The annual finals system debate thread

[typicalfan]

And here is the flaw in the current system.....

Broncos and Manly both win today, and tomorrow Knights upset Storm. Where is the reward for Tigers winning last night when they face Storm in week 2, while Dragons face Knights. Say both Dragons and Tigers win in week 2, the Dragons face Manly at ANZ while Tigers get Broncos in Brisbane.

The Tigers face the Storm in Sydney and on the back of 3 straight losses. The Dragons play the Knights up at Newcastle where they have a good record.

 

[Fingerbang]

The Tigers face the Storm in Sydney and on the back of 3 straight losses. The Dragons play the Knights up at Newcastle where they have a good record.

Dragons have a better record against Knights in Newcastle than they do at home. And besides, aren't regional home grounds out in week 2? I thought it went to major city centre in week 2, hence Knights would have to move their game to Sydney.

 

[typicalfan]

Dragons have a better record against Knights in Newcastle than they do at home. And besides, aren't regional home grounds out in week 2? I thought it went to major city centre in week 2, hence Knights would have to move their game to Sydney.

I think Newcastle with its increased size would be suitable enough as Canberra was last year.

 

[DRAGONZ_RULE]

If this happens tonight and tomorrow:

Broncos defeat Warriors
Sea Eagles defeat Cowboys
Knights defeat Storm

Week 2 would see:

1) Dragons punished for losing to the Tigers by playing 8th, potentially even in Sydney (not sure whether Newcastle host in Newcastle for Wk2?)

2) Tigers rewarded for beating the Dragons by playing 1st.

To my mind we don't even deserve another chance, but if the situation does pan out that way, it's another case of a completely f*cked Finals system.

 

[DRAGONZ_RULE]

And further to that, if the Dragons were then to beat Knights, they would play Manly in Sydney, whilst the Tigers would have to travel to Brisbane if they beat Melbourne.

It's beyond a joke.

 

[AlwaysGreen]

I've been waiting for someone to start a what's wrong with the finals thread.

 

[innsaneink]

Your gripe isnt the macintyre system....its the NRL's version of what is & isnt a home final....

 

[transmogrifier]

The finals system sucks. It's that simple. I can't believe they still persist with it. I didn't even bother watching the Dragons-Tigers game because, well, what does the result matter? We won't find out till tomorrow. Screw that.

Abysmal, abysmal system.

 

[NrlCoach]

 

[Eels Dude]

On the other side of the scale you could say the Tigers are rewarded by getting a home semi against an out of city of Sydney side who are down on confidence, while the Dragons are punished by having to play a red hot side who knocked off the minor premiers.

But overall agree the whole McIntyre system comes down to chance, would prefer a system where every club's fortune's are in their own hands.

 

[Loudstrat]

Tigers would be playing a last start loser at home. No problem.

Saints would play Knights at Ausgrid. Again, no problem.

The minor premiership determines the placings for the finals. The object of the finals is to win against other finallists. If you cannot, you don't deserve any advantage. But of you have finished high up, you get a greater chance at having a second chance.

Therefore, if the MP cannot beat team 8, they should pay the price.

 

[innsaneink]

The finals system sucks. It's that simple. I can't believe they still persist with it. I didn't even bother watching the Dragons-Tigers game because, well, what does the result matter? We won't find out till tomorrow. Screw that.

Abysmal, abysmal system.

haha....yeah I had better things to do in round three when the thought crossed my mind, who'll win the comp this year?
I thought going to the footy wont help me....so I climbed a tree instead.

 

[AlwaysGreen]

But overall agree the whole McIntyre system comes down to chance, would prefer a system where every club's fortune's are in their own hands.

It is - all you have to do is win.

 

[transmogrifier]

haha....yeah I had better things to do in round three when the thought crossed my mind, who'll win the comp this year?
I thought going to the footy wont help me....so I climbed a tree instead.

Yeah, because that's exactly the same thing. But if you're happy with such a pathetic, anti-climatic finals system, all power to you. Whatever keeps you happy.

 

[DRAGONZ_RULE]

On the other side of the scale you could say the Tigers are rewarded by getting a home semi against an out of city of Sydney side who are down on confidence, while the Dragons are punished by having to play a red hot side who knocked off the minor premiers.

But overall agree the whole McIntyre system comes down to chance, would prefer a system where every club's fortune's are in their own hands.

True - but ask the Tigers whether they would prefer to play 1st or 8th in a sudden death game in Week 2, and then whether they'd prefer to play Manly in Sydney or Brisbane in Brisbane in Week 3, and see what they say.

It is definitely arguable that the loser of the 4 v 5 match actually gets the easier draw if 2, 3 and
8 win in Week 1.

 

[DRAGONZ_RULE]

P.S. Apologies for missing the other thread!

 

[transmogrifier]

It is - all you have to do is win.

Shitty argument, seeing as that is true for every single other finals system known to man as well. So then we have to look at what happens when you lose, and whether we are giving enough advantage to the final finishing positions.

Personally, I think 8 teams in the finals is too much given that those finishing 7th/8th are often scraping a 50/50 record. But I could live with that in the AFL system, where there is a clear advantage given to the TOp 4, thus rewarding season-long consistency. It also provides matches between teams of (presumably) similar ability in that first week, and every single game has a clear outcome at the time it finishes. I never understood the argument that the McIntyre system is good because it keeps the best teams apart till the final. Screw that - I want the good sides playing each other as often as possible, finals or not.

I mean:

Storm vs Tigers
Broncos vs Sea Eagles
Dragons vs Knights
Warriors vs Nth Queensland

is a much better slate of games to kick of the finals.

 

[innsaneink]

Yeah, because that's exactly the same thing. But if you're happy with such a pathetic, anti-climatic finals system, all power to you. Whatever keeps you happy.

It may or may not keep me happy, its what we have so sometimes you just have to accept that.
Doesnt stop me watching/supporting.

You dont watch big end of year games, but talk about them on the net...whatever keeps you happy.

 

[transmogrifier]

It may or may not keep me happy, its what we have so sometimes you just have to accept that.
Doesnt stop me watching/supporting.

You dont watch big end of year games, but talk about them on the net...whatever keeps you happy.

Did I talk about the Tigers-Dragons game? I said I didn't watch it. Not sure how else to get that information across on the internet without using the words "I did not watch the Tigers-Dragons game".

I'm a fan of neither team, in fact I hate both of them, so why bother watching if - no matter what the result - I can't even get the satisfaction of seeing one of them knocked out? Dumb system.

I'm a Warriors fan. I'll be watching that game in a minute or two. So hopefully your innate sense of what is allowable in terms of the watching-discussing ratio is satisfied.

 

[ElectricEelMan]

True - but ask the Tigers whether they would prefer to play 1st or 8th in a sudden death game in Week 2, and then whether they'd prefer to play Manly in Sydney or Brisbane in Brisbane in Week 3, and see what they say.

It is definitely arguable that the loser of the 4 v 5 match actually gets the easier draw if 2, 3 and
8 win in Week 1.

Same could be said of the other system. I have a Geelong Cats fan who was very nervous today. Why was he nervous when his team won yesterday?

Well, simply because Collingwood were for a time today losing in their game against the West Coast.
If Collingwood lost, Geelong would probably have to beat the minor premiers (Collingwood) to get into the grand final instead of playing West Coast. So arguably if Collingwood lost today, Geelong's would have been better off losing their game last night.