Stalled and stagnant Sydney clubs

[Wb1234]

I

I don’t think a Sydney team will die because of the increased grants but that doesn’t mean that about 3 or 4 teams shouldn’t want or need to become bigger in terms of corporate involvement, memberships and attendances.

can think of many teams you can say this about

storm, raiders, knights, titans and cowboys too.

 

[Colk]

Tigers vs south’s
Now dragons vs roosters

without these classic games where would the game be in this country ?

imagine the game has to rely upon cowboys vs raiders it storm vs titans to be a big sport In Australia

Cowboys and Storm (the latter in particular) have more supporters than any of the Sydney sides, so I don’t understand your point.

You can bemoan that as much as you want from the viewpoint of a traditionalist but the only thing that counts, considering we are selling a product in a free market economy, are numbers of supporters and viewer numbers.

 

[Colk]

I

can think of many teams you can say this about

storm, raiders, knights, titans and cowboys too.

Storm have the highest membership of any club, they make a profit and they draw ok crowds. They also have high viewer numbers and in a very important market. They are the least of the game’s problems.

Raiders have higher membership numbers than any Sydney club barring Parra and Souths. They are also financially secure. They could still do better.

Knights always have very strong crowds and have some financial security. The area, including the Hunter Valley is also growing tremendously. They should be fine.

Titans, I agree with you. If they get some on field success that might improve though.

Cowboys again have very good support and always have good crowds. Their viewer numbers are higher than most, if not all the Sydney clubs. Again they are not a problem

 

[Wb1234]

Cowboys and Storm (the latter in particular) have more supporters than any of the Sydney sides, so I don’t understand your point.

You can bemoan that as much as you want from the viewpoint of a traditionalist but the only thing that counts, considering we are selling a product in a free market economy, are numbers of supporters and viewer numbers.

Your post talked about making clubs bigger. Every club I mentioned needs to do this

 

[Perth Red]

bro please


Ok then maybe you should go on big footy and tell them this. Because without your help they won’t work it out themselves

Maybe someone is? Then again they haven’t let their overstauration stunt their investment in an aggressive expansion strategy so maybe they don’t care so much given it hasn’t held them back like it has us?

 

[Perth Red]

Tigers vs south’s
Now dragons vs roosters

without these classic games where would the game be in this country ?

imagine the game has to rely upon cowboys vs raiders it storm vs titans to be a big sport In Australia

haha nice cherry picking, how about sharks v manly in front of 9k or dragons v knights in front of 11k. Or dogs v panthers in front of 11k or any of the other multiple sub 12kmcrowds we’ve seen with Sydney clubs this year?
ironically you’ve mentioned two of the most valuable clubs to TV in the Storm and cowboys lol

 

[Colk]

Your post talked about making clubs bigger. Every club I mentioned needs to do this

I responded to your point. Some regional clubs do, Gold Coast the most pressing example ; however the majority of those clubs have higher memberships, attendances or viewers than Sydney clubs.

If you want to engage in whataboutism I’ll go through the Sydney clubs

Roosters, Manly, Penrith and Sharks have very low supporter or membership numbers. Roosters’ and Manly’s numbers are particularly damning and inexcusable, considering the amount of success they have had over the last 20 years. I don’t know how you make them bigger because if they can’t grow in times of on field success, when will they be able to?

Penrith have room for growth considering the area’s growth and their strategy of connecting to Greater Western NSW. They are at least attempting to be bigger, so good on them.

Sharks I hope will become bigger and maybe they can translate their off field financial growth to supporter and membership numbers. Let’s hope so.

Tigers have good support, particularly when considering their lack of on field success. I could say the same about the Dragons and Bulldogs. I have at least seen those three teams have good support when they have gone well.

Souths and Parra are the only real examples of very good support in Sydney. They should be the minimum of what all Sydney clubs should be trying to attain.

 

[The Great Dane]

Your post talked about making clubs bigger. Every club I mentioned needs to do this

The only reasonable way to compare these things between markets is to compare the amount of supporters as a percentage of the population in each market, and given what data we have all the regional clubs punch way above their weight in those metrics.

 

[The Great Dane]

This is the most insane post I have seen. Is this a troll or does somebody actually believe this?

Siv absolutely believes everything he says.

The guy wishes the we could turn time back to the 60s.

 

[Perth Red]

Again the advantage Sydney clubs have over everyone else in the comp is the availability of away club fans at numerous games during the season. Nrl needs to get scheduling back from tv as much as possible to schedule these all Sydney games at times that both sets of fans can attend and clubs need to sort out ticketing to make it very affordable for members of the away club to attend these games, do that and you’d instantly see a boost to crowds without any real effort!

ideally you’d have games at commbank, alliance and Accor (if we mustj on Friday and Saturday night. Outer rim games at the likes of manly, penrith, Cronulla and win on Saturday and Sunday afternoons.

any Thursday night games in Sydney to feature out of town teams only

 

[ash the bash]

On a side note, how is the Storm crowd and atmosphere compared to the "super round". Interesting to notice the corporate areas too..

I recall a Peter Fitzimmons article when the Rebels were starting talking about the end of the Storm. As Melbourne was a union city and the Storm would have to move to QLD.

 

[The Great Dane]

Again the advantage Sydney clubs have over everyone else in the comp is the availability of away club fans at numerous games during the season. Nrl needs to get scheduling back from tv as much as possible to schedule these all Sydney games at times that both sets of fans can attend and clubs need to sort out ticketing to make it very affordable for members of the away club to attend these games, do that and you’d instantly see a boost to crowds without any real effort!

ideally you’d have games at commbank, alliance and Accor (if we mustj on Friday and Saturday night. Outer rim games at the likes of manly, penrith, Cronulla and win on Saturday and Sunday afternoons.

any Thursday night games in Sydney to feature out of town teams only

Better scheduling will make little difference when 80-90% of the fans in Sydney outwardly refuse to travel no matter the conditions.

 

[Colk]

On a side note, how is the Storm crowd and atmosphere compared to the "super round". Interesting to notice the corporate areas too..

I recall a Peter Fitzimmons article when the Rebels were starting talking about the end of the Storm. As Melbourne was a union city and the Storm would have to move to QLD.

Peter Fitzsimmons is about as deluded as some of these supporters on this forum.

 

[Colk]

Siv absolutely believes everything he says.

The guy wishes the we could turn time back to the 60s.

Remarkable isn’t it. Some people just like to live in a world where facts don’t matter if it contests with their world view

 

[baselinepanther]

Cowboys and Storm (the latter in particular) have more supporters than any of the Sydney sides, so I don’t understand your point.

what utter nonsense

if you're going off that ridiculous survey where the Storm were declared as having the largest supporter base of any code in Australia , then you need a reality check.
That was just a heap of victorians being asked if they followed an NRL side ( most don't ) who would it be & they naturally answered the Storm. The reality is The Eels , Dragons etc & most Sydney sides have fans in every town & hamlet in NSW the ACT & QLD , like thousands

Hell when the Dragons are playing well & play in Canberra , they often outdraw the Raiders fans there are that many of them & thats the same for most of the Sydney sides

The Storm , a few dozen at best
the Cowboys .. not many more

TV ratings are further proof
so no , maybe with the exception of the Broncos , the large majority of NRL's fans still follow Sydneys sides

 

[Iamback]

Based on what analysis or potential.

If you are talking about Perth and Adelaide, two years in top flight competitions where their crowds were on average better than a majority of Sydney clubs?

Also you are comparing support to what? Sydney teams with memberships of around 15k and crowds that are often less than that? One city teams of populations of over 2 million and 1.5 million should be at least able to achieve that.

For areas like NZ 2 again you wouldn’t have to dream big to have crowds and memberships that high, particularly if they are competently run

On the Pacific Islands proposal. the question would be about money and investment, not support.

Every single NSW team has a COE and an U17's, U19's and u21's team.

Where would those 2 examples get 90 odd players a year to field those teams?

QLD sides work slightly different with the QRL aligned club doing the developing. But again all are aligned.

Financial support. Rich owners or Leagues Club ensures no one is going anywhere.

Melbourne with all of their success have still have failed to develop Victorian talent. It took 3 teams folding to start them off well.
Redcliffe and GC in RL heartlands have struggled attracting talent. Adelaide especially would struggle even more

So only using crowds is a small metric of success.

NZ 2 would be my next side in but that said.
Warriors have support but have had a few different owners. Never really had the on field success. Would NZ 2 be different?

Fiji in NSWRL and PNG in QCup are good test cases to see if it is possible but are a long term option

 

[baselinepanther]

Storm have the highest membership of any club

nope
Parramatta are the most , then Souths

I mean , you posted in the membership forum today , how do you not know that ?

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

I'm very disappointed with the Cowboys attendances, but I cannot blame people for not being as keen to go to the football in 2022 as they were in 1995. There's so many other forms of entertainment and the cost of living has skyrocketed. Match attendance is expensive and makes little sense for people who are already forking out more than $100 a month for pay TV and broadband.

Maybe the game needs more children's entertainment options at stadia to give families a reason to go to the football?

Maybe clubs could set up a membership program for kids that lets them watch the game from a corporate box fixed with games for them to play if they get bored. It could even be scheduled to last a whole day and be used as an alternative to childcare so that the parents can have some time to themselves. If it's held over a day then the kids could be given a toured guide to the entire stadium and allowed to kick a ball around the field.

 

[Colk]

what utter nonsense

if you're going off that ridiculous survey where the Storm were declared as having the largest supporter base of any code in Australia , then you need a reality check.
That was just a heap of victorians being asked if they followed an NRL side ( most don't ) who would it be & they naturally answered the Storm. The reality is The Eels , Dragons etc & most Sydney sides have fans in every town & hamlet in NSW the ACT & QLD , like thousands

Hell when the Dragons are playing well & play in Canberra , they often outdraw the Raiders fans there are that many of them & thats the same for most of the Sydney sides

The Storm , a few dozen at best
the Cowboys .. not many more

TV ratings are further proof
so no , maybe with the exception of the Broncos , the large majority of NRL's fans still follow Sydneys sides

Interesting.

Firstly I didn’t suggest that all Sydney sides have poor supporter numbers so before you rant read the whole of my post.

Secondly, where is your evidence to back up your claim? Almost all TV evidence is countering your claim. You can also easily view membership numbers, although I am sure that you’ll give me some counter argument that explains why the Roosters, Manly and Sharks for example have such terrible membership numbers. We can also go down the route of low attendance figures but again I am sure there is a counter argument that you can provide.

Thirdly you mention the Cowboys and the Storm and them not having support in NSW and ACT etc. You do realise there is a state called QLD right?

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

what utter nonsense

if you're going off that ridiculous survey where the Storm were declared as having the largest supporter base of any code in Australia , then you need a reality check.
That was just a heap of victorians being asked if they followed an NRL side ( most don't ) who would it be & they naturally answered the Storm. The reality is The Eels , Dragons etc & most Sydney sides have fans in every town & hamlet in NSW the ACT & QLD , like thousands

Hell when the Dragons are playing well & play in Canberra , they often outdraw the Raiders fans there are that many of them & thats the same for most of the Sydney sides

The Storm , a few dozen at best
the Cowboys .. not many more

TV ratings are further proof
so no , maybe with the exception of the Broncos , the large majority of NRL's fans still follow Sydneys sides

On the previous page I cited the TV ratings, by club, over a few years before COVID-19. The most watched teams were Broncos, Storm and Cowboys. Most Sydney teams drew lowish ratings.

Here's the post.

Stalled and stagnant Sydney clubs

imagine there was an afl fan from Newcastle (australia) going onto afl forums and telling them they should kill off some Melbourne teams for a Newcastle afl team. how do you think they would be perceived. That is a pretty interesting comparison. AFL crowd attendances and memberships are at...

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