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Rumours and Stuff

Parra Pride

Parra Pride

Referee
Messages
20,438
Tiger5150 said:
That is my mail as well. Cryptically alluded to it here on Thursday (you guys get the best oil from me).
Like any positive news regarding the Tigers, Ill believe it when I see it. Desperately need a good centre though.
Click to expand...
You guys also desperately need a good fullback, and halfback, and hooker, and... Well everything really.
 
Eelementary

Eelementary

Post Whore
Messages
57,124
hindy111 said:
I disagree on Saints 11 wins. Who was the competition? There was no salary cap either to try an even things up . They wouldn't of had to deal with losing 3-4 quality players each year and re shaping the side
Only 10 sides in the comp and all in Sydney So no travel. On top of that No QLD sides or even Newcastle or Canberra.I mean there wasn't even a Penrith.
Click to expand...

If it was so easy back then, why were the Steelers the only ones to do it?

No travel, no salary cap, etc. can probably account for maybe 5 consecutive Premierships - but they dominated for over a decade.

Same as the Celtics.

Dismissing it because of the period on history that it was achieved in, is like saying that Bradman's career Test average is meaningless, because he only played against a handful of competitive Test nations in his time.

Nobody has even come close to hitting The Don's average since then.

Saying that Penrith winning a 4th straight Premiership would be the greatest achievement in sports history would dishonour records like:

* Rafael Nadal winning 83 consecutive matches on clay (the next best record was 66)

* Leicester City winning the Premier League
 
O

oldmancraigy

Coach
Messages
11,926
Eelementary said:
If it was so easy back then, why were the Steelers the only ones to do it?

No travel, no salary cap, etc. can probably account for maybe 5 consecutive Premierships - but they dominated for over a decade.

Same as the Celtics.

Dismissing it because of the period on history that it was achieved in, is like saying that Bradman's career Test average is meaningless, because he only played against a handful of competitive Test nations in his time.

Nobody has even come close to hitting The Don's average since then.
Click to expand...

On the Steelers: it didn't matter who did it, but the prevalent conditions meant someone eventually would. Essentially all the beat players could come together and someone was eventually going to. They changed the rules to limit tackles and it all ended...
South's had won 5 in 6 in the years prior to the Merge winning 11 (and 7 of 8 before that), and even Balmain had won 3 of 4 (like, wow!!). Clearly the 'hold the ball forever' thing (with no salary cap) made it easier to accumulate talent, hold the ball forever, and create dynasties.
The Steeler's WERE the best dynasty of that time, but still...

Celtics are similar. It all happened before (a) 3 pointers - and because Bill Russell could just stand in the lane as the best defender ever, nobodybcould score - and (b) salary cap - which came in because all the good players hung out to win championships (they still try to do it today in the NBA, it is just much harder. But see Warriors, Golden State as a modern team who managed to (legally) pay for a few championships - it cost them a bucket, but thanks to their marketability they made a profit!)

Bradman is pretty different because he isn't a case of all the good players hanging out together, or playing under different rules. It is an individual playing under the same conditions as everyone else, and being head and shoulders better - not only than those of his time, but those now whose lives are arguable easier (overall averages by generation and covered pitches).

I agree on what you were saying re a 4peat from Pennies. I do think it would be the best effort in NRL history (see reasons above). So I'm hoping anyone else wins this year - preferably us!!
 
hindy111

hindy111

Post Whore
Messages
62,867
Eelementary said:
If it was so easy back then, why were the Steelers the only ones to do it?

No travel, no salary cap, etc. can probably account for maybe 5 consecutive Premierships - but they dominated for over a decade.

Same as the Celtics.

Dismissing it because of the period on history that it was achieved in, is like saying that Bradman's career Test average is meaningless, because he only played against a handful of competitive Test nations in his time.

Nobody has even come close to hitting The Don's average since then.

Saying that Penrith winning a 4th straight Premiership would be the greatest achievement in sports history would dishonour records like:

* Rafael Nadal winning 83 consecutive matches on clay (the next best record was 66)

* Leicester City winning the Premier League
Click to expand...

Firstly it wasn't professional.When a sport isn't taken as seriously it is far easier for someone who does put in more effort and time in training to stand out. Nowdays every single player in the NRL is professional including the back ups. Do you think Eric Grothe would of been able to run thru defenses in the current game? NO WAY.
Imagine if Penrith didn't lose any players and still had Korisau,Burton,Kikau,RCG,Crighton, Spencer. They'd be just about unstoppable now.

Agree on Raffa and Leicester. Huge achievements.
 
O

oldmancraigy

Coach
Messages
11,926
hindy111 said:
Firstly it wasn't professional.When a sport isn't taken as seriously it is far easier for someone who does put in more effort and time in training to stand out. Nowdays every single player in the NRL is professional including the back ups. Do you think Eric Grothe would of been able to run thru defenses in the current game? NO WAY.
Imagine if Penrith didn't lose any players and still had Korisau,Burton,Kikau,RCG,Crighton, Spencer. They'd be just about unstoppable now.

Agree on Raffa and Leicester. Huge achievements.
Click to expand...
My argument was better
 
Eelementary

Eelementary

Post Whore
Messages
57,124
oldmancraigy said:
On the Steelers: it didn't matter who did it, but the prevalent conditions meant someone eventually would. Essentially all the beat players could come together and someone was eventually going to. They changed the rules to limit tackles and it all ended...
South's had won 5 in 6 in the years prior to the Merge winning 11 (and 7 of 8 before that), and even Balmain had won 3 of 4 (like, wow!!). Clearly the 'hold the ball forever' thing (with no salary cap) made it easier to accumulate talent, hold the ball forever, and create dynasties.
The Steeler's WERE the best dynasty of that time, but still...

Celtics are similar. It all happened before (a) 3 pointers - and because Bill Russell could just stand in the lane as the best defender ever, nobodybcould score - and (b) salary cap - which came in because all the good players hung out to win championships (they still try to do it today in the NBA, it is just much harder. But see Warriors, Golden State as a modern team who managed to (legally) pay for a few championships - it cost them a bucket, but thanks to their marketability they made a profit!)

Bradman is pretty different because he isn't a case of all the good players hanging out together, or playing under different rules. It is an individual playing under the same conditions as everyone else, and being head and shoulders better - not only than those of his time, but those now whose lives are arguable easier (overall averages by generation and covered pitches).

I agree on what you were saying re a 4peat from Pennies. I do think it would be the best effort in NRL history (see reasons above). So I'm hoping anyone else wins this year - preferably us!!
Click to expand...

I think Penrith winning a 4-peat would be the best rugby league effort ever, no doubt.

But I wouldn't call it the best sporting moment in history.
 
Eelementary

Eelementary

Post Whore
Messages
57,124
hindy111 said:
Firstly it wasn't professional.When a sport isn't taken as seriously it is far easier for someone who does put in more effort and time in training to stand out. Nowdays every single player in the NRL is professional including the back ups. Do you think Eric Grothe would of been able to run thru defenses in the current game? NO WAY.
Imagine if Penrith didn't lose any players and still had Korisau,Burton,Kikau,RCG,Crighton, Spencer. They'd be just about unstoppable now.

Agree on Raffa and Leicester. Huge achievements.
Click to expand...

I think Eric Grothe is an interesting example to use to prove your point, because he is one player that would probably translate well to the modern game.
 
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