regarding injuries.

Are you kidding? He's played for NSW and Australia. He will want what he was worth when he was at his peak and playing without injury. We will want to pay him little enough that it's not too much of a waste if he gets injured again. I'd say any offers he gets will either be incentive-based or will include club-options after the first year.

In fact chasing Hopoate is a win win situation we offer a very good contract thus manly need to match thus they would have less money to spend on signing the two Williams.

Well it is win-win but it's no different to how every off-contract player affects his existing club - this isn't anything new. Clubs with too many good players invariably have to lose some of them to the clubs with not enough good players.

That's the beauty of the salary cap; you can't keep all your players and so some are forced out. It happens to every club, even Melbourne.

In fact I think we could almost sign both Williams for the dollars we offer hopoate and I reckon they would be a better option.

I'd say at this stage they would want over $200k each, while Hopoate would probably stay at Manly for about $50k less than we're offering him. And I reckon we'd be offering him no more than $300k.

Like I said, there are very few clubs who would want to pay either of the Williams brothers what they'd be asking. They might get $200k from some club desperate enough because on their day they're both very good players. Their issues are Tony's defence and David's history of injury. Personally I'd only take Tony and use him as a wide back-rower. But not at the amount he'd be asking for.

Honestly, if the club were truly desperate to pay overs for blokes we'd have a lot more signings already. Sandow was a necessity and now I think we'll look for value in new signings. Hopoate at $300k might still be good value. It's really hard to guess what he's worth because he's obviously going to be a superstar but he's only played a handful of first grade in his life. It comes down to what his manager has convinced him his value is.

While Hopoate looks like a very good player in the making just have some concerns with offer a rookie with less then 10 games the rumoured amount of 300k to 350k, a little to much may be.

Yeah exactly. Manly's a well-run club and if they were willing to throw overs at blokes they would have re-signed Hopoate already. I get the feeling we've tightened our belts as well and I wouldn't be surprised if another club didn't end up signing him. Whoever gets him will want him to sign for four years or more because they'll probably be paying massive overs for the first year - at his age and level of experience he's still got plenty of shit games left in him.

PS FYI they are not brothers

I'm pretty sure they are. :lol:
 

Joshuatheeel

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I reckon he would be after more money than he's worth. He's a player with obvious strengths and glaring weaknesses - those kinds players are never worth as much as they think they are. Look at Feleti Mateo.



Are you kidding? He's played for NSW and Australia. He will want what he was worth when he was at his peak and playing without injury. We will want to pay him little enough that it's not too much of a waste if he gets injured again. I'd say any offers he gets will either be incentive-based or will include club-options after the first year.



Well it is win-win but it's no different to how every off-contract player affects his existing club - this isn't anything new. Clubs with too many good players invariably have to lose some of them to the clubs with not enough good players.

That's the beauty of the salary cap; you can't keep all your players and so some are forced out. It happens to every club, even Melbourne.



I'd say at this stage they would want over $200k each, while Hopoate would probably stay at Manly for about $50k less than we're offering him. And I reckon we'd be offering him no more than $300k.

Like I said, there are very few clubs who would want to pay either of the Williams brothers what they'd be asking. They might get $200k from some club desperate enough because on their day they're both very good players. Their issues are Tony's defence and David's history of injury. Personally I'd only take Tony and use him as a wide back-rower. But not at the amount he'd be asking for.

Honestly, if the club were truly desperate to pay overs for blokes we'd have a lot more signings already. Sandow was a necessity and now I think we'll look for value in new signings. Hopoate at $300k might still be good value. It's really hard to guess what he's worth because he's obviously going to be a superstar but he's only played a handful of first grade in his life. It comes down to what his manager has convinced him his value is.



Yeah exactly. Manly's a well-run club and if they were willing to throw overs at blokes they would have re-signed Hopoate already. I get the feeling we've tightened our belts as well and I wouldn't be surprised if another club didn't end up signing him. Whoever gets him will want him to sign for four years or more because they'll probably be paying massive overs for the first year - at his age and level of experience he's still got plenty of shit games left in him.



I'm pretty sure they are. :lol:

The Williams may want 200k or more, but there has to be a market for them to get this and I don't think there will a lot of clubs chasing them. So they will have to accept what they are offered. No to sure if we would need to offer them more then Manly to get them to come over considering bith are Eels juniors. In fact there was a rumour late last year Tony Williams wanted to come back but negotiations didn't work out. Also on Tony in depends what Manly can offer in regards to a top 17 stop. He may find it easy to get a start with the eels then Manly - I see he is on an extended bench for this week.
 
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Poupou Escobar

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The Williams may want 200k or more, but there has to be a market for them to get this and I don't think there will a lot of clubs chasing them.

I agree, any off-contract player may have to accept less than he initially wanted if none of the clubs value him at that amount.

But until the off-contract player gets an offer that matches his self-valuation he will probably hold out, which is surely hapening with a lot of off-contract players at the moment. While there are so many of them still unsigned they know the clubs have a lot to spend. As more players sign or re-sign with clubs, it will have a snowball effect as players realise the clubs have less money left and then it shifts from a seller's market to a buyer's market. That's when you get guys cheap.

But until then only the most in-demand players will be making their moves. Everybody else will be watching and waiting.

So they will have to accept what they are offered. No to sure if we would need to offer them more then Manly to get them to come over considering bith are Eels juniors.

No I don't think we will either, but for Hopoate I think he'll stay at Manly for less because of the family connection, plus I assume he grew up in the area.

It doesn't mean we won't get him - we have a lot more room to move than Manly.

In fact there was a rumour late last year Tony Williams wanted to come back but negotiations didn't work out. Also on Tony in depends what Manly can offer in regards to a top 17 stop. He may find it easy to get a start with the eels then Manly - I see he is on an extended bench for this week.

Agreed, players go to clubs for opportunity as well as money. Regarding Hopoate, we can offer him the chance to play centre (and the money to match) while Manly have fullback and both centre spots tied up (Stewart, Lyon and Matai). Therefore they've already committed most of their budget for those three positions.
 

caylo

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Yeah that's right. And by that logic Tony and John Williams are brothers too.

It is possible to have more than one brother. The Williams triplets are proof of that.

I hope your joking because I cant tell you for a fact that David and Tony are not brothers, I played footy with David at high school and against Tony at club level.

On another note, at the end of 2009 I was talking to Tony Williams at Roxy a few days after our Semi final win. I asked him if he was still living in the area and he told me he was and was hoping to come back because he missed playing with his mates, he had also gone out with the boys after their semi final win.

I'm unsure of how much Tony could command but considering both Tony and David have struggled to get back into the Sea Eagles 17 I doubt they could command much more then 150K. Tony's deal with the Sea Eagles was 180K and he may want an upgrade but for 150-180K I'm sure he would come back to parra if it was equal to other offer esp considering he still lives in the area.
 

caylo

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Also Tony and David are not even slightly related. Tony is of Fijian decent and David is as white as they get.
 
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