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Rumours and Stuff

emjaycee

Coach
Messages
13,818
That's why I think he is the pick of the younger coaches. He makes average rosters play well. He has had to rebuild at every club that he has gone to and done brilliantly ever time. I he ever gets the chance to stay at a club long enough when they actually have a great roster, I think he is the kind of coach that can win multiple premierships.

And despite the brilliant performances every time, he has the same win/loss record as Brad Arthur.
 

emjaycee

Coach
Messages
13,818
Depending what he was on, I'd let go of RFM in a heartbeat.

Because he's a plodder.
A couple of days after our game against the Dogs, I made the comment that I was not sure what the fuss on here was all about. All he did in that game was pretty much take the ball in from the sideline and turn back inside and run "Taka like" sideways looking for a hole and/or someone to pass to.

His 2018 stats are:
2 tries
2 LB's
0 LBA's
19 Offloads
269 tackles @ 89.9% efficiency
113.8 metres average per run

Compare him to one of our "plodders" in Manu Ma'u:
3 tries
3 LB's
1 LBA
13 offloads
353 tackles @ 89.2% efficiency
106 metres average per run

Not a great deal of difference and not the saviour we need on the edge.
 
Messages
42,876
A couple of days after our game against the Dogs, I made the comment that I was not sure what the fuss on here was all about. All he did in that game was pretty much take the ball in from the sideline and turn back inside and run "Taka like" sideways looking for a hole and/or someone to pass to.

His 2018 stats are:
2 tries
2 LB's
0 LBA's
19 Offloads
269 tackles @ 89.9% efficiency
113.8 metres average per run

Compare him to one of our "plodders" in Manu Ma'u:
3 tries
3 LB's
1 LBA
13 offloads
353 tackles @ 89.2% efficiency
106 metres average per run

Not a great deal of difference and not the saviour we need on the edge.
Their average metres per run are alright.
 

hindy111

Post Whore
Messages
62,867
That's what I and everybody else keeps saying. I'm the Phil Gould of supporters. Just give me one year and I would fix this club for good. Just one year baby, just give me one year we will be transformed.

Powerhouse!!!


One year.
Hindy111 would fix it in 6 weeks.

1 - Sign big prop. DONE
2 - Powerfull 2nd rower
3 - Powerful wing option
4 - Hethrington
That would be enough for me to be happy. A hooker i would go for one of those Panthers young two.
 

Bazal

Post Whore
Messages
103,014
A couple of days after our game against the Dogs, I made the comment that I was not sure what the fuss on here was all about. All he did in that game was pretty much take the ball in from the sideline and turn back inside and run "Taka like" sideways looking for a hole and/or someone to pass to.

His 2018 stats are:
2 tries
2 LB's
0 LBA's
19 Offloads
269 tackles @ 89.9% efficiency
113.8 metres average per run

Compare him to one of our "plodders" in Manu Ma'u:
3 tries
3 LB's
1 LBA
13 offloads
353 tackles @ 89.2% efficiency
106 metres average per run

Not a great deal of difference and not the saviour we need on the edge.

Yeah I don't see it either mate. Ma'u is also much more dangerous with ball in hand.

Last season RFM made 60m per game and 15 tackles. 2016 it was 50m and 17 tackles. I CBF finding offloads and stuff, but I'd be looking to that 31 game period as far more indicative of his quality than 8 or so good games this year.

He's a plodder playing above his weight at the moment
 

Bazal

Post Whore
Messages
103,014
One year.
Hindy111 would fix it in 6 weeks.

1 - Sign big prop. DONE
2 - Powerfull 2nd rower
3 - Powerful wing option
4 - Hethrington
That would be enough for me to be happy. A hooker i would go for one of those Panthers young two.

Why are you obsessed with Hetherington?

Might as well promote Oregon Kaufusi, Hetherington is a worker.
 

hindy111

Post Whore
Messages
62,867
Why are you obsessed with Hetherington?

Might as well promote Oregon Kaufusi, Hetherington is a worker.

Hethrington comes from a superior system. Big body with power and only 21. A lot more powerfull then our workers and yet to adjust to first grade.

Off contract and wouldnt break bank to get him.
 

Tommy Coco

Juniors
Messages
643
Hethrington comes from a superior system. Big body with power and only 21. A lot more powerfull then our workers and yet to adjust to first grade.

Off contract and wouldnt break bank to get him.

I’m with you on this one. I think is is more impact than worker from the few games played so far.
 
Messages
19,390
Yeah I don't see it either mate. Ma'u is also much more dangerous with ball in hand.

Last season RFM made 60m per game and 15 tackles. 2016 it was 50m and 17 tackles. I CBF finding offloads and stuff, but I'd be looking to that 31 game period as far more indicative of his quality than 8 or so good games this year.

He's a plodder playing above his weight at the moment

Yeh, you've got factor in likely improvement / deterioration with age and experience if you want to land a value signing. RFM is certainly on the up, he's young and he's producing similar stats to Ma'u. Ma'u is unlikely to improve. I'm not suggest that he's a realistic prospect, but he's not a plodder.
 

Poupou Escobar

Post Whore
Messages
91,325
Not if we got rid of all the dead wood that is lying around at the moment.
We have these off contract:

Auva'a
Davis
Gower
Hayne
Gennings
King
Matagi
Niukore
Pritchard
Scott
Terepo
Vave
Williams

And need to replace them in the top 30 with the same number of players, so a minimum of $1.18M (4 x $70k + 9 x $100k)

We have signed Junior Paulo for $650k at minimum, plus we've upgraded Alvaro and Brown (my guess is about $500k) so there's another $1.15M in next year's cap.

The only big money players off contract are Hayne and Scott (maybe $900k between them). Auva'a, King, Matagi, Pritchard, Terepo and Vave would be on about $200k each, so there's $1.2M freed up. Assume we flush all of them plus minimum salary players Davis, Gower, Gennings, Niukore and Williams ($500k for the five) and we have lost 13 from the squad and created $2.6M in cap space. Add Kenny Edwards' $300k that has just been freed up and we're looking at $2.9M

Then subtract the $650k for Paulo and the $500k for Alvaro and Brown's upgrades and you're left with $1.75M (let's be generous and call it $1.8M) for next year, with which we need to buy 12 players (the 13 we're letting go minus Junior Paulo). And here's the rub: it's easy to find players worth less than the minimum salary, but you have to pay them no less than the minimum salary (4 x $70k and the rest x $100k). You also need to be able to rely on a couple of them to play at least half the season, as well the rest to fill in during a crisis. You don't want Flegg graduates or part-timers from Wenty who are only worth $50k. If you're going to pay blokes $100k (or even $70k) you need them to be worth it, because they will appear in your NRL team during the season. You're better off paying a bloke that's worth $150k what he's worth as a backup than paying a bloke worth $50k double that just to fill your top 30 with cheapies. I dare say the backups worth exactly $100k (and willing to take it) aren't in such numbers that you can just find one off contract when you need him.

But let's assume we can find as many $100k players as we need (plus the four $70k players 27-30 in the squad). We have $1.8M to spend and 12 spots to fill. You want Lodge, TPJ, RFM and Koroisau. That would mean eight minimum salary players alongside them, costing $680k). So you have $1.12M to sign Lodge, TPJ, RFM and Koroisau. I would suggest we'd be lucky to get two of these blokes for that, plus fill the other two spots with minimum salary backups. Axing Norman would be a good way to get three of them (and one minimum salary backup) but it still leaves a hole in the outside backs.

Better economics would be to look at the top 17 as it stand for 2019. Let's assume Norman is gone and frees up $500k:

1. French
2.
3. Jennings
4.
5.
6. Gutherson
7. Moses
8. Alvaro
9.
10. Paulo
11. Ma'u
12. Moeroa
13. Brown
14.
15.
16. Evans
17. Mannah

Throw Takairangi in there at either 4 or 15. Plus these squad members who won't be in the ideal top 17:

18. Smith
19. Hoffman
20. Salmon

We now need not middle forwards, but a hooker plus at least one winger. That's just for our top 17. Signing more middle forwards, even if they're better than the ones we have, will just push more top 17 contracts out of the top 17. That is a dumb use of a limited resource (cap space). Plus if Norman is gone then we have 15 spots left to fill for next year (including a top 17 wing, hooker and at least two other edge players).

So in this magical fairytale world where Norman is gone and frees up $500k (and my numbers are inexplicably correct for all the merkins off contract) then we have $2.3M to sign four top 17 players and 11 backups on about minimum salary. For ease of accounting let's assume the backups average $100k each (so the four $70k players are evened out by some of the backups costing more than $100k). That makes $1.1M for backups, leaving $1.2M for the four top 17 players. That is $300k for each of those four, which is average salary under the current cap and therefore slightly less under next year's cap. But I think $300k is a very solid first grader, along the lines of Takairangi or Alvaro. It's probably a below average NRL hooker. We might get Mitch Rein for that or spend less at the other three positions and get Granville/Koroisau for $500k+

But I can't see how we can spend big on two more middle forwards and still have enough to fill the rest of the squad.
 

Bazal

Post Whore
Messages
103,014
Yeh, you've got factor in likely improvement / deterioration with age and experience if you want to land a value signing. RFM is certainly on the up, he's young and he's producing similar stats to Ma'u. Ma'u is unlikely to improve. I'm not suggest that he's a realistic prospect, but he's not a plodder.

Yeah but I'm yet to see him do anything that wopuld suggest his plodding days are past him. I certainly wouldn't take him over the back rowers we have at the moment....I'd just wait, next season Lachlan Fitzgibbon and Villiame Kikau are off contract. Throw Manu's money at someone like that rather than wetting ourselves over a bloke who spent 3/4s of his career thus far as an abject plodder.
 

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