Rumours and Stuff

[murraymob]

And what about the money it could cost the club not replacing him??? Memberships just for starters, let alone sponsorships we all know they don’t like throwing money at *Loosers!!

Would you have been happy to see Griffen see out his contract??? I doubt your club would be where it is now if they hadn’t made that decision.

Yes it cost us to pay out a coach who was getting his side in the semi finals all because Gus did not like him .are people cancelling there memberships because of the coach or because they don’t get to go to home game.You have not won inn36 years .Arthurs can’t be blamed for that
The same person who moved Griffen on also moved Cleary on .he is going okay for us now

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Proof is in results mate

No it isn't, that's how confirmation bias works. You think any loss proves whatever pet theory you've decided on. Merkins with other theories do the same thing. You do it year after year.

 

[IFR33K]

You poor dope. I already said those two rival coaches were telling fibs. Sterlo is the one to believe (assuming he's correct) because he has nothing to gain by lying. He has no skin in the game.

The exception would be to say that Sterlo, being in rugby league media, gains from increased drama around our club, but that's not really his style.

Go hide behind your wifes skirt merkin.

 

[hineyrulz]

Yes it cost us to pay out a coach who was getting his side in the semi finals all because Gus did not like him .are people cancelling there memberships because of the coach or because they don’t get to go to home game.You have not won inn36 years .Arthurs can’t be blamed for that

So they only reason Griffen was punted was Gus didn’t like him?? Nothing to do with that fact he was capable of taking your team to the next level???

Him and Arthur are very similar, good man managers that are well liked and respected by their players and will do a good job to build a roster to make you competitive. But both tactically pretty average and unable to get their teams to take the next step.

And as for people canceling their memberships I think it’s more the fact that blind Freddy can see that BA is done here and the fact that the club are unwilling to
move him on to save some coin it will really piss off a loyal fanbase who have paid 2 years of memberships and got very little in return. And I’ll ask you this would Penrith be where they are if Griffen had of seen out his contract???

 

[murraymob]

So they only reason Griffen was punted was Gus didn’t like him?? Nothing to do with that fact he was capable of taking your team to the next level???

Him and Arthur are very similar, good man managers that are well liked and respected by their players and will do a good job to build a roster to make you competitive. But both tactically pretty average and unable to get their teams to take the next step.

And as for people canceling their memberships I think it’s more the fact that blind Freddy can see that BA is done here and the fact that the club are unwilling to
move him on to save some coin it will really piss off a loyal fanbase who have paid 2 years of memberships and got very little in return. And I’ll ask you this would Penrith be where they are if Griffen had of seen out his contract???

The year he was punted we where in the top 4 just before the semi finals the year before we also made the semi finals

 

[hindy111]

The problem in the current covid financial situation is no club can afford to pay out coaches you are stuck with your coach unless Hindy wants to step up for a few beers and hot dogs as pay

How many juniors do you guys lose prior to atleast getting 2yrs of NRL out of? Not many.
Under BA we've had 12 who are playing NRL elsewhere. While one we bought back after letting go and paid overs for in Matterson.
In 8yrs there is 3 in our squad who have been bought thru via BA AND 13 LET GO.
Brown,Mahoney,Kafusi.

Right there is our problem. Nothing's changed. We are no closer now then 10yrs ago tbh.

 

[hindy111]

The year he was punted we where in the top 4 just before the semi finals the year before we also made the semi finals

And won games in those final series also.

 

[Twizzle]

The price of not losing what we have gained the last couple of years. If he remains the price will be much higher in where we will need to start from. He has turned to cancer.

If he remains, the decision will set us back at least another 3 year probably more like 5.

Appointing Flanno now versus later on after the season would be marginal as far as money goes. I am sure if we approached him and told him to play a caretaker roll from here on in for this season but of very little money wise, he would still jump at it seeing he has no gig at present and for coaches to get their hands on the playing group early before more damage is inflicted would be preferred and a bonus to him.

Besides as if he wouldn't jump at the chance basically for a beer and a coke type of money to coach them in a semi final series.

Remember this is the guy that was busted with his hands all over the sharks when he wasn't being paid a cent and suspended. He would do it for free for this season. Guaranteed. Make it happen Parra Management. NOW!!!

none of that addresses the question I asked, no specifics, you're just regurgitating

You must have graduated from the Phil Gould school of rhetoric

If you are sacking BA today and hiring Flanno tomorrow, how will we pay for it knowing we have to pay BA's contract for next year, then there is his backup staff

 

[TheRam]

No it isn't, that's how confirmation bias works. You think any loss proves whatever pet theory you've decided on. Merkins with other theories do the same thing. You do it year after year.

And yet we are usually right and you are usually wrong. Common sense rules the day. I don't need your micro stats or a Chinese Abacus to workout what is currently going on mate.

This coach is now a toxic weapon unintentionally working against everything he has built at the club. Sad actually. But it is what it is and he must go sooner then later for all our sakes.

 

[TheRam]

Go hide behind your wife skirt merkin.

Hahahahaha...drop the mic pearler there mate. Bazinga!!!

 

[TheRam]

The year he was punted we where in the top 4 just before the semi finals the year before we also made the semi finals

So, doesn't mean he would have gotten them to the point that they are now. It could have gone another way. But we will never know definitively. I though think Cleary is a much more superior coach.

 

[TheRam]

How many juniors do you guys lose prior to atleast getting 2yrs of NRL out of? Not many.
Under BA we've had 12 who are playing NRL elsewhere. While one we bought back after letting go and paid overs for in Matterson.
In 8yrs there is 3 in our squad who have been bought thru via BA AND 13 LET GO.
Brown,Mahoney,Kafusi.

Right there is our problem. Nothing's changed. We are no closer now then 10yrs ago tbh.

And what about the all the Parra juniors that played for Manly last week. What an abomination that they have some of our very best in their team. We are just plain blind.

 

[hineyrulz]

The year he was punted we where in the top 4 just before the semi finals the year before we also made the semi finals

Thanks scoop, but that’s not what I asked do you think you’d be where you are as a team now if Griffen had of seen out his contract???

I seriously doubt you make a GF or be in contention again if he had of hung around. Like Arthur he is capable of taking a team to the finals but not capable of getting to the next level which Cleary has done for your club.

 

[yy_cheng]

How much is Gutherson worth? The document that sheds light on NRL player salaries

The Herald has obtained the confidential document used by clubs against player managers who try and inflate the value of their players during negotiations.

www.smh.com.au

How much is Gutherson worth? The document that sheds light on NRL player salaries​

By Michael Chammas​

August 16, 2021 — 5.00am
Save
Share
Normal text sizeLarger text sizeVery large text size
7
View all comments
This is your last free article for this month

Get the full story for half the price.​

Subscribe with Google
CARD OR PAYPAL
Advertisement
This is the confidential data that charts the true value of an NRL player, which is used by clubs to keep agents honest if they try to inflate the value of their clients during contract negotiations.
The Herald has obtained a copy of the NRL’s salary cap benchmarking spreadsheet, which collates the salary of every player and ranks by position to provide clubs with the data to determine whether they are paying overs for players.

Clint Gutherson’s future has been a topic of conjecture in the past week.CREDIT:NRL PHOTOS
The document, which is sent annually to clubs, highlights the average salary of the top five earners in each position and will be pivotal when negotiations between the Parramatta Eels and skipper Clint Gutherson resume in the off-season.
Debate has been raging over the past week about the value of Gutherson following revelations his manager, Sam Ayoub, had told some people in the game that the Eels would have to find close to seven figures to keep their skipper beyond 2022. Ayoub denies putting that to the Eels, but conjecture over Gutherson’s value has continued nonetheless.

The Herald has obtained the audited 2019 salary cap breakdown, which is based on similar figures to next year. It’s the most accurate recent comparison, given that the 2020 figures include a 20 per cent reduction in remuneration due to the COVID-19 interruption.
It shows that the top five highest-paid fullbacks in 2019 earned an average of $971,000 that year. The document also shows that the median salary of the top five fullbacks (the third-highest paid) was $930,000.

Most people’s list of the top five current fullbacks in the game would be made up of Tom Trbojevic, James Tedesco, Ryan Papenhuyzen, Latrell Mitchell and Kalyn Ponga. Roger Tuivasa-Sheck recently departed that group.
The Eels are discovering that Gutherson is likely to be in the next echelon of fullbacks alongside Dylan Edwards, AJ Brimson, Nicho Hynes, Charnze Nicoll-Klokstad and Reece Walsh. Where he fits inside the sixth-to-10th category is a matter of opinion, and any assessment would also need to consider Gutherson’s captaincy and ability to kick goals.
Advertisement
But there is a whopping $350,000 drop-off between the top five fullbacks and the next five, with the sixth- to 10th-best No.1s earning an average of $622,000. The median salary in that category (the eighth-highest paid in 2019) is $600,000.
The counterargument can be made that Gutherson is, if not Parramatta’s best player, the club’s second-best player behind halfback Mitchell Moses. On that argument, based on the average salary of the two highest-paid players at each club, Gutherson can demand either $942,000 (the average salary of the highest-paid player at each club) or $803,000 (the second-highest).

That alone highlights Parramatta’s predicament: is their roster good enough to win a competition, and if not, how much can they afford to pay their captain if they want to add better pieces to the puzzle to bolster their premiership hopes in the future?
The Roosters have Tedesco and Luke Keary. The Panthers have Nathan Cleary and James Fisher-Harris. The Rabbitohs have Latrell Mitchell and Cody Walker. The Sea Eagles have Trbojevic and Daly Cherry-Evans. The Storm have Cameron Munster and Jahrome Hughes.

When it comes to extracting value for money, the Eels need to ask themselves where the Gutherson-Moses combination sits on the spectrum of the highest-paid duo at the top teams.
Fullback is the second-highest-paid position. The average salary of a top-five halfback in 2019 was $998,888. The list likely included Cherry-Evans, Ben Hunt, Cooper Cronk, Mitchell Pearce and Cleary. Moses is now in that category after signing an extension worth close to $900,000 (plus bonuses) this year.

 

[yy_cheng]

The next five best halfbacks earn an average of $754,000, however, after that there is a significant drop-off in salary, which highlights an apparent shortage of quality No.7s in the sport. It’s why Chad Townsend was able to secure around $800,000 from the Cowboys for next year.
The 11th- to 15th-best halfbacks in the game earn an average of $286,000, which is below what the 11th- to 15th-best wingers in the game get paid ($319,000 average). The 11th- to 15th-rated halfbacks earn less than any other position in the same ranking.

There’s a similar shortage of quality hookers, which is also evident in the salary cap benchmarking document. Apart from wingers, the position paying the least for the top-five players is hooker.
Regarded by many as occupying one of the most influential positions in the game, the top five hookers earned an average salary of just $613,000. That list would have included Cameron Smith, Josh Hodgson and Damien Cook.

Damien Cook would have been in the top-five hookers list, but that category is attracting lower salaries relative to the importance of the position.CREDIT:GETTY IMAGES
Like halfback, there’s also a notable decline in salary between the top No.9s and the next best. The hooker and halfback positions are the only two categories that see the 11th to 15th highest-paid players in their respective positions earn an average salary of less than $300,000.
The position with the least discrepancy between the top five and the 11th- to 15th-ranked players is prop given the high volume of big men each team carries in the top 30.

When footy just doesn’t matter​

Tevita Pangai Jr and his partner, Anna, spent a large part of last week inside a Queensland hospital, where rugby league paled into insignificance. A fortnight ago Anna suffered a miscarriage 24 weeks into her pregnancy, leading to Pangai Jr’s immediate departure from the Panthers camp.
To compound their agony, Tevita and Anna were in hospital for a few days waiting for a natural labour to begin, preparing for the ordeal of having to give birth to the daughter they’ll never know.

“There will forever be a hole in my heart from losing you my sweet girl,” Anna posted on Instagram. “I’m grateful for the time I got to feel you grow in my belly. I know you’re in good hands now and your grandma is cheering to have her first grandchild there with her. I love you with all that I am. Continue to watch over me and daddy. I love you my first born.”

The family had a funeral for baby Georgia Lose Galilee Pangai on Sunday. Pangai Junior and his partner will rejoin the Panthers on Monday and he will be eligible for selection against South Sydney this weekend.
Penrith want to make sure he is in the right frame of mind before clearing him to play his first game for the club. Our thoughts are with Pangai Junior and his family.

Loan System taking shape​

The loan system appears here to stay. The ARL Commission will soon be presented with a proposal to introduce short- and long-term loan deals between clubs from next year.

Representatives of the game’s contracting committee are putting the finishing touches on the proposal, which could revolutionise the player transfer market.

The Bulldogs were forced to borrow Canberra forwards Ryan James and Corey Horsburgh on two-week loans.CREDIT:NRL PHOTOS, GETTY
The concept, which has the preliminary backing of the RLPA, would allow players to leave their teams for opportunities at rival clubs — as has happened during Operation Relocation in the past couple of weeks and with the New Zealand Warriors in 2020.
Teams wouldn’t be able to make in-season trades unless they are depleted in certain positions due to injury and/or suspension.

Heat put on match review committee​

The NRL is aware of murmurs circulating in club land that the code was on the verge of blowing up the match review committee next year. The rumours have also cast doubt over head of football Graham Annesley’s position in the game, linking him to a role with the 2032 Brisbane Olympic team.
We are told it is just an agenda being pushed by certain clubs that want change, but don’t be surprised if the game’s bosses tinker with the match review committee in the off-season.

Ayoub agrees to park negotiations​

There was undeniable tension between the Eels and Gutherson’s manager, Sam Ayoub, last week. Coincidentally, it comes after others noted that Ayoub missed out on securing Brad Arthur’s son, Jake, as a client.
Ayoub and the Eels last week agreed to park negotiations with Gutherson, which began early in the season, until after the finals given the undue pressure it placed on Parramatta’s No.1 last week.


NRL player agent Sam Ayoub.CREDIT:NICK MOIR
The captain’s reputation took a hit the last time his manager negotiated a deal for his client, and he risked further damage last week when Ayoub fuelled the fire in regard to Gutherson’s value.
What also hasn’t been lost on the club is the notable divide between player and club since the last negotiations. Gutherson is the heartbeat of the football team, but the relationship between the No.1 and the club’s head office has eroded over time and needs to be fixed. It shouldn’t be left to the likes of Junior Paulo, Reed Mahoney and Dylan Brown to unify the ranks.
Protracted negotiations this time around could only amplify the problem, which is why delaying negotiations appears in everyone’s best interest.
Sports news, results and expert commentary. Sign up for our Sport newsletter.

 

[TheRam]

none of that addresses the question I asked, no specifics, you're just regurgitating

You must have graduated from the Phil Gould school of rhetoric

If you are sacking BA today and hiring Flanno tomorrow, how will we pay for it knowing we have to pay BA's contract for next year, then there is his backup staff

Oh sorry, I didn't know we were on deaths door financially. Please elaborate. We have no money?

 

[Incorrect]

none of that addresses the question I asked, no specifics, you're just regurgitating

You must have graduated from the Phil Gould school of rhetoric

If you are sacking BA today and hiring Flanno tomorrow, how will we pay for it knowing we have to pay BA's contract for next year, then there is his backup staff

If BA loves the club as much as he says he should offer to hand back his payout if we sack him for 2022 FFS....I would....

#toungueincheek

 

[IFR33K]

How much is Gutherson worth? The document that sheds light on NRL player salaries

The Herald has obtained the confidential document used by clubs against player managers who try and inflate the value of their players during negotiations.

www.smh.com.au

How much is Gutherson worth? The document that sheds light on NRL player salaries​

By Michael Chammas​

August 16, 2021 — 5.00am
Save
Share
Normal text sizeLarger text sizeVery large text size
7
View all comments
This is your last free article for this month

Get the full story for half the price.​

Subscribe with Google
CARD OR PAYPAL
Advertisement
This is the confidential data that charts the true value of an NRL player, which is used by clubs to keep agents honest if they try to inflate the value of their clients during contract negotiations.
The Herald has obtained a copy of the NRL’s salary cap benchmarking spreadsheet, which collates the salary of every player and ranks by position to provide clubs with the data to determine whether they are paying overs for players.

Clint Gutherson’s future has been a topic of conjecture in the past week.CREDIT:NRL PHOTOS
The document, which is sent annually to clubs, highlights the average salary of the top five earners in each position and will be pivotal when negotiations between the Parramatta Eels and skipper Clint Gutherson resume in the off-season.
Debate has been raging over the past week about the value of Gutherson following revelations his manager, Sam Ayoub, had told some people in the game that the Eels would have to find close to seven figures to keep their skipper beyond 2022. Ayoub denies putting that to the Eels, but conjecture over Gutherson’s value has continued nonetheless.

The Herald has obtained the audited 2019 salary cap breakdown, which is based on similar figures to next year. It’s the most accurate recent comparison, given that the 2020 figures include a 20 per cent reduction in remuneration due to the COVID-19 interruption.
It shows that the top five highest-paid fullbacks in 2019 earned an average of $971,000 that year. The document also shows that the median salary of the top five fullbacks (the third-highest paid) was $930,000.

Most people’s list of the top five current fullbacks in the game would be made up of Tom Trbojevic, James Tedesco, Ryan Papenhuyzen, Latrell Mitchell and Kalyn Ponga. Roger Tuivasa-Sheck recently departed that group.
The Eels are discovering that Gutherson is likely to be in the next echelon of fullbacks alongside Dylan Edwards, AJ Brimson, Nicho Hynes, Charnze Nicoll-Klokstad and Reece Walsh. Where he fits inside the sixth-to-10th category is a matter of opinion, and any assessment would also need to consider Gutherson’s captaincy and ability to kick goals.
Advertisement
But there is a whopping $350,000 drop-off between the top five fullbacks and the next five, with the sixth- to 10th-best No.1s earning an average of $622,000. The median salary in that category (the eighth-highest paid in 2019) is $600,000.
The counterargument can be made that Gutherson is, if not Parramatta’s best player, the club’s second-best player behind halfback Mitchell Moses. On that argument, based on the average salary of the two highest-paid players at each club, Gutherson can demand either $942,000 (the average salary of the highest-paid player at each club) or $803,000 (the second-highest).

That alone highlights Parramatta’s predicament: is their roster good enough to win a competition, and if not, how much can they afford to pay their captain if they want to add better pieces to the puzzle to bolster their premiership hopes in the future?
The Roosters have Tedesco and Luke Keary. The Panthers have Nathan Cleary and James Fisher-Harris. The Rabbitohs have Latrell Mitchell and Cody Walker. The Sea Eagles have Trbojevic and Daly Cherry-Evans. The Storm have Cameron Munster and Jahrome Hughes.

When it comes to extracting value for money, the Eels need to ask themselves where the Gutherson-Moses combination sits on the spectrum of the highest-paid duo at the top teams.
Fullback is the second-highest-paid position. The average salary of a top-five halfback in 2019 was $998,888. The list likely included Cherry-Evans, Ben Hunt, Cooper Cronk, Mitchell Pearce and Cleary. Moses is now in that category after signing an extension worth close to $900,000 (plus bonuses) this year.

But some genius here told us the roosters punted Pearce and got Cronk, and that Cronk was actually cheaper. And that’s how they were able to buy Tedesco.

 

[Twizzle]

Oh sorry, I didn't know we were on deaths door financially. Please elaborate. We have no money?

well you made the allegation, I thought you may be privy to our finances

a recent article that was posted here said it would cost a fair bit to do that and we have a cap on what we can spend

do we sell a player to pay BA out, how would you do it ?

 

[IFR33K]

If BA loves the club as much as he says he should offer to hand back his payout if we sack him for 2022 FFS....I would....

#toungueincheek

If he actually loves the club so much, he should negotiate a payout for next year and more on. I’m sure he’ll pick up an assistant gig for next season. I wouldn’t expect he’d be too much out of pocket and he’d save face with the club and fans. And his reputation won’t take a hit if he’s sacked.