Scomo saving me

[wibble]

I see you still won’t acknowledge your defence of a ‘scummo is a nazi’ post was shit, which is why I won’t answer your follower questions. I prefer to point out your myopic hypocrisy. I answer questions all the time from the less nasty on here, like BBBs one.

What do you mean I won't acknowledge my defense of it? I just gave you my defense of it, again.

And you refuse to discuss it, despite you harassing another poster for not engaging in your simplistic earlier discussion (they did engage, they just explained how it was more complex than you were saying).

You might need to check up what hypocricy means.

And you say I am nasty because I hold a view that you refuse to discuss? (which makes me suspect you agree with it, but won't back down, even though you earlier accused me of that, right after I had just backed down on a point I made about carcharias that was wrong).

While you are the one on here harassing someone about being bigoted despite it being pretty clear that they aren't.

It is hard to tell if you are a troll or if you are serious.

 

[wibble]

well
You didn’t have to ask if I was a vegan
Why did you?
Veganism had nothing to do with my actual post.
I basically pre-emoted the next question you’d write if I didn’t try to cover everything


To answer your last question
Some people are vegans Based on health reasons.
They may love meat but can’t eat it.
I know a girl like this.

some just think it’s cool
You know teenage girls and shit.

some claim they are appalled by the thought of eating meat.
They’re the ones I find hypocritical for eating meat flavoured substitutes.

Why exactly is this hypocritical? Unless they are appalled at the thought of eating something that tastes like meat, I suppose, but that doesn't seem like it would usually be the case.

 

[Dragon Slayer]

Sure, if you want to call me pointing out one area that NZ did better than Australia in the coronavirus crisis, and then pointed out that two of the things you said were bad weren't too bad, as waving my Kiwi flag about.

I don't know if your hypothetical came about if people would be congratulating ScoMo, but I suspect they would.

I think he is a terrible politician, and a terrible human from what I can tell, and yet I'd congratulate him if he banned guns. I thought Howard was despicable too, but I think his banning of guns was not only his greatest moment, but one of the boldest, bravest and best political decisions I have ever seen. I'd congratulate ScoMo tomorrow if he banned some of the few guns that are still allowed in this country.

I can't speak for everyone, plenty of people do get a bee in their bonnet about something and won't let go.

Like Adern being so terrible because of Kiwi crime, and the economy, and she made good gun laws, and she is so adored, and whatever other terrible things she's done.

I can't speak precisely of these moments you say where Scomo is blamed for climate change, a drought, and bushfires. I suspect you are exaggerating there, as you have with Adern and NZ, and my Kiwi flag waving. I certainly believe our PM has a poor record in dealing with climate change (though I recognise he is hamstrung on energy policy by the extreme right of his party).

But even if you are right, it is really just a strange side discussion to the point you agreed with, which was that Adern and the NZ government's management of the coronavirus crisis is more transparent than the efforts of our governments.

I guess this thread is really just about ranting (and particularly about ScoMo so you may be right that he gets a raw deal here), and if you want to rant about Adern, and about people who have unreasonable expectations of our PM, then go for it.

If you want to discuss those things in more detail, you can probably tell I never shut up.

But in terms of the reason I brought Adern into the conversation, I think one of the areas that she is much better than Morrison is communicating in a crisis.

That is pretty subjective, but in terms of the coronavirus crisis, her government has been pretty clearly better at communicating than ours. She is the first to admit that her job is helped there by not having states to give mixed messages, so all the official communicating on coronavirus in Australia is not our PMs fault. And he hasn't done it all badly.

But he has resisted outlining a strategy, or a basis for our policies other than "expert advice".

Wibble seriously!

You thought Howard was despicable?

How could someone be so despicable and get elected and re elected so many times and with some very big majority’s?

If you are that despicable you wouldn’t last in that job for that long would you?

And now Scomo is a terrible human?

He’s actually been one the most down to earth people ever to hold the position.

If he was such a terrible human I don’t think he’d be emptying the piggy bank like he has to help so many people and businesses.

As for NZ I couldn’t care less what that small island is doing. As long as after their PM has totally screwed the country they don’t come to Australia looking for help.

Adern has been prouncing about telling us what we should be doing and criticising Australia in so many areas when she should be just focusing in running her little town. She better hope it doesn’t go tits up in NZ because she’ll be in for a shock if she comes grovelling to us.

 

[carcharias]

Why exactly is this hypocritical? Unless they are appalled at the thought of eating something that tastes like meat, I suppose, but that doesn't seem like it would usually be the case.

You supposed correctly .
There’s your answer.
So no need to ask any other questions.

 

[Eion]

What do you mean I won't acknowledge my defense of it? I just gave you my defense of it, again.

And you refuse to discuss it, despite you harassing another poster for not engaging in your simplistic earlier discussion (they did engage, they just explained how it was more complex than you were saying).

You might need to check up what hypocricy means.

And you say I am nasty because I hold a view that you refuse to discuss? (which makes me suspect you agree with it, but won't back down, even though you earlier accused me of that, right after I had just backed down on a point I made about carcharias that was wrong).

While you are the one on here harassing someone about being bigoted despite it being pretty clear that they aren't.

It is hard to tell if you are a troll or if you are serious.

Harassment, ha! Why bring religion into the argument of sending kiwis home? If that is your defence of the vile nazi post, then fine, that’s your defence. I think it’s a shit one, is that ok? Why do you need me to agree with everything you write?

 

[wibble]

Do I think it’s ridiculous and insulting to call scummo a nazi and then try to turn it into a democratic erosion debate? Yes

Oh he is now but it all linked back to the original very inflammatory post so I won’t engage in the debate. Plus it bores me, I am comfortable we’re not the same as nazi Germany and never will be and said why a bazillion pages back. I raised it again due to the one sided ‘nasty’ conservative rant to show it cuts both ways.

I thought Wibble was talking about the slippery slope to authoritarianism, rather than Scomo being an out and out Nazi.

Eion continues to just lie about this.

"He is now"...

My very first post on this said that comparison's to Nazism are troubling, especially if we are trying to make out that something is as evil as Nazism. But then I spoke about the slippery slope to authoritarianism. I didn't even mention ScoMo.

My one sided nasty conservative rant still appears to be true. I only raised that point because Eion continues to lie, use 'funky memes" and sling insults at me, all while refusing to discuss the issues I raised, and yet "lumped" us into a "lefty" group as if that was enough to dismiss any argument.

But yes, that is an unfair generalisation. Taipan, Surely, and even sometimes carcharias are examples of conservatives who are happy to discuss things here in a reasonable manner.

But since Eion is calling you a bigot for no reason you probably already realise the sort of character you are dealing with. I admire you still trying to be reasonable throughout the entire thread. As you may have gathered, with a number of the people on here, who rarely attempt a genuine discussion, it is mostly a waste of time.

 

[Quicksilver]

If he was such a terrible human I don’t think he’d be emptying the piggy bank like he has to help so many people and businesses.
.

Somehow I don't think he'd last long as PM if he just decided to let everyone starve...

I'm not say it's not the right thing to do, but it's hardly an example as to why he is a good bloke either. It's not his money and self-preservation could be a motivator for even the most evil actor in this position.

We could probably point to similar examples for any leader in history.

 

[Eion]

Eion continues to just lie about this.

"He is now"...

My very first post on this said that comparison's to Nazism are troubling, especially if we are trying to make out that something is as evil as Nazism. But then I spoke about the slippery slope to authoritarianism. I didn't even mention ScoMo.

My one sided nasty conservative rant still appears to be true. I only raised that point because Eion continues to lie, use 'funky memes" and sling insults at me, all while refusing to discuss the issues I raised, and yet "lumped" us into a "lefty" group as if that was enough to dismiss any argument.

But yes, that is an unfair generalisation. Taipan, Surely, and even sometimes carcharias are examples of conservatives who are happy to discuss things here in a reasonable manner.

But since Eion is calling you a bigot for no reason you probably already realise the sort of character you are dealing with. I admire you still trying to be reasonable throughout the entire thread. As you may have gathered, with a number of the people on here, who rarely attempt a genuine discussion, it is mostly a waste of time.

Oh so now I’m a bad character because I called your mate out for bringing religion into a deportation of kiwi criminals argument? Not above name calling are you?

 

[wibble]

Wibble seriously!

You thought Howard was despicable?

How could someone be so despicable and get elected and re elected so many times and with some very big majority’s?

If you are that despicable you wouldn’t last in that job for that long would you?

And now Scomo is a terrible human?

He’s actually been one the most down to earth people ever to hold the position.

If he was such a terrible human I don’t think he’d be emptying the piggy bank like he has to help so many people and businesses.

As for NZ I couldn’t care less what that small island is doing. As long as after their PM has totally screwed the country they don’t come to Australia looking for help.

Adern has been prouncing about telling us what we should be doing and criticising Australia in so many areas when she should be just focusing in running her little town. She better hope it doesn’t go tits up in NZ because she’ll be in for a shock if she comes grovelling to us.

Well, Howard amended the marriage laws which personally annoyed me as it affected my wedding. And that was pure identity politics that he didn't run past anyone (a captain's call, as it were, which looks pretty retrograde in hindsight).

And he lied and milked the children overboard thing for all it was worth.

He said he'd never ever do a GST then introduced one 2 years later (to be fair, at least he took that to the ballot box).

In the 80s he was very critical of Asian migration, which also didn't age very well.

How did he stay as PM so long? What were the options? I have a pretty low opinion of most of the major political leaders. Something about someone wanting to rule over everyone else.

The public can vote in despicable people. Viktor Orban hardly seems very decent. Trump brags about groping women and talks up his ratings during crisis information sessions with his people.

ScoMo is emptying the bank because it is the only option. I agree that it is a good thing he is doing, but even Trump and the Republicans are emptying the bank, and they hate big government as much as anyone.

I know many agree with the policy, but ScoMo introduced our policy of locking up families and children to deter "boats". And I think he did for cheap political points, not as a serious immigration policy.

 

[Quicksilver]

Adern has been prouncing about telling us what we should be doing and criticising Australia in so many areas when she should be just focusing in running her little town. She better hope it doesn’t go tits up in NZ because she’ll be in for a shock if she comes grovelling to us.

Ok well Aussie leaders should just shut their mouths about every international issue, including ones that have a direct impact on Australians?

Ok. Good to know.

 

[bad boy bubby]

Oh for those dark days when the biggest issue was Morrison getting funding for security cameras for the church
Thems were the daze

 

[wibble]

Oh so now I’m a bad character because I called your mate out for bringing religion into a deportation of kiwi criminals argument? Not above name calling are you?

Yes. Calling him a bigot for calling the PM on his hypocrisy is silly. The fact that you persisted with it shows you aren't here to have rational discussion.

I won't resort to cheap memes, if that's what you mean. If I think you have shown poor character, I will explain where and point it out. Same with your lying.

If you call that "name calling" in the same category as the people here who say we are "bed wetters", that is another reflection on you.

 

[wibble]

You supposed correctly .
There’s your answer.
So no need to ask any other questions.

Ok then. So that must be a very tiny category of people though.

Those who don't like the taste of meat but do want to eat something that tastes exactly like meat.

I agree, that is unusual.

Most the others though who don't like the thought of eating animals but do like the thought of eating something that tastes like animals, probably don't mind the thought of the taste of animals.

 

[taipan]

You are evading the point and shifting the burden of proof.

It is not up to me to explain Australia's strategy.

It was claimed the PM didn't have time to outline our strategy. I answered by saying if he has time to scold hoarders he has time to outline a strategy. To take that as meaning I applaud hoarders is just silly, and missing the point.

If the PM has had the Chief Medical Officer or Deputy by his side and doesn't wish to outline the strategy himself, they can do it. Washing hands and isolation are not a strategy. They are steps within a strategy, that has not been made clear. Reducing the spread of the disease is an aspiration, not a strategy.

You can repeat the word unknown as much as you like. All strategy relies on unknowns, until we invent time travel at least. If they have some idea of what they are doing they must have some idea of why they are doing it, but they are not sharing. Not the PM, or the Chief or Deputy Chief, the premiers, or the opposition.

You say the idea is to flatten the curve. How do you know this? Because you saw a meme? What is the government's goal in flattening the curve? Have they said, because I can't find it anywhere.

They will have goals and models, based on the research (hopefully, otherwise we really are f****d). They have flu pandemic response papers that they use models and prior research for, ready to implement a flu pandemic strategy. Even though the future of flu values is...unknown.

NZ published one model that was informing their decision making, with help from Australian epidemiologists, despite there being...unknowns in NZ too.

Which government app spells out the strategy? Sure, things are fluid. Do you think government strategy doesn't exist and they just react to each day as it comes?

You are bending over backwards to excuse their lack of communication.

We have not gone into lock down early, like so many other nations did. Did our PM just flip a coin to decide this? Did the Chief Medical Officer? Did they just say, we will wash hands a lot and things will be right?

I'd hope the government requirements from all the epidemiologists they employ, would be to both get off their a*ses and use research to formulate a plan. What is that plan? Why are you so happy to be kept in the dark about the single biggest issue we have faced since WW2?

I'm evading no such thing.I'm simply stating and I've just been watching the NY Governor Cuomo talking about modelling to what he expects numbers to be at such and such a time.
He stated with a rider, because it is CHANGING from day to day, so will the modelling.It's not a 2 plus 2 equals 4 situation.

The strategy is plain and simple to reduce exposure by self isolating,to get loons to keep 1.5m apart,
to keep essential services running, to keep as much as humanly possible people working such as in the building industry and transport.
"flip a coin" another simplistic silly comment The decisions were made by State premiers,Fed Govt, medical experts from each State and the Fed Govt. ScoMo passed on the decision to the media and public..

Flatten the curve has been brought up by every medical expert here, and I've been watching ch24 ABC just about every hour of the day for updates.Your meme comment about me is utter nonsense.I guess you have a medical degree, and know more than these experts.

I'll not only use the word unknown,I'll double down and call it UNPRECEDENTED.Unless of course you have experienced such a pandemic in your life prior.

All Govts are reacting each day to what the virus is doing and the stats provided.You need to speak to individual state Labor premiers ,as to why they change their methods almost on a daily basis. Albo et al concedes this.

NZ published one model, and they have had decent numbers of people flouting the isolation law.They are 5m tucked away on a little island.They don't have large numbers of tourists, backpackers or travellers, who travel hundreds or even thousands of Kms within their own country to help spread the disease.

Yeah I've seen the results of countries in early lockdown, and their death rates are skyrocketing.And compare our rates with those of overseas.

" Bending over backwards "LOL. I'm concerned about one thing, as I'm sure so is everyone else the safety of my family,I have a daughter working in the medical field ,and worry my guts out each day.
I couldn't give a stuff who was in Govt ,as long as the public were doing the right thing ,which was spelt out time and time again.Clearly some of them are not.

I'm apparently being kept in the dark yet ,some of your comments suggest I doubt you see the light of day. Seriously mate your moniker should be quibble not wibble.Your hatred of Morrison shines through like a beacon. I've bagged him re the bushfires, However IMO he is at least leading when it comes to the pandemic, that's not just my view.

And no amount of modelling will be effective ,if people carry on like loons.If you want to bag someone try the Qld Labor govt.for allowing staging council elections at such a time.

Perhaps you can exhaust your energy, writing to either your local Labor MP or indeed Albo and prob=vide them with your complaint.

 

[carcharias]

Ok then. So that must be a very tiny category of people though.

Those who don't like the taste of meat but do want to eat something that tastes exactly like meat.

I agree, that is unusual.

Most the others though who don't like the thought of eating animals but do like the thought of eating something that tastes like animals, probably don't mind the thought of the taste of animals.

I didn’t say that.

 

[Eion]

Yes. Calling him a bigot for calling the PM on his hypocrisy is silly. The fact that you persisted with it shows you aren't here to have rational discussion.

I won't resort to cheap memes, if that's what you mean. If I think you have shown poor character, I will explain where and point it out. Same with your lying.

If you call that "name calling" in the same category as the people here who say we are "bed wetters", that is another reflection on you.

Good. Well you are of poor character for validating a nazi argument against an individual. You’re also a crushing bore.

 

[Quicksilver]

Those who don't like the taste of meat but do want to eat something that tastes exactly like meat.

I agree, that is unusual..

Yes, it would be very odd for a person to do this.

I'm not sure why you'd even hate this small percentage of the population.

"Yeah, rather than eating this pumpkin that I do like, I'm going to eat this mushed up artificially flavoured dross that I don't like"

I mean, the punishment seems to be in the crime itself.

 

[taipan]

That isn’t bigoted. I think forgiveness is an admirable Christian quality. But I think he’s being insincere calling himself a Christian when he clearly does not hold a lot of the core philosophies. I didn’t know you could just turn off a deeply held belief. Are we really going that post modern?

Crap.The very concern about providing substantial sums of money to help people who may do extreme things after losing their jobs ,is an example of his concern about his fellow man.Things like domestic violence, the Black Dog.He is not sprouting his Christianity FFS at all.

Not once in any of his media pandemic announcements, has he brought it up.If you are going to tell porkies, work for News Ltd.

 

[wibble]

I didn’t say that.

Ok but when I clarified that this is what it would take to be hypocritical there, you agreed.

So we have to back up a step.

What is hypocritical about not wanting to eat meat but wanting to eat a meat flavoured substitute?

 

[carcharias]

Ok but when I clarified that this is what it would take to be hypocritical there, you agreed.

So we have to back up a step.

What is hypocritical about not wanting to eat meat but wanting to eat a meat flavoured substitute?

I already answered that , go back read it again
It’s clear why.
FFS