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Sack Adam O'Brien

Alex28

Coach
Messages
12,213
It’s more than just the attack though. Our supposedly rock solid defence is a myth. It was disgraceful against the Dragons. Those first half tries were pathetic.

I get it - what is produced on the field is ultimately owned by the coaches - mainly because they are the easiest ones to sack. I tend to think the attack is pedestrian because we get ourselves under pressure and our opposition forces us to play that way. The better teams don’t have to grind - we inevitably do.
 
Messages
2,424
The better teams don’t have to grind - we inevitably do.
Yes they do, they're just far better at it than we are. Its that simple

Good teams grind early, wearing the opposition down and patiently waiting for moments to strike. When the moments appear they take them and grind away again. Thats how footy games are mostly won
 

Knight Tales

Bench
Messages
3,298
It’s more than just the attack though. Our supposedly rock solid defence is a myth. It was disgraceful against the Dragons. Those first half tries were pathetic.

I get it - what is produced on the field is ultimately owned by the coaches - mainly because they are the easiest ones to sack. I tend to think the attack is pedestrian because we get ourselves under pressure and our opposition forces us to play that way. The better teams don’t have to grind - we inevitably do.
It’s actually not. Our defence is exceptional when you consider how bad it could get. Injury riddled. Tiring from doing it week in week out. Up till this week we had six point between us, Raiders and Storm for top defence. And we held them tryless in the second half even with 12 men.
 
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Messages
1,460
We are hopelessly outgunned in the forwards right now - no coaching is going to fix that. AOB needs to hold some responsibility for that, but so does Parr, so does POS, so does Gardner. Our situation right now isn’t just on his shoulders.
One of the most thoughtful, fair, and balanced posts I've read in here.

Sully has only just put his feet under the desk, so cannot agree that blame be assigned to him. Gardner is the culprit to the situation the club finds itself. The ship runs aground it's the Captains fault - the end. That's where the buck stops, other arguments are folly.

If a restaurant fails due to poor business strategy, high staff turn over, poor menu and sub standard ingredients, is it the fault of the maître d' ? or the owner? A fish rots from the head.
 

Alex28

Coach
Messages
12,213
One of the most thoughtful, fair, and balanced posts I've read in here.

Sully has only just put his feet under the desk, so cannot agree that blame be assigned to him. Gardner is the culprit to the situation the club finds itself. The ship runs aground it's the Captains fault - the end. That's where the buck stops, other arguments are folly.

If a restaurant fails due to poor business strategy, high staff turn over, poor menu and sub standard ingredients, is it the fault of the maître d' ? or the owner? A fish rots from the head.
If Sully continues down the refusing to overpay IF we need to overpay to get the right players in the right position because we are such a basket case, then it will soon become on him.
 

Alex28

Coach
Messages
12,213
It’s actually not. Our defence is exceptional when you consider how bad it could get. Injury riddled. Tiring from doing it week in week out. Up till this week we had six point between us, Raiders and Storm for top defence. And we held them tryless in the second half even with 12 men.
Friday night was far from exceptional.

There are a bunch of reasons why we are going so badly this year - including injuries - and we are prepared to give the players a pass but not the coaches.

It’s a tad hypocritical…
 

Old dog

Bench
Messages
2,798
Time to fix the spine, it’s not working, we’ve lost Ponga, yes our fwds are struggling but let’s get back to a 1, 6, 7 and 9 that work as a unit and hope the fwds can make some headway until injuries and suspensions ease that situation
 

TooheysNew

Coach
Messages
1,240
Time to fix the spine, it’s not working, we’ve lost Ponga, yes our fwds are struggling but let’s get back to a 1, 6, 7 and 9 that work as a unit and hope the fwds can make some headway until injuries and suspensions ease that situation
Problem solved!
 

HarVeeGee

Juniors
Messages
484
We are hopelessly outgunned in the forwards right now - no coaching is going to fix that. AOB needs to hold some responsibility for that, but so does Parr, so does POS, so does Gardner. Our situation right now isn’t just on his shoulders.
Sometimes you play a team with a much better pack, they're really "on", and they just grind you out of the contest. That's Origin right now. The Blues have a huge athleticism advantage and they are ruthless and dominant. They don't let you in the contest. Fine.

We've played the Warriors, who ground us down, and the Dogs, who did the same (plus the horrible injuries in that game, rotten luck). It happens. Really good sides that defend really well can shut you out. If those were the only game where it happened, people wouldn't be so harsh.

6 vs Titans, 4 vs Tigers, 6 vs Parramatta, 14 vs Cronulla, 6 vs Dragons, all but two of those tries being in garbage time when the other side had clocked off. These aren't sides that are defending well, that don't ever let you get on the front foot, that don't give you stuff you can attack. These are teams that are really struggling to prevent sides from scoring right now. It's almost half our games.

In 40% of halves this season, we haven't scored a try. Of the 28 tries we've scored, 7, or a quarter, are garbage time tries when the other team has switched off, so really we've scored 21. The next worst attacking team has 36.

THIS is why people are losing their minds. The stuff with the forwards explains some issues and it explains why it's not a winning team. It does not explain how impotent the attack is on its own. It doesn't explain why AOB teams very often have very long periods in seasons where the attack is just horrible and there is no perceptible improvement week on week.

The 2025 Knights are one of the worst attacking teams of the NRL era. Other teams have had way worse packs, way worse injury crises, and not been this bad in attack. Under this coach our attack has ranked: 8th, 14th, 13th, 1st (in a season where AOB was essentially working part time), 15th, and now stone motherless last. 4 out of 5 completed seasons with finals appearances, with 2 out of those four appearances being with an attack barely better than truly dreadful sides like the Broncos wooden spooners. You can't win enough games to make finals if the pack is getting dominated, so it doesn't explain the poor attack that season, either.

Remember those 2020/21 Bulldogs who had diabolical rosters, and just could not score in a brothel? Our attack, right now, is worse than those teams.

"Outgunned in the forwards" actually doesn't explain it. The attack has been shit more than it hasn't irrespective of personnel in the pack, under this coach. Blame who you like, but something is going wrong in terms of what's being drilled into this team. Simple as that.
 
Messages
1,460
Total non-sequitir but I've always hated this expression lol. The first part of the fish that rots is the guts, like with all other animals. That's why you cut them out.

Carry on.
non-sequitur indeed. It is however a very effective metaphor. Just as the Allegory of the Cave easily conveys ignorance.
 
Messages
2,605
Sometimes you play a team with a much better pack, they're really "on", and they just grind you out of the contest. That's Origin right now. The Blues have a huge athleticism advantage and they are ruthless and dominant. They don't let you in the contest. Fine.

We've played the Warriors, who ground us down, and the Dogs, who did the same (plus the horrible injuries in that game, rotten luck). It happens. Really good sides that defend really well can shut you out. If those were the only game where it happened, people wouldn't be so harsh.

6 vs Titans, 4 vs Tigers, 6 vs Parramatta, 14 vs Cronulla, 6 vs Dragons, all but two of those tries being in garbage time when the other side had clocked off. These aren't sides that are defending well, that don't ever let you get on the front foot, that don't give you stuff you can attack. These are teams that are really struggling to prevent sides from scoring right now. It's almost half our games.

In 40% of halves this season, we haven't scored a try. Of the 28 tries we've scored, 7, or a quarter, are garbage time tries when the other team has switched off, so really we've scored 21. The next worst attacking team has 36.

THIS is why people are losing their minds. The stuff with the forwards explains some issues and it explains why it's not a winning team. It does not explain how impotent the attack is on its own. It doesn't explain why AOB teams very often have very long periods in seasons where the attack is just horrible and there is no perceptible improvement week on week.

The 2025 Knights are one of the worst attacking teams of the NRL era. Other teams have had way worse packs, way worse injury crises, and not been this bad in attack. Under this coach our attack has ranked: 8th, 14th, 13th, 1st (in a season where AOB was essentially working part time), 15th, and now stone motherless last. 4 out of 5 completed seasons with finals appearances, with 2 out of those four appearances being with an attack barely better than truly dreadful sides like the Broncos wooden spooners. You can't win enough games to make finals if the pack is getting dominated, so it doesn't explain the poor attack that season, either.

Remember those 2020/21 Bulldogs who had diabolical rosters, and just could not score in a brothel? Our attack, right now, is worse than those teams.

"Outgunned in the forwards" actually doesn't explain it. The attack has been shit more than it hasn't irrespective of personnel in the pack, under this coach. Blame who you like, but something is going wrong in terms of what's being drilled into this team. Simple as that.
This is a very good take. Sums up our season (and to some extent the last 5 years) perfectly.
 

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