Rumours and Stuff

[Gary Gutful]

Of course their used, but primarily everyone has their own use for them, but primarily its about seeing what everyone achieved individually, but what does an individual stat mean if their is no benchmark to compare it against.

Like a hooker made 32 tackles in a match, but how do you know that stat is high or low if you don't start with a benchmark.

You previously said:

"So the premise of my original argument is that who cares about statistics of players and the team if you win games."

I told you "coaches do" which you appear to have accepted.

But now you've said they are useless without a benchmark. Thanks mate, really insightful.

Why the f**k would anyone use stats and not have a benchmark or goal that they are comparing it against? Why are you even raising that as a point?

I think you just like arguing for the sake of arguing.

 

[Gary Gutful]

Why, because it will tell me coaches use stats for various reasons...which i already indicated was the case.

You begrudgingly acknowledged it after someone else pointed it out.

Just like the "Team on Paper", stats don't always make you win.

Why would you think that coaches using stats are doing it because they think it will "always make them win"?

Pretty sure that even Ricky Stuart isn't that stupid. He knows it is a useful tool to have it his disposal.

Again, how do you arrive at such weird places in these discussions?

 

[Gary Gutful]

Funny, I've been able to sum up in two sentences what you've been unable to communicate in the last three pages of the thread.

Nope. You definitely did not.

 

[Barry O'Speedwagon]

That says to me possession is nearly 50/50 across the league. Games are won or lost because of a combination of reasons not just on possesion alone.

Obviously. But nobody made that argument. Not hard to kick down a paper tiger.

 

[hineyrulz]

I know Popcorn and butter isn't good for breakfast what the hey!!

Enjoyable read from last night lads

 

[Gary Gutful]

I know Popcorn and butter isn't good for breakfast what the hey!!

Enjoyable read from last night lads

That's not butter.

 

[hineyrulz]

That's not butter.

Ewwwwwwwwwww!!

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Obviously. But nobody made that argument. Not hard to kick down a paper tiger.

You know what is hard to kick down though? A robot dog:

 

[Chipmunk]

You previously said:

"So the premise of my original argument is that who cares about statistics of players and the team if you win games."

I told you "coaches do" which you appear to have accepted.

But now you've said they are useless without a benchmark. Thanks mate, really insightful.

Why the f**k would anyone use stats and not have a benchmark or goal that they are comparing it against? Why are you even raising that as a point?

I think you just like arguing for the sake of arguing.

You begrudgingly acknowledged it after someone else pointed it out.


Why would you think that coaches using stats are doing it because they think it will "always make them win"?

Pretty sure that even Ricky Stuart isn't that stupid. He knows it is a useful tool to have it his disposal.

Again, how do you arrive at such weird places in these discussions?

The real question is what were you doing up at 3,30am?

 

[Gary Gutful]

The real question is what were you doing up at 3,30am?

I had a bad case of syphilis and was very itchy in the pantaloon region.

 

[84 Baby]

Don't lie Gary. You were up watching the Home Shopping Network

 

[Glenneel]

For a bloke crowing about how simple the game was a few minutes ago you've certainly flipped to hypotheticals in a hurry.

Why is Josh Hodgson considered a better hooker than Cam King if his team wins fewer games?

Based on stats Hodgson is probably better than Cam Smith, but of the two who would you have in your team. You see its not all about stats, other intangibles determine how good a player is.

 

[Glenneel]

My argument was that stats don't always tell the full story and that you can come up with any stat to suit your argument, not what your suggesting above, which I never actually ever inferred. Pou always uses cherry picked stats to prove a point, but ignores stats that put holes in his argument.

The only stat I'm interested in is how many times the teams wins. So far in NRL the team has won 100% with King at dh, a better STAT than any other hooker btw.

 

[Glenneel]

W

I Think Sixties or Forty might be able to answer this question best.

In my opinion that's a massive wrap on the kid to be even compared to the likes of Cameron Smith, but without putting to much pressure on him his still only 17yo.
Iv watched him play numerous times. His a decent size 9 nearly 6" foot tall 84kg.
He seems very mature and a composed kid. Can pass, Great kicking game, Awesome defender, Prob needs to run a little more.
But the kids seems like a natural leader, Captain Harold matts 2017 state & national championships. Captain Nsw u16s 2016 origin. Captain Parra SG Ball 2017 to state and national championships a year young. Made Nsw u18s origin a year young. Played Nsw u18s Chs 2017 national school boys champs, and was captain of them a year young and just made Australian school boys a year young.
Yet he can do all that again next year 2018

Not sure when his contacted to but at present seems to be ticking the boxes. From reports He is the best trainer, Works hard, born leader.
Hopefuly he continues to develop his game and who knows what the future holds.
Scary thing is,
Iv been informed he has only been playing hooker for 2 years so there is so much more improvement in his game yet he is still making these rep teams in a position that is new to him.

Reed Mahoney looks great in the u20s
Reed is a complete hooker, Running game, Speed, Great Defender, Astute Kicking game and is very smart player.
Reed has all the potential in the world to kick on and play in the NRL

My only worry is his size, He is not a big kid, but what he lacks in size he makes up in other areas.
Would love top see how he goes in Nsw cup.
But I wish this kid all the very best as id love to see him succeed .

Why the emphasis on size, both Slater and Cam Smith were small, still are. Same with Langer. Its the fight in the dog sort of thing.

 

[Happy MEel]

No you're right, it was 50.5% but as I said, it was skewed by the outlier. The point is that the top eight teams had more possession than the bottom eight. Breaking it into groups of four teams is less useful because one outlier has more influence on a smaller group's averages.

Stats across the season show the trend better because they aggregate a lot more data. It is a bigger sample.

So I had time to kill this morning and worked out the average winning possession % across the season and it's actually higher than I thought. The magic number is 52.5% possession which is a pretty strong indicator for success.

 

[Gazzamatta]

Does anyone have stats on penalties earned by a DH for minutes played? Id suggest CK is right up there.
What about stats on speed and success of passes from DH. Id suggest CK would be right up there.
A DH that manages his time between attack and defence to allow him to be effective for 80 minutes allows another big bopper on the bench. This was not possible with KP as starting DH.
Stats dont always tell the whole story. Ive been an avid footy watcher for 50 years and my opinion is that CK has been a breath of fresh air for our team. In fact his skill as DH is the best Ive seen from a Parra DH in years.

 

[Gronk]

Does anyone have stats on penalties earned by a DH for minutes played? Id suggest CK is right up there.
What about stats on speed and success of passes from DH. Id suggest CK would be right up there.
A DH that manages his time between attack and defence to allow him to be effective for 80 minutes allows another big bopper on the bench. This was not possible with KP as starting DH.
Stats dont always tell the whole story. Ive been an avid footy watcher for 50 years and my opinion is that CK has been a breath of fresh air for our team. In fact his skill as DH is the best Ive seen from a Parra DH in years.

I wonder if Cam King's success in the last 5/6 games has been bc he has fixed the problems that kept him away from getting a start in NRL or if he always had these skills and BA was at fault for ignoring him ?

EDIT Or was it about the 2nd tier cap thing.

 

[Gazzamatta]

I wonder if Cam King's success in the last 5/6 games has been bc he has fixed the problems that kept him away from getting a start in NRL or if he always had these skills and BA was at fault for ignoring him ?

EDIT Or was it about the 2nd tier cap thing.

Probably a combination of all three. I do think however that BA has preferred a hard hitting, leader of line speed type of DH. Through necessity, maybe BA is surprised by what CK brings. A good coach should always be learning and adjusting. Possibly theres an element of that as well.

 

[rugby league fan]

W

Why the emphasis on size, both Slater and Cam Smith were small, still are. Same with Langer. Its the fight in the dog sort of thing.

Sorry mate Cameron Smith isn't small. 186cm. nearly 6'1. Cameron Smith broke the mould from the traditional hooker. Small, stocky. Cameron Smith is tall, rangy. All class

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Based on stats Hodgson is probably better than Cam Smith

No he's not. Smith makes more tackles, fewer missed, and gets more LBAs and TAs.

, but of the two who would you have in your team. You see its not all about stats, other intangibles determine how good a player is.

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