Sack Adam O'Brien

[Yosh]

Sacking AOB at this point would damage the Knights brand, and destabilize what's been set in place. The media would have a field day tearing the club apart - the new Tigers, they would be relentless.

Where does our roster rank? seriously. Take off the red and blue glasses for a minute.

It's a bottom 8 roster.

What players in our starting 13 would make it into the starting 13 of any of the teams that have finished top 4 the last few years? - not many (only 1 in the spine)

Finally Phil "foot in mouth" Gardner is moving on, finally we have a good recruitment/roster manager (best since Mooney).

Getting the wooden spoon would also damage their reputation/brand.

Sure a bottom 8 roster but is it the worst attacking roster of all time? Literally.

You see the rubbish wives of Newy article? You think more of those aren't going to come out if we keep losing and scoring less than a try a game?

Whats going to really damage the brand at the end of the day?

The roster isn't great no doubt but a good coach would make the best of a bad bunch. He has the best attacking player of the past decade but still can't find a way to use him. Everyone and their grandparents think his attacking tactics are weird and boring. Why are we still not challenging kicks? Why we hitting it one out with the smallest and most unathletic middles on the comp?

At the end of the day, whether we win or lose, I want the team I love and support to play in the spirit of the game. We are so damn negative every minute we have the ball. So boring. We all supported the club during the spoon years. Those were bottom 2 rosters for sure. But we turned up every week and gave it our all. Even though we sucked. That I can live with. Not this negative suck the life out of your soul negative football.

 

[Knight Tales]

If AOB is removed the club should let the players know it’s on them. Cos there is no way that attack is on him. The defence to start the year was our best in a long while.

 

[Apey]

Newcastle are their own worst enemy and Wahs on the up - April efficiency update - The Rugby League Eye Test

With the Bulldogs conceding 42 points against Brisbane on Thursday evening, it appears that the best defense in the NRL is now letting the Newcastle Knights have the ball. We will get to the Knights woes shortly, but prior to Round 8, the Dogs had only trailed on the scoreboard for 3.5% of game...

www.rugbyleagueeyetest.com

Some fun reading for how bad we are with the ball!

This could have been posted in any number of threads but I went with this one because it's a hotbed of activity.

 

[perverse]

Newcastle are their own worst enemy and Wahs on the up - April efficiency update - The Rugby League Eye Test

With the Bulldogs conceding 42 points against Brisbane on Thursday evening, it appears that the best defense in the NRL is now letting the Newcastle Knights have the ball. We will get to the Knights woes shortly, but prior to Round 8, the Dogs had only trailed on the scoreboard for 3.5% of game...

www.rugbyleagueeyetest.com

Some fun reading for how bad we are with the ball!

This could have been posted in any number of threads but I went with this one because it's a hotbed of activity.

But it's not a coaching problem... lol. We are literally historically bad. How can the coach not bare at least some responsibility for that? You are 5 years into your stint and your team is the worst attacking team in modern history. And not by a little either, by a lot.

Anyone defending this at this point must be related to the bloke. This isn't tenable, the club has to step in and do something if this keeps on much longer. We've literally got statisticians trying to pick apart how we can be this bad.

 

[Dr Dr Gimedanews]

Getting the wooden spoon would also damage their reputation/brand.

Sure a bottom 8 roster but is it the worst attacking roster of all time? Literally.

You see the rubbish wives of Newy article? You think more of those aren't going to come out if we keep losing and scoring less than a try a game?

Whats going to really damage the brand at the end of the day?

The roster isn't great no doubt but a good coach would make the best of a bad bunch. He has the best attacking player of the past decade but still can't find a way to use him. Everyone and their grandparents think his attacking tactics are weird and boring. Why are we still not challenging kicks? Why we hitting it one out with the smallest and most unathletic middles on the comp?

At the end of the day, whether we win or lose, I want the team I love and support to play in the spirit of the game. We are so damn negative every minute we have the ball. So boring. We all supported the club during the spoon years. Those were bottom 2 rosters for sure. But we turned up every week and gave it our all. Even though we sucked. That I can live with. Not this negative suck the life out of your soul negative football.

so what would be a fair finish on the ladder for our roster ? you think were are top 4? 6th ? 8th?

 

[Yosh]

so what would be a fair finish on the ladder for our roster ? you think were are top 4? 6th ? 8th?

It's not about where we finish on the ladder to be honest. As long time fans, you expect some good years and some dry ones. "Uhhh but we have finished in the top 8 every year under AOB" is what AOB supporters always say. Is that why we bought him to the club? To get us to avoid the spoon? Is that why the club bought him in? If it is, he is doing a great job. We are playing boring negative footy where if we defend well enough, we are going to win enough games against crappy sides, to get enough wins to finish mid table. Is that why we bought him in?

Shouldn't we be aiming a bit higher? Our facilities are worlds better than they were 20 years ago. I would say state of the art now. Our NRLW team won back to back premierships. We have had the best player in the game on our roster the past half decade. We signed the most expensive player of all time. We have the best recruitment manager in the game. Parr has been part of premiership winning establishments. It all screams we want to aim as high as possible. The only one out of sync with that is AOB.

I'm sure he is an excellent coach. I just don't see him being the head coach of a successful NRL club.

 

[Dr Dr Gimedanews]

It's not about where we finish on the ladder to be honest. As long time fans, you expect some good years and some dry ones. "Uhhh but we have finished in the top 8 every year under AOB" is what AOB supporters always say. Is that why we bought him to the club? To get us to avoid the spoon? Is that why the club bought him in? If it is, he is doing a great job. We are playing boring negative footy where if we defend well enough, we are going to win enough games against crappy sides, to get enough wins to finish mid table. Is that why we bought him in?

Shouldn't we be aiming a bit higher? Our facilities are worlds better than they were 20 years ago. I would say state of the art now. Our NRLW team won back to back premierships. We have had the best player in the game on our roster the past half decade. We signed the most expensive player of all time. We have the best recruitment manager in the game. Parr has been part of premiership winning establishments. It all screams we want to aim as high as possible. The only one out of sync with that is AOB.

I'm sure he is an excellent coach. I just don't see him being the head coach of a successful NRL club.

Schumacher himself isn't going to get a Datsun 180 to pole position. Changing driver will do little to nothing, and I'm not a strong supporter of AOB.

 

[perverse]

Schumacher himself isn't going to get a Datsun 180 to pole position. Changing driver will do little to nothing, and I'm not a strong supporter of AOB.

No, but he'd be setting records for a Datsun - not pushing it around the track with his pants down.

 

[Wizardman]

No, but he'd be setting records for a Datsun - not pushing it around the track with his pants down.

A Datsun is a Datsun though. Your pack is sadly bottom four calibre atm.

 

[perverse]

A Datsun is a Datsun though. Your pack is sadly bottom four calibre atm.

Yep, it ain't great. You'd think the brains trust that make decisions about our roster might have seen it coming.

 

[The Axe of Druss]

Doing more with less is exactly how every Knights team in history has been needed to be coached. The club will never have a "top 4 squad" on paper so it's pointless wishing for one, or making excuses for the coach not having one.

AOB either moves in this direction, arguably its too late for that, or he moves on.

Aside from last game against the Broncos the Dogs have done exactly that. Their spine is well below average and their pack is vanilla. It's 100% doable for a competent coach

 

[Mr_Knightside]

Yep, it ain't great. You'd think the brains trust that make decisions about our roster might have seen it coming.

I don’t think they foresaw three of our top middle rotation being injured at the same time, and technically we had 4 of them injured together before Leo was back on deck.

 

[Knight Tales]

With the emerging franchises the signing of Dylan borders on masterstroke for Sully IMO. And he would read this shit a mile up the road. Dylan would have had offers left right and centre had we not acted when we could. So once everyone gets over it and we accept he is halfback for the forseeable, the question becomes do we just back Sully to get us the side O'Brien can coach to be what he wants it to be. My gut says if we all saw AOB's coaching day to day, that he is overcoaching them beyond their capabilities. He wants them to be something they are not. A physical, straight running side who wears opponents down and converts the pressure. We just are not that. So we recruit to fit his criteria.

 

[perverse]

With the emerging franchises the signing of Dylan borders on masterstroke for Sully IMO. And he would read this shit a mile up the road. Dylan would have had offers left right and centre had we not acted when we could. So once everyone gets over it and we accept he is halfback for the forseeable, the question becomes do we just back Sully to get us the side O'Brien can coach to be what he wants it to be. My gut says if we all saw AOB's coaching day to day, that he is overcoaching them beyond their capabilities. He wants them to be something they are not. A physical, straight running side who wears opponents down and converts the pressure. We just are not that. So we recruit to fit his criteria.

My thoughts:

1 - Yes. when the future franchises are considered the Brown signing makes a lot more sense. I'm deeply concerned about our plan to run zero halfbacks next year given the current coaching standards, but it's clearly the direction we're headed. Playmakers are going to be very scarce. After 2 rounds, with Kalyn slipping into first receiver a lot - it was seeming like a decent plan. So realistically, and as always, a lot hinges on Kalyn.
2 - Yes we have to back O'Sullivan. It's not like we have any other choices. Jury is out so far.
3 - Everything else you've said is the most puzzling for me. Do people really think the head coach has no input into recruitment? The guy has been here for half a decade. This is his team and has been for years. Coaches get a lot of leeway in the first 12-24 months they arrive because it isn't "their team" yet. When the f**k is Adam O'Brien going to take responsibility for the team he puts on the park? I don't get why people still want to treat this guy with kids gloves.

 

[Knight Tales]

My thoughts:

1 - Yes. when the future franchises are considered the Brown signing makes a lot more sense. I'm deeply concerned about our plan to run zero halfbacks next year given the current coaching standards, but it's clearly the direction we're headed. Playmakers are going to be very scarce. After 2 rounds, with Kalyn slipping into first receiver a lot - it was seeming like a decent plan. So realistically, and as always, a lot hinges on Kalyn.
2 - Yes we have to back O'Sullivan. It's not like we have any other choices. Jury is out so far.
3 - Everything else you've said is the most puzzling for me. Do people really think the head coach has no input into recruitment? The guy has been here for half a decade. This is his team and has been for years. Coaches get a lot of leeway in the first 12-24 months they arrive because it isn't "their team" yet. When the f**k is Adam O'Brien going to take responsibility for the team he puts on the park? I don't get why people still want to treat this guy with kids gloves.

I am saying the club has spent too much on the guy, and we are going to have to wear it until his contract expires or he meets the termination criteria. Which has passed. Cos had we finished bottom four in 2024 his arse would be bouncing out the door at the end of the year. Cos we owed him nothing. 2 million dollars to a club like us, attached to business enterprise built by a man who is as tight as duck's arse who only invests low with a view to big profits , is not going to be given away just cos of outside noise. A spoon will be the only way he is going.

The reason AOB never looks flustered in pressers is cos he has a golden handshake waiting. Meaning he can be an assistant for the rest of his life and be setup for life. He has no reason at all to change it beyond how he wants it. He basically has this club by the balls and knows it. Isaac Moses might by a low rent grifter but he is a bloody smart one.

 

[Apey]

I'd wait until you see how Dylan Brown plays for us for a couple of years before you call it a masterstroke.

 

[Dr Dr Gimedanews]

A Datsun is a Datsun though. Your pack is sadly bottom four calibre atm.

Don't forget our spine

 

[Dr Dr Gimedanews]

Do people really think the head coach has no input into recruitment? The guy has been here for half a decade. This is his team and has been for years.

The coach would express where he feels the team is lacking, he doesn't balance the budget, that's recruitment, and management that signs off on the expenditure.

Rorters super coach - " I need a hooker"
Recruitment - "Reece Robson ok?"
Management - " no probs"
Rorters super coach - "Thanks"

Aint going to happen at the Knights.

 

[perverse]

The coach would express where he feels the team is lacking, he doesn't balance the budget, that's recruitment, and management that signs off on the expenditure.

Rorters super coach - " I need a hooker"
Recruitment - "Reece Robson ok?"
Management - " no probs"
Rorters super coach - "Thanks"

Aint going to happen at the Knights.

I'm not saying he can pick and choose anyone he likes in the comp like the Roosters can. Maybe I'm crazy, but I'd expect a head coach to put together a team he wants over a period of 5-6 years. Maybe my expectations are too high. Maybe the Knights need to give a decade? 15 years?

My point is, if he can't get it done in the insane amount of time we've been patient, then it's clearly time for a fresh perspective. We are dead in the water and going backwards. Need to make a change.

 

[Mr_Knightside]

I’m sure AOB would want a better team than he’s currently got, especially in the forwards and key spine positions. But we don’t have that right now, although Brown coming in next year should help.

Ultimately though it’s up to him to coach the players in front of him and whilst I think a lot of those players have improved individually under AOB I don’t feel that the overall structure and play style has at all. In fact compare the style we play now to how we did when he first got the gig in 2020 and arguably we’ve gone backwards, especially in the attack column.

Defence you could argue has gotten better but yeah you can’t win many games scoring 1-2 tries per game like we seem to do.