The annual finals system debate thread

[Anon]

One major flaw in the Mcintyre system is that to win the premiership a team does not necessarily have to beat the minor premiers.

 

[Dazraider]

tigers had that game won so its their own fault if manly win today and they are knocked out but if they play raiders next week they are 2 and 0 this year so they will go into the game very confident

 

[Gaba]

To all the McIntyre apologists saying it's all about winning, the Tigers deserve to be bundled out after one loss etc,

Tell that to Melboune 1999, belted in week 1 eventual premiers

and

North Queensland 2005 (5th) beaten 50-6 in week 1, grand finalists.

That's just off the top of my head I'm sure there are other examples.

Meanwhile in 2010 the possibility that equal 2nd ( 3rd on f/a) and 2 points from 1st team, beaten in Golden Point, could be eliminated after 1 loss.

Yep fantastically fair finals system!

NOT!

In the grand final if team 5,6,7,8 win it , should it be replayed again because team 1,2,3,4 lost.

 

[_Johnsy]

you need to win regardless of your position on the table.

You MUST finish 1 or 2 to be assured a 2nd chance. If you dont you must win every game to ensure your survival. It's not as if the NRL only advised the clubs of this friday afternoon.

FFS, whinge whinge whinge. if the tigers won this thread would not exist.

 

[flamin]

Premierships in Australian sport are influenced so much by luck. We need a finals system that takes out as much of this as possible instead of promoting it by teams having to rely on other games to got their way.

The finals system should reward where you finish - team 7 and 8 should never get to host a home final - otherwise we may as well forget the regular season and have a 5 week knock out comp.

 

[Gaba]

The finals system should reward where you finish - team 7 and 8 should never get to host a home final - otherwise we may as well forget the regular season and have a 5 week knock out comp.

That what the finals series is a new series from the regular season, when the regular season is finish and the minor premiers announced.

and finals start the first week is where they finish in the regular season


So if lower ranked team can beat a higher ranked team, then they should get the advantage.

Why should team 1,2,3,4 who lose get a home advantage for losing to a lower ranked team

 

[mepelthwack]

Its taken you 11 years to voice your complaint.

Short memory or is it only that this highly unlikely scenario may effect your club. Manly wont win so stop your petlant whingeing.

Make assumptions often?

You couldn't be further from the truth.

I h8 the McIntyre so much and from day 1 that in 1999 my alternative system was submitted to the NRL, accompanying supporting letter by the then Manly CEO.

Subsequently for every year since I have voiced complaint against the system both on forums and directly to the NRL.

You think the system is fair well your not alone so does Annesley. Next I'm waiting for his retirement to try again.

 

[Sans Souci Sainter]

I'm sure the Dragons have been knocked out in this fashion before.

From 3rd (or maybe 4th)?

Yeah it stings, but the fact is the Tigers weren't good enough throughout the year to earn a second chance and this was reflected in them not being able to win last night when they needed to.

Suck it up, and stop arguing the toss.

("But, It's not fair!!!) LOL

 

[Mader45]

Reading Benji's article today he is pretty confident that not only are we still going to be in it, but that were a good chance of winning it. Pretty nuts for a guy whose knee is killing him, whose team just played 100 minutes of intense footy, will be going up against an in-form team at their home and has quite a few injuries and 1 big suspension possibility.

I'll have whatever he's having.

 

[DragonPunk]

We've been knocked out in 5th, losing to Penrith then the Bulldogs lost to North Queensland. Little fact, the Dogs then went on to win it.

 

[The Engineers Room]

Well said. It's a terrible system and embarrassing that we changed from the far superior system the AFL currently uses. We used to laugh at them for such a strange finals system.

So you are telling me that both the Roosters and Raiders don't deserve to stay in after their efforts? One would be eliminated in the other system.

 

[The Engineers Room]

I have a system I think works:

1 v 2
3 v 6
4 v 5
7 v 8

Winner 1v2 V Bye
Loser 1v2 V winner 7v8 - game a
Winner 3v6 V loser 4v5 - game b
Winner 4v5 V loser 3v6 - game c

Winner 1v2 choses next opponent out of winner of games a,b,c
other two winners play with the higher ranked team getting the home state final.

Two winners play in grand final

Running through this years first round:

Dragons v Panthers @ Kogarah
Tigers v Roosters @ SFS
Titans v Warriors @ Robina
Raiders v Sea Eagles @ Canberra - loser eliminated

Now what I think would happen

Dragons v Bye
Panthers v Raiders @ Homebush
Roosters v Warriors @ SFS
Titans v Tigers @ Suncorp

Dragons v Roosters @ SFS
Raiders v Titans @ Homebush

Dragons v Titans

 

[kay]

to rely on other results I think is not really the best system. I mean the 4v5 game they can go from playing for nothing but home advantage next week to what has eventuated and skip to 3rd week with other knocked out. In 04 5th dragons lost by a point and got knocked out iirc, then the year later cowboys got smashed in the same match and ended up in the gf.

 

[Slackboy72]

The ARL/AFL system is much better but I think we can get an improvement similar to the one used in ESL. The problem is the assumption is that the further down the ladder the weaker the teams get which is just not true as the ladder represents the last 26 weeks and the lower teams regularly don't hit good form until after origin.

We got the short end of the straw by meeting a red-hot Parra last year and Penrith got the same with the raiders this year. But what if the top 4 got to choose who they played? The ESL does it and it would add about 30 minutes onto the end of season before we knew who would play whom.

For example if teams got to choose we may have had the following:
TIT v RAI
WST v WAR
PEN v EAS
DRA v MAN

Just my two cents though.

 

[Michaelson]

Then what happens?

 

[*Paul*]

Like it was stated before... you don't play 26 rounds for nothing.

Well you do really, else SGI would already be relaxing by the pool.

Highest ranked v lowest ranked, sudden death all the way through. No muss, no fuss.

 

[dollyhands]

I want Dragons to lose today (continue the choke/joke), but want tigers to stay in. Not gonna enjoy todays game at all. Silly that 3rd can be kicked out after a crackin game that they lost after 100mins

 

[Loudstrat]

I have a system I think works:

1 v 2
3 v 6
4 v 5
7 v 8

Winner 1v2 V Bye
Loser 1v2 V winner 7v8 - game a
Winner 3v6 V loser 4v5 - game b
Winner 4v5 V loser 3v6 - game c

Winner 1v2 choses next opponent out of winner of games a,b,c
other two winners play with the higher ranked team getting the home state final.

Two winners play in grand final

Running through this years first round:

Dragons v Panthers @ Kogarah
Tigers v Roosters @ SFS
Titans v Warriors @ Robina
Raiders v Sea Eagles @ Canberra - loser eliminated

Now what I think would happen

Dragons v Bye
Panthers v Raiders @ Homebush
Roosters v Warriors @ SFS
Titans v Tigers @ Suncorp

Dragons v Roosters @ SFS
Raiders v Titans @ Homebush

Dragons v Titans

That is actually a pretty good system. Top 2 play for a week off. 7 and 8 play for elimination. Then - elimination finals with a grading system to determine the games.

The big problem is the safetynet for the top 2 is halved. The benefit is that we get 3 games in week 2, instead of 2.



CURRENTLY - the Mac fits best with the minor premiership. The whole point of the 26 rounds is to grade the finalists. What's the point of grading them if 1 plays 4 and 5 plays 8 ffs?

I think it worked brilliantly this weekend - Wests arguably lost because of injury to Marshall. Which happens. Easts had to really dig and probably knackered themselves for next week. And Wests predicament comes down to round 26 when they had a chance to snare second, but lost to the Titans.

 

[Slackboy72]

I want Dragons to lose today (continue the choke/joke), but want tigers to stay in. Not gonna enjoy todays game at all. Silly that 3rd can be kicked out after a crackin game that they lost after 100mins

And it's also silly that 6th could possibly get a week off and straight into a prelim.

 

[El Diablo]

And it's also silly that 6th could possibly get a week off and straight into a prelim.

what is worse is that using the current system it's possible for team 6 to lose in week 1 and if 7 and 8 also lose then they could still go on to win the premiership

team 6 does not deserve a second chance

the ARL system also has bad too though. it is easier for team 1 to get to the GF using the McIntyre system because it's easier to get the week off as you only need to beat team 8, not team 4