Southern Orcas

[Iafeta]

Another team in NZ would fail miserably...the player depth is not strong enough to produce an NRL side.

:|

Roy Asotasi, Sonny-Bill Williams etc., some of the best new names in the NRL come from New Zealand. One bad season by the Warriors is not a true indicator.

By the way, Auckland has 30,000 juniors alone. Penrith, the biggest Sydney juniors pool has 6,000.

Facts point completely the other way.

 

[Iafeta]

Wellington would work... but I just wish that News Ltd would link up with the NZRL and set up a separate comp over there. Then without the Warriors in the NRL we'd be left with 14 teams and could let both the GC and CC in.
---
imagine a club champions battle between the NRL premiers and NZ premiers, would be interesting. Plus there'd be more footy to watch on Pay tv throughout the year

Nah. I have looked forward to the Warriors last three home games for months.

Seeing greats like Lockyer, and finally getting another shot at the Roosters.

I enjoy watching all the greats, other than Bartercard level hacks.

You wouldn't be watching Bartercard Level "hacks". Also, wouldn't it be good for New Zealanders to have some local derbys? More footy at Carlaw Park (the home of NZRL). Also, test matches would really mean something. A pre-season knockout could take place with the 16 NRL teams and the new NZRL teams.

:lol: Because you are from Wollongong I'll break it to you gently, Carlaw Park is currently a car park :shock:

It would take the game in NZ so long to get up to NRL standard.

Besides, if Wellington got into the NRL. There wouldn't be a bigger local Derby than Auckland vs Wellington.

Maybe if you guys had a decent comp of your own that wouldn't of happened.

As always, the kiwis cling to australia's coat tails and want us to pull them along.

What a crock. Give yourself a quadruple. Here's an idea or two, A: Stop trying to pinch Kiwis for Origin duties, B: Then leave the Kiwis back in Bartercard instead of """riding our players coat-tails""".

Go join Gus Gould down at the Kings Cross Bistro and continue your thoughts in a "Why does international league blow so much" discussion that seemingly both of you would enjoy - then cross reference the question, sh!t, what have we done to help it out? We've stolen a few here, stolen a few there, our clubs have a quarter of them each .... hmmm, oh well, who's shout Gus?

 

[Iafeta]

Nice team, Man of Steel.

Go Illawarr-oh yeah.

oh wow. Knock my club. We still exist (but not standing alone in the NRL, though we'll be back - watch this space)

At least we never went bankrupt like the Auckland Warriors.

Neither technically did the Warriors. Close to, not quite.

Guarantee Illawarra will not be back in the next quarter of a century.

 

[Man_of_Steel_1982]

Nice team, Man of Steel.

Go Illawarr-oh yeah.

oh wow. Knock my club. We still exist (but not standing alone in the NRL, though we'll be back - watch this space)

At least we never went bankrupt like the Auckland Warriors.

Neither technically did the Warriors. Close to, not quite.

Guarantee Illawarra will not be back in the next quarter of a century.

Firstly, the Auckland Warriors did fold. Their debt was bought out by a new mob, hence the name change. They went bankrupt.
Secondly, don't be too sure. You may be surprised what's brewing in the 'Gong.
Thirdly, the Steelers point has nothing to do with my original argument that it would be better for NZ to work towards establishing a strong NZ league.

 

[playdaball]

NZ 'er speaking here ...

Gold Coast and Central Coast should be be accepted into the NRL way before Wellington. I am unsure if we have the talent (quality not quantity), enough sponsors - forget this so called Belgian investor & REGULAR crowd support - not one off games.

We currently have one team who are averaging crowds of around 6500.

 

[Te Kaha]

Nice team, Man of Steel.

Go Illawarr-oh yeah.

oh wow. Knock my club. We still exist (but not standing alone in the NRL, though we'll be back - watch this space)

At least we never went bankrupt like the Auckland Warriors.

Neither technically did the Warriors. Close to, not quite.

Guarantee Illawarra will not be back in the next quarter of a century.

Firstly, the Auckland Warriors did fold. Their debt was bought out by a new mob, hence the name change. They went bankrupt.
Secondly, don't be too sure. You may be surprised what's brewing in the 'Gong.
Thirdly, the Steelers point has nothing to do with my original argument that it would be better for NZ to work towards establishing a strong NZ league.

Fool!!!!!

It cant be done while Aussie and Brit clubs take all the best talent. With out the money to keep the players they will continue to go overseas. But without the talent there will be no way to get the money.

 

[Man_of_Steel_1982]

[quote="Te Kaha

Thats the biggest pile of bullsh*t I have read in years. If the Aussie and Brit clubs would stop raping the NZ domestic comp of players a viable domestic comp may have survived. With the amount of youngsters taken out each year there will NEVER a comparable NZ comp. Australian clubs self interest will prevent this.

This is very true but if set up properly with stipulations that NZ players aren't allowed to head to Australia or England to play or even better the NRL and ERL stipulates that no NZer's are eligible top play in our competitions. A well run NZ comp could also see some OZ players head across to play in the NZ comp.

It will benefit the NZ national side in the long run as well I think.

I don't know about not letting them leave, but maybe something that discourages them playing ESL or NRL.

But i think in the long run NZ would become stronger and rival us.

 

[AuckMel]

The only way to stop the flood is, to bring in transfer fees. Something you blokes would refuse to pay even though it would be of great benifit to the game in NZ.

BTW, The NZ Warriors did not pay the debts of the old Auckland Warriors club. All they did was purchase the NRL license off the NZRL and nothing else.

 

[NZ Warrior]

It's not like any of this matters, because the NRL will not admit any other teams for while yet.

Watch them stall and stutter over this one, it'll be 2006 before any decision is made.

 

[Bengal]

[quote="Te Kaha

Thats the biggest pile of bullsh*t I have read in years. If the Aussie and Brit clubs would stop raping the NZ domestic comp of players a viable domestic comp may have survived. With the amount of youngsters taken out each year there will NEVER a comparable NZ comp. Australian clubs self interest will prevent this.

This is very true but if set up properly with stipulations that NZ players aren't allowed to head to Australia or England to play or even better the NRL and ERL stipulates that no NZer's are eligible top play in our competitions. A well run NZ comp could also see some OZ players head across to play in the NZ comp.

It will benefit the NZ national side in the long run as well I think.

I don't know about not letting them leave, but maybe something that discourages them playing ESL or NRL.

But i think in the long run NZ would become stronger and rival us.

A good way of discouraging NZ League talent would be to get rid of the Warriors. From this point (with Kiwis not having a visible League road to aspire to) Union will be in an even better position to attract potential playing talent (five VISIBLE pathways beats no VISIBLE pathways)

League will die, Union will grow stronger, the NRL will grow weaker because -
1) there will be a hundred odd players of lesser quality running around the NRL
2) no-one in NZ would give a flying-f*ck about the NRL anymore thanks in no small part to the lack of Kiwi involvement.
With this in mind the TV rights and any sponsorshop negotiations will be of lesser value.

From here with a weakened competition, soft income projections and a falling potential audience (that being the NZ component) the NRL will be less able to fight off advances from competitors.
Getting rid of New Zealand, all in all is quite a rosy thought if you're not a league fan.

 

[Man_of_Steel_1982]

[quote="Te Kaha

Thats the biggest pile of bullsh*t I have read in years. If the Aussie and Brit clubs would stop raping the NZ domestic comp of players a viable domestic comp may have survived. With the amount of youngsters taken out each year there will NEVER a comparable NZ comp. Australian clubs self interest will prevent this.

This is very true but if set up properly with stipulations that NZ players aren't allowed to head to Australia or England to play or even better the NRL and ERL stipulates that no NZer's are eligible top play in our competitions. A well run NZ comp could also see some OZ players head across to play in the NZ comp.

It will benefit the NZ national side in the long run as well I think.

I don't know about not letting them leave, but maybe something that discourages them playing ESL or NRL.

But i think in the long run NZ would become stronger and rival us.

A good way of discouraging NZ League talent would be to get rid of the Warriors. From this point (with Kiwis not having a visible League road to aspire to) Union will be in an even better position to attract potential playing talent (five VISIBLE pathways beats no VISIBLE pathways)

League will die, Union will grow stronger, the NRL will grow weaker because -
1) there will be a hundred odd players of lesser quality running around the NRL
2) no-one in NZ would give a flying-f*ck about the NRL anymore thanks in no small part to the lack of Kiwi involvement.
With this in mind the TV rights and any sponsorshop negotiations will be of lesser value.

From here with a weakened competition, soft income projections and a falling potential audience (that being the NZ component) the NRL will be less able to fight off advances from competitors.
Getting rid of New Zealand, all in all is quite a rosy thought if you're not a league fan.

:roll:

Let me spell it out... Big investment from News ltd (50% owners of NRL and run the ESL). 6-8 teams (more than the 5 super 12 teams... more "pathways") and LONG TERM. This would stop the immediate player drain, then things like transfer fees (as someone mentioned) and a strengthening market would see this eventually become a success. Even players playing in the NRL may decide to finish with a season or 2 in this NZ comp.

Play against the NRL teams in preseason in a combined preseason comp. Play a 3 test series mid-year. Have a World CC between the ESL, NRL and NZ champions. Even play the event in NZ. These sort of things would see League take off.

In the long run everyone would benefit.

 

[Te Kaha]

[quote="Te Kaha

Thats the biggest pile of bullsh*t I have read in years. If the Aussie and Brit clubs would stop raping the NZ domestic comp of players a viable domestic comp may have survived. With the amount of youngsters taken out each year there will NEVER a comparable NZ comp. Australian clubs self interest will prevent this.

This is very true but if set up properly with stipulations that NZ players aren't allowed to head to Australia or England to play or even better the NRL and ERL stipulates that no NZer's are eligible top play in our competitions. A well run NZ comp could also see some OZ players head across to play in the NZ comp.

It will benefit the NZ national side in the long run as well I think.

I don't know about not letting them leave, but maybe something that discourages them playing ESL or NRL.

But i think in the long run NZ would become stronger and rival us.

A good way of discouraging NZ League talent would be to get rid of the Warriors. From this point (with Kiwis not having a visible League road to aspire to) Union will be in an even better position to attract potential playing talent (five VISIBLE pathways beats no VISIBLE pathways)

League will die, Union will grow stronger, the NRL will grow weaker because -
1) there will be a hundred odd players of lesser quality running around the NRL
2) no-one in NZ would give a flying-f*ck about the NRL anymore thanks in no small part to the lack of Kiwi involvement.
With this in mind the TV rights and any sponsorshop negotiations will be of lesser value.

From here with a weakened competition, soft income projections and a falling potential audience (that being the NZ component) the NRL will be less able to fight off advances from competitors.
Getting rid of New Zealand, all in all is quite a rosy thought if you're not a league fan.

:roll:

Let me spell it out... Big investment from News ltd (50% owners of NRL and run the ESL). 6-8 teams (more than the 5 super 12 teams... more "pathways") and LONG TERM. This would stop the immediate player drain, then things like transfer fees (as someone mentioned) and a strengthening market would see this eventually become a success. Even players playing in the NRL may decide to finish with a season or 2 in this NZ comp.

Play against the NRL teams in preseason in a combined preseason comp. Play a 3 test series mid-year. Have a World CC between the ESL, NRL and NZ champions. Even play the event in NZ. These sort of things would see League take off.

In the long run everyone would benefit.

Let me spell it out for you.... NEWS LIMITED WONT BE INTERESTED.

Therfore you idea wont work!!!!!

 

[Bengal]

So you think News would fund a NZ comp? Do you honestly think that would happen?
Would they weaken one competition (the NRL) in the hope of strengthening or more to point establishing another? Why would they want to sink money into another competition, when they already have a good hold on the Kiwi market thanks to the Super 12 and Tri-nations?
Forget it; it’s all baloney!
It would not be a viable investment for starters…

You may have League’s best interests at heart, but the Superleague vision had more merit to it than this!

 

[Iafeta]

Nice team, Man of Steel.

Go Illawarr-oh yeah.

oh wow. Knock my club. We still exist (but not standing alone in the NRL, though we'll be back - watch this space)

At least we never went bankrupt like the Auckland Warriors.

Neither technically did the Warriors. Close to, not quite.

Guarantee Illawarra will not be back in the next quarter of a century.

Firstly, the Auckland Warriors did fold. Their debt was bought out by a new mob, hence the name change. They went bankrupt.
Secondly, don't be too sure. You may be surprised what's brewing in the 'Gong.
Thirdly, the Steelers point has nothing to do with my original argument that it would be better for NZ to work towards establishing a strong NZ league.

Incorrect. The Warriors did not fold. They were extremely close, but not technically bankrupt. Cullen Investments only bought the license, not the previous debt and certainly did not buy a bankrupt club.

 

[Man_of_Steel_1982]

They bought the license and as I now understand the Auckland debt was not bought out or taken over. Hence, the Auckland Warriors group went bankrupt and the club folded. Then a new mob came along and set up with the same name "warriors".

 

[Man_of_Steel_1982]

[quote="Te Kaha

Thats the biggest pile of bullsh*t I have read in years. If the Aussie and Brit clubs would stop raping the NZ domestic comp of players a viable domestic comp may have survived. With the amount of youngsters taken out each year there will NEVER a comparable NZ comp. Australian clubs self interest will prevent this.

This is very true but if set up properly with stipulations that NZ players aren't allowed to head to Australia or England to play or even better the NRL and ERL stipulates that no NZer's are eligible top play in our competitions. A well run NZ comp could also see some OZ players head across to play in the NZ comp.

It will benefit the NZ national side in the long run as well I think.

I don't know about not letting them leave, but maybe something that discourages them playing ESL or NRL.

But i think in the long run NZ would become stronger and rival us.

A good way of discouraging NZ League talent would be to get rid of the Warriors. From this point (with Kiwis not having a visible League road to aspire to) Union will be in an even better position to attract potential playing talent (five VISIBLE pathways beats no VISIBLE pathways)

League will die, Union will grow stronger, the NRL will grow weaker because -
1) there will be a hundred odd players of lesser quality running around the NRL
2) no-one in NZ would give a flying-f*ck about the NRL anymore thanks in no small part to the lack of Kiwi involvement.
With this in mind the TV rights and any sponsorshop negotiations will be of lesser value.

From here with a weakened competition, soft income projections and a falling potential audience (that being the NZ component) the NRL will be less able to fight off advances from competitors.
Getting rid of New Zealand, all in all is quite a rosy thought if you're not a league fan.

:roll:

Let me spell it out... Big investment from News ltd (50% owners of NRL and run the ESL). 6-8 teams (more than the 5 super 12 teams... more "pathways") and LONG TERM. This would stop the immediate player drain, then things like transfer fees (as someone mentioned) and a strengthening market would see this eventually become a success. Even players playing in the NRL may decide to finish with a season or 2 in this NZ comp.

Play against the NRL teams in preseason in a combined preseason comp. Play a 3 test series mid-year. Have a World CC between the ESL, NRL and NZ champions. Even play the event in NZ. These sort of things would see League take off.

In the long run everyone would benefit.

Let me spell it out for you.... NEWS LIMITED WONT BE INTERESTED.

Therfore you idea wont work!!!!!

it would start as a small investment and eventually pay big dividends with internationals, a WCC, and pre-seasons combined with the NRL teams. And i'm only thowing around the idea of it being News Ltd. It could easily be another investor.

 

[carlnz]

Go the Orcas!!!!!!!!!

 

[wydie]

I support A Wellington franchise for the following reasons:

Wellington and New Zealand in general certainly have the depth of players, and it would help steem the flow of promising young NZers heading to Australia or England to get a look in at the professional level. See following article on how NZ is bleading players overseas: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sports/sp...section=general In the last year the Warriors have also lost Logan Swann, Ali, Fa'afili, Seu Seu to England, who could have been picked up by a Wellington side. Stephen Kearney, Paul Whatuira and Vince Mellars are players who could be tempted to head back home to Wellington.

It would make the NRL and ultimately league in general more international. Given the relative populations of the two countries, NZ should really have 3 teams in a 16 team competition. Its interesting to note that when the Super 12 was set up there were serious reservations about whether a third Aussie side should be admitted. All the arguments that were run against the ACT Brumbies getting in to Super 12 seem to now being run against Wellington, yet we know what a success ACT became.

The Warriors failure this year shows that NZ need another club to draw players from when things aren't going right with the Warriors. Its just too much to expect the Warriors to be NZ rugby league.

Wellington is a respected league area in NZ. Its population can easily support an NRL side. It is the home of the junior champions and had 8 players in the Junior kiwis this weekend match against the English U18s.
Wellington has a wonderful stadium that's matched by few other venues in the NRL.

The city has an attitude of making things a success. The councils have committed to building further training grounds and other facilities for a Wellington side. The Wellington bids backer is a billionaire (although undisclosed who it is).

Wellington's location will be a god send for supporters of league in the lower North Island and the South Island too, and there are lots of us. 20,000 plus supporters for the early Bulldogs/Warriors games and the Kiwi tests. The crowd numbers fell off this year, but there are a number of reasons for this. The impetus is still there to keep growing the region.

 

[mightybears]

it would be good for the kiwis to have a second team, wydie and i agree with what you say re the bid, but when the backer is a billionaire, but a mystery you have wonder if there actually is such a person

what colours would the team wear, as the auckland warriors went away from auckland blue and effectively pinched the nz colours when they became the new zealand warriors?

best result [i know it won't happen] all 3 bids get in to the nrl for 2006!

 

[t-ba]

I support A Wellington franchise for the following reasons:

Wellington and New Zealand in general certainly have the depth of players, and it would help steem the flow of promising young NZers heading to Australia or England to get a look in at the professional level. See following article on how NZ is bleading players overseas: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sports/sp...section=general In the last year the Warriors have also lost Logan Swann, Ali, Fa'afili, Seu Seu to England, who could have been picked up by a Wellington side. Stephen Kearney, Paul Whatuira and Vince Mellars are players who could be tempted to head back home to Wellington.

It would make the NRL and ultimately league in general more international. Given the relative populations of the two countries, NZ should really have 3 teams in a 16 team competition. Its interesting to note that when the Super 12 was set up there were serious reservations about whether a third Aussie side should be admitted. All the arguments that were run against the ACT Brumbies getting in to Super 12 seem to now being run against Wellington, yet we know what a success ACT became.

The Warriors failure this year shows that NZ need another club to draw players from when things aren't going right with the Warriors. Its just too much to expect the Warriors to be NZ rugby league.

Wellington is a respected league area in NZ. Its population can easily support an NRL side. It is the home of the junior champions and had 8 players in the Junior kiwis this weekend match against the English U18s.
Wellington has a wonderful stadium that's matched by few other venues in the NRL.

The city has an attitude of making things a success. The councils have committed to building further training grounds and other facilities for a Wellington side. The Wellington bids backer is a billionaire (although undisclosed who it is).

Wellington's location will be a god send for supporters of league in the lower North Island and the South Island too, and there are lots of us. 20,000 plus supporters for the early Bulldogs/Warriors games and the Kiwi tests. The crowd numbers fell off this year, but there are a number of reasons for this. The impetus is still there to keep growing the region.

. Sums it up.

It sickens me that the odds are no one will get a license when there are 3 bids who would all be bona fide successes. Time for the NRL to stop treating the Sydney Clubs like Little Babies. Sink or swin.