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Superthread LXVI: Honouring Whinging Dragons Fans

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Drew-Sta

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That all makes sense, Drew. I need to think broader than the very rich Catholic and Protestant churches when considering chaplaincy.

I'm glad to help :) And happy to give you more info on it when you land in Sydney.

Well stated, but not my cup of tea. If parents want religious instruction, they should be responsible for it instead of fobbing it off on schools and taxpayers.

Sunday school, not actual school.

Yeah, I had a feeling that would be your view. I'm pretty flexible on it, and can see the view either way holding merit. The issue is, whether religion is your cup of tea or not, it is still present in the world and should in some way shape or form, be taught in schools at least from an education point of view. Kids growing up not know what a muslim or Christian believes is not going to help them when they meet real muslim's or Christians.

Who does the teaching on that is a very large question, though.

f**k that drew, you are our only connection to that particular view, share the shit out of it. We ain't gonna bash you for it.

Aww, thanks bro! That means a lot :D
 

Misanthrope

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I'd be more on board with religion being taught in school if it was all major religions being taught in an objective way. The way I recall it being, it was just the religion the chaplain preferred that was taught.
 

afinalsin666

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I like religion being taught in schools. Because when i went to school, my parents opted me out of scripture so i spent three hours every friday f**king around in the computer lab with my friends.
 

afinalsin666

First Grade
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I'd be more on board with religion being taught in school if it was all major religions being taught in an objective way. The way I recall it being, it was just the religion the chaplain preferred that was taught.

Ah ah, there's the rub. You can't teach religion in an objective way because everyone has an attachment to it one way or another. You could hand someone the books i guess, but that's not really teaching.
 

Drew-Sta

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I'd be more on board with religion being taught in school if it was all major religions being taught in an objective way. The way I recall it being, it was just the religion the chaplain preferred that was taught.

Ah ah, there's the rub. You can't teach religion in an objective way because everyone has an attachment to it one way or another. You could hand someone the books i guess, but that's not really teaching.

This is the issue. As AFS has said, religion should be taught by the adherents otherwise you never get the right side of it. Christianity taught by Richard Dawkins is far different to Christianity taught by a Chaplain, for example.

To my mind, each school should be visited by a chaplain who holds to Christianity, Hinduism, Buddhism, Islam, Judaism and Atheism (its funny saying Atheist Chaplain lol) so each are presented in the right light.

Of course, a strong subject on religious history should also be taught so people can see its impact in the world - both good and bad.

I'll bash Drew. For being a Dragons fan....

I'd say lol@pawwa, but we're going to get belted by you this week... :(
 

Misanthrope

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Ah ah, there's the rub. You can't teach religion in an objective way because everyone has an attachment to it one way or another. You could hand someone the books i guess, but that's not really teaching.

I don't agree. I studied religion academically at university. The lecturer had something of a hard on for Islam in a conceptual sense, but we still studied all of the major religions in a fairly objective way.

If it's taught like any other subject, I don't have an issue with it. I mean, history teachers are hardly teaching from experience.
 

afinalsin666

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I don't agree. I studied religion academically at university. The lecturer had something of a hard on for Islam in a conceptual sense, but we still studied all of the major religions in a fairly objective way.

If it's taught like any other subject, I don't have an issue with it. I mean, history teachers are hardly teaching from experience.

Yeah, academically at university. Most shit you study academically at university would be objective i'd assume. You'd also elect to study it, but people who would teach in random ass schools 9/10 wouldn't be objective about it.
 

RHCP

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If you want your kids to learn Religion, send them to a Catholic school (or other religious affiliation, I guess).

Or just buy them a book, it shouldn't be the responsibility of the government, at least not when we're in a "debt crisis"
 

Drew-Sta

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I don't agree. I studied religion academically at university. The lecturer had something of a hard on for Islam in a conceptual sense, but we still studied all of the major religions in a fairly objective way.

If it's taught like any other subject, I don't have an issue with it. I mean, history teachers are hardly teaching from experience.

I can see what you're saying. I just don't think we have enough teachers to do it 'academically'. Hence, chaplains are involved.

If you want your kids to learn Religion, send them to a Catholic school (or other religious affiliation, I guess).

Or just buy them a book, it shouldn't be the responsibility of the government, at least not when we're in a "debt crisis"

Catholic schools cost cash, mate. I know, I went to one.
 

Bulldog Force

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Indian call centres just rang my mobile. They offered me a job. Very kind of them. Basically I'll be doing crappy trainee type shit, and they'll be paying me a very generous $15 per hour. Outstanding.

Why don't I just give up my current job and take a great leap backwards in my career :D
 

Apey

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Well stated, but not my cup of tea. If parents want religious instruction, they should be responsible for it instead of fobbing it off on schools and taxpayers.

Sunday school, not actual school.

Agreed.

The issue is, whether religion is your cup of tea or not, it is still present in the world and should in some way shape or form, be taught in schools at least from an education point of view.

I don't think there are many who agree that religion has absolutely no place in school. I know I have no real problem with a religious studies type class. There are people out there who are genuinely interested in the culture of religion without being religious themselves. It's when you have one faith being put forward as the one true faith by some priest/minister for that religion that is completely unacceptable and is really just indoctrination (let's be honest here it's always the Christians :sarcasm:).

I'd be more on board with religion being taught in school if it was all major religions being taught in an objective way. The way I recall it being, it was just the religion the chaplain preferred that was taught.

This. Nothing wrong with objective religious studies.

I like religion being taught in schools. Because when i went to school, my parents opted me out of scripture so i spent three hours every friday f**king around in the computer lab with my friends.

I did scripture despite my family being non-religious (go figure), I still have a test I did (and failed) in year 8 or something that I should really scan and upload for the lols. :lol:

Ah ah, there's the rub. You can't teach religion in an objective way because everyone has an attachment to it one way or another. You could hand someone the books i guess, but that's not really teaching.

You can teach religion in an objective way. It's really as simple as prefacing stuff with "Christians believe" vs "And then this happened", i.e making it clear that these are people's beliefs and not factual.

This is the issue. As AFS has said, religion should be taught by the adherents otherwise you never get the right side of it. Christianity taught by Richard Dawkins is far different to Christianity taught by a Chaplain, for example.

Well this leads into another problem where you have a bazillion denominations of Christianity because people can't agree on what's right and what's wrong.

But anyway I agree to an extent except that I would say I think there would be teachers out there capable of teaching the 'basics' of a religion without being affiliated with that religion.

If you want your kids to learn Religion, send them to a Catholic school (or other religious affiliation, I guess).

Or just buy them a book, it shouldn't be the responsibility of the government, at least not when we're in a "debt crisis"

Ultimately I agree that religion is best left to the home, church etc and should not be taught in 'that' way at school. Objectively from a culture/ethics point of view only, maybe.

Still, with all that being said, I feel like I'm extending an olive branch a bit. Besides the culture/history/ethics part of it, I personally think teaching about what's left (i.e what the believers believe) is a complete waste of time and a detriment to society, but I can't say it'd bother me enough to vehemently oppose it.
 
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Misanthrope

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If you want your kids to learn Religion, send them to a Catholic school (or other religious affiliation, I guess).

Or just buy them a book, it shouldn't be the responsibility of the government, at least not when we're in a "debt crisis"

Well, why is it the government's job to teach art, drama, or history? It's a dark hole to go down.

I have no objection to the teaching of religion is a study of the concept in a broad sense. I have an issue with government funding for any one religion to recruit, though.
 

Rhino_NQ

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letter of offer recieved!!!

Found out one of my references just smashed me, i'll bide my time but he'll get what's coming to him
 

Misanthrope

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letter of offer recieved!!!

Found out one of my references just smashed me, i'll bide my time but he'll get what's coming to him

I'm curious about letters of reference etc. In the US, I believe, references are not allowed to rubbish you to a potential employer. If they didn't like you, the most they can say is to confirm you did indeed work for them. That lets the potential employer read what they'd like into the lack of praise.

Is this not the case in Oz?
 

Rhino_NQ

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I'm curious about letters of reference etc. In the US, I believe, references are not allowed to rubbish you to a potential employer. If they didn't like you, the most they can say is to confirm you did indeed work for them. That lets the potential employer read what they'd like into the lack of praise.

Is this not the case in Oz?

im not sure, here they just ring the refererr up and ask a few questions.
 

Apey

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Well, why is it the government's job to teach art, drama, or history? It's a dark hole to go down.

I have no objection to the teaching of religion is a study of the concept in a broad sense. I have an issue with government funding for any one religion to recruit, though.

I probably forgot to make the distinction between compulsory/core subjects and elective subjects in my post, hence why it may seem a bit all over the place. As far as elective objective religious studies, go nuts. Compulsory/core; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1eO3XmuVry4

Religion has huge ties to each of the subjects you mentioned, too.
 
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