Swimming

[Shorty]

No doubt it is great to watch him race. Just as I loved watching Armstrong in the TdF. The fact that all of his Jamaican team mates have been done is a little bit suspect.

I will never forget the Memo Heredia (infamous PEDs chemist and manufacture) interview I read years ago where he said every finalist in the mens 100m at Beijing would not be clean. He was the guy who helped Marion Jones and a host of others, including Maurice Greene.

So where are his positive tests then?
Competed in 4 olympics now, shouldn't there be one?

 

[lockyno1]

I never said swimming was immune to PEDs. But how many Olympic blue ribbon event winners in the past 30 years have been done for PEDs and had Olympic medals stripped compared to athletics? The answer is f**k all Your Honour.

You actually think these athletes are clean in the past. I don't agree but each to their own. They were just on something that wasn't detectable, and that goes for every single sport in every single discipline. Plenty of swimmers have massive question marks, and as for the Blue Ribbon events, what about the 1500m...need a reminder of who won the last Olympics?

 

[T-Boon]

Hmmm Phelps trained for 200m not the 205m fly. Maybe that's where the Japanese bloke went wrong.

Yep she did. Hosszu also won again.

haha, thats good.

 

[Frankus]

So where are his positive tests then?
Competed in 4 olympics now, shouldn't there be one?

Mate, I'm not knocking your idol, I just think it is suss. Justin Gatlin, Powell, The Beast, etc all on drugs don't even get close to Bolt. Bolt could just be an extreme outlier of human performance but I am a scientist and often skeptical.

Where are Marion Jones positive tests?

I'll PM you the interview link - pretty interesting to be honest.

 

[Twizzle]

Its hard to compare Phelps and swimming to other sports, he is no doubt the best swimmer ever.

Swimmers can win 4 medals in 4 days and some are relays and its not necessarily their doing that they won gold.

Compare that to team sports where they play for 2 weeks to fight for one gold medal. Some sailors, equestrian riders and shooters have competed in 5 or 6 games, swimmers will never be able to do that.

 

[Shorty]

Mate, I'm not knocking your idol, I just think it is suss. Justin Gatlin, Powell, The Beast, etc all on drugs don't even get close to Bolt. Bolt could just be an extreme outlier of human performance but I am a scientist and often skeptical.

Where are Marion Jones positive tests?

I'll PM you the interview link - pretty interesting to be honest.

I don't think you can compare Marion Jones to Usain Bolt.
She had accusations for years, as did Lance Armstrong, I encourage you to try and find anything on Bolt.
Like I said first Olympics 2004 and is competing in Rio, 12 years....you'd have thought they'd have found something by now?

And let's not pretend he'd be protected due to his stature, Maria Sharapova got done and her brand is huge.
I think people are just cynical, I don't blame them, but I'll remain unconvinced until Bolt at least has a scandal attached.

 

[Frankus]

You actually think these athletes are clean in the past. I don't agree but each to their own. They were just on something that wasn't detectable, and that goes for every single sport in every single discipline. Plenty of swimmers have massive question marks, and as for the Blue Ribbon events, what about the 1500m...need a reminder of who won the last Olympics?

I wouldn't consider the 1500 free a blue ribbon event. No one outside of Australia really gives a toss about it. Boring race to be honest. I was specifically referring to the 100m sprint in track and 50-100m free in swimming.

And yep Sun Yan tested positive; If his tests from London and current olympics, can't say I see any difference from the likes of Gatlin, Gay, et al. Not saying I agree (I've made it clear I don't) with it but rules are rules.

 

[Shorty]

Its hard to compare Phelps and swimming to other sports, he is no doubt the best swimmer ever.

Swimmers can win 4 medals in 4 days and some are relays and its not necessarily their doing that they won gold.

Compare that to team sports where they play for 2 weeks to fight for one gold medal. Some sailors, equestrian riders and shooters have competed in 5 or 6 games, swimmers will never be able to do that.

And gymnastics, where it is quite possibly the most pressured filled environment that you will ever encounter because even a slight incorrect form will get your points docked.

For a long time I considered Nadia Comenaci the best olympian of all time (perfect 10!).

 

[Frankus]

Its hard to compare Phelps and swimming to other sports, he is no doubt the best swimmer ever.

Swimmers can win 4 medals in 4 days and some are relays and its not necessarily their doing that they won gold.

Compare that to team sports where they play for 2 weeks to fight for one gold medal. Some sailors, equestrian riders and shooters have competed in 5 or 6 games, swimmers will never be able to do that.

This is Phelps 5th games champ

Edit: How many of the horses have been to 5 or 6 games?

 

[Twizzle]

and he wont see a 6th

hang on, he's 31, so you saying he started at the Olympics when he was 11 ?

scratch that, 15

 

[Frankus]

and he wont see a 6th

hang on, he's 31, so you saying he started at the Olympics when he was 11 ?

scratch that, 15

Correct - where he finished 5th in the 200 fly at Sydney. The youngest male Olympic swimmer in 70 years or something.

 

[Tommy Smith]

Lol Twizzles maths.

5 Olympics...

2000 2004 2008 2012 2016

16 year span.

Ooh you edited just in time

I had no idea he competed in Sydney. I wonder how many people knew then just how good he'd be.

 

[Shorty]

This is Phelps 5th games champ

Edit: How many of the horses have been to 5 or 6 games?

Again have to show my gymnastics bias here, there's a gymnast (she's 41) competing in her 7th olympics.
And she'll compete for a 9th gold medal.

 

[Frankus]

Lol Twizzles maths.

5 Olympics...

2000 2004 2008 2012 2016

16 year span.

Ooh you edited just in time

I had no idea he competed in Sydney. I wonder how many people knew then just how good he'd be.

Considering as a 15 year old he made that final and was still going to grow, most in swimming circles knew he was the US's answer to Thorpe. Exceeded everyone's expectations.

 

[Frankus]

Again have to show my gymnastics bias here, there's a gymnast (she's 41) competing in her 7th olympics.
And she'll compete for a 9th gold medal.

Damn. That's one helluvan effort.

 

[Tommy Smith]

Fwiw I think it's folly trying to compare Olympians across sports to determine who's the greatest of all-time.

How do you measure the achievements of the likes of Paavo Nurmi, Nadia Comăneci, Alexander Karelin, Steve Redgrave, Michael Phelps and Usain Bolt - just to name a few - not only across disciplines but also across generations?

Throw in Olympians like Jesse Owens who achieved remarkable feats in truly adverse circumstances, and the criteria to compare one with the other becomes even more futile.

 

[Tommy Smith]

Just on athletics, how do you even compare a sprinter with a long or middle distance runner?

Bolt might have more Gold across Olympics, but I couldn't say he's greater than Michael Johnson (the 200m & 400m double is truly remarkable) or Hicham El Guerrouj.

Bolt might be more spectacular, but El Guerrouj is an equally remarkable athlete imo.

 

[Shorty]

Damn. That's one helluvan effort.

Sorry my bad, she's only won 1 gold!
The article I was reading was the daily fail.

Either way there are a few sports where you can repeatedly compete in olympics, think one of our Aussie rowers in Athens was competing at a 5th or 6th olympics.

 

[Shorty]

Just on athletics, how do you even compare a sprinter with a long or middle distance runner?

Bolt might have more Gold across Olympics, but I couldn't say he's greater than Michael Johnson (the 200m & 400m double is truly remarkable) or Hicham El Guerrouj.

Bolt might be more spectacular, but El Guerrouj is an equally remarkable athlete imo.

Mostly because Bolt doesn't fit the stereotype size of a sprinter, sort of like if McEvoy were to win the 50m free twice and be competing for a 3rd time.

Jonhson's running gait is weird af.

 

[Frankus]

Good point Tommy. In 100 years the human race will be looking back at the world record progression in things like 100m sprint and laughing at 9.5 and saying how slow Bolt was. Always difficult to compare eras within the same sport without throwing different sports into the mix.

E.g. At my best I would been in the medals at the Mexico City Olympics and made finals in Munich and I'm a nobody.