The Case for Adelaide.....

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Parra are well on the way, it will be interesting to see which clubs can take advantage of the new stadiums that are coming. My thoughts are that with their existing large fan base and a modern stadium these clubs could follow:

- Souths (Allanz or Bankwest)
- Bulldogs (Liverpool or Bankwest)
- Tigers (Liverpool)
- Dragons (new Bankwest style Kogarah)

I cannot understand the NSW Gov's decision to build more stadia. There's been one in Gosford for 20 years without an RL tennant. The NSW Gov should tell the ARLC to send the Sea Eagles up there, as the Central Coast Sea Eagles, then they'll build one in Liverpool.

The Southern Sydney area and North Shore / Northern Beaches probably don't need a stadium or team of their own. There aren't enough RL fans there to justify the expense and the other codes don't have teams in these areas, so they'll be a waste of space. Roosters could absorb the North Shore / Northern Beaches and Rabbitohs could take over Southern Sydney.

Dragons and Sharks to Adelaide and Perth.

 

[MugaB]

What I would do if I was boss is hire a consultancy team to analyse the finances of every Sydney club and survey the public to see which teams have the potential to become a juggernaut, which ones will be in the middle of the pack and which ones will always be treading water. Then I would create a plan that says the teams that will always struggle to tread water will not be bailed out if they go belly up and, the ones that have the potential to become as big as South Sydney and Brisbane will be given extra support to grow their brand. The ones in the middle are like regional clubs, important to their catchment but will never be in the top echelon of the NRL with regards to drawing money and crowds.

The North Sydney Bears fiasco has to be sorted out once and for all. If a consultancy report finds that a new neutral team representing the North Shore and Northern Beaches will be more successful than the Manly Sea Eagles at gaining support from both regions, then I'd revoke Manly's licence, start a bidding war, then hand the licence to the consortium that has the most money and ability to unite the Bears and Sea Eagles fans so that there's a big team in the area that can draw 20k or 30k fans to rival the Broncos. It would be a golden opportunity for the NRL to lobby NSW Gov for a stadium somewhere central to both regions.

Sydney needs one or two of its teams to develop a city-wide appeal to counter the Swans. If we can get a team or two to become bigger than the Swans then our game will be in a great place.

But you're not boss, you're a muppet, and an idiot if you think revoking a license will make rugby league improve, its been tried and failed miserably, and will start a parade that will cripple the game... and before you say that we're now better for it, we are not we are so far behind, because souths are still here and Perth, Adelaide, and Brisbane2 are not, so keep churning out your dumb bumkin ideas, but realize your not the boss, and culling any team will lose more fans, than you can regain, its better off waiting for the teams to lose support, and demote themselves than seek to cull them or force them into 2nd tier status

 

[Bring back John Fifita]

But you're not boss, you're a muppet, and an idiot if you think revoking a license will make rugby league improve, its been tried and failed miserably, and will start a parade that will cripple the game... and before you say that we're now better for it, we are not we are so far behind, because souths are still here and Perth, Adelaide, and Brisbane2 are not, so keep churning out your dumb bumkin ideas, but realize your not the boss, and culling any team will lose more fans, than you can regain, its better off waiting for the teams to lose support, and demote themselves than seek to cull them or force them into 2nd tier status

 

[MugaB]

You got it, you got it! Picci picci picci you got it

 

[Bring back John Fifita]

You got it, you got it! Picci picci picci you got it

I always got the name.... but only after seeing those lovely threads did I realise....

The colour schemes too...

Penrith - Zimbabwe...

Loving it..

 

[MugaB]

I always got the name.... but only after seeing those lovely threads did I realise....

The colour schemes too...

Penrith - Zimbabwe...

Loving it..

Just how it should be..... Black Pantha!!!!

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

But you're not boss, you're a muppet, and an idiot if you think revoking a license will make rugby league improve, its been tried and failed miserably, and will start a parade that will cripple the game... and before you say that we're now better for it, we are not we are so far behind, because souths are still here and Perth, Adelaide, and Brisbane2 are not, so keep churning out your dumb bumkin ideas, but realize your not the boss, and culling any team will lose more fans, than you can regain, its better off waiting for the teams to lose support, and demote themselves than seek to cull them or force them into 2nd tier status

You live in a fantasy world @MugaB if you believe any of the shit you just posted.

Explain how revoking the licence of a tiny Sydney club that only has about 7,000-9,000 fanatic fans willing to turn up all games regardless of whether it's raining, hailing or shining will cripple the game?

All we need to do is point to crowd figures from 1997. The Sydney-centric ARL drew shit crowds with their "foundation clubs", whereas teams in Townsville, Brisbane, Auckland and Adelaide were pulling far more fans through the gate.

Crushers were on death's door and the ARL was basically a reserve grade competiton with also-rans playing in it. No one took it seriously up here in Queensland. The best players were in Super League.

South Sydney were a basket case, on and off the field, before Peter Holmes-a-Court and Russell Crowe bailed them out. Cowboys, Broncos and Knights were carrying the competiton in the 2000s. Their attendances are okay, but they're not great.

Rugby League Tables / Attendances /Souths

Rugby League Tables - NRL Stats & Tables

www.afltables.com

 

[Jim Rockford]

I still say dump the Cowboys. Nobody that matters will care, only backwards bumpkins like GROTD will be pissed but hey, who cares about that loser.

 

[Perth Red]

GRTD sydney isn’t going to be rationalised and constantly raising it on every thread just brings the trolls like Jim to this expansion debate area. Maybe start a thread on Sydney rationalisation and keep to that so we can avoid spamming every thread with Sydney fans whinging and being abusive and others calling for something that’s never going to happen.

A moderator would be nice FRF owners!!

 

[MugaB]

GRTD sydney isn’t going to be rationalised and constantly raising it on every thread just brings the trolls like Jim to this expansion debate area. Maybe start a thread on Sydney rationalisation and keep to that so we can avoid spamming every thread with Sydney fans whinging and being abusive and others calling for something that’s never going to happen.

A moderator would be nice FRF owners!!

Finally a common sense post

 

[MugaB]

You live in a fantasy world @MugaB if you believe any of the shit you just posted.

Explain how revoking the licence of a tiny Sydney club that only has about 7,000-9,000 fanatic fans willing to turn up all games regardless of whether it's raining, hailing or shining will cripple the game?

All we need to do is point to crowd figures from 1997. The Sydney-centric ARL drew shit crowds with their "foundation clubs", whereas teams in Townsville, Brisbane, Auckland and Adelaide were pulling far more fans through the gate.

Crushers were on death's door and the ARL was basically a reserve grade competiton with also-rans playing in it. No one took it seriously up here in Queensland. The best players were in Super League.

South Sydney were a basket case, on and off the field, before Peter Holmes-a-Court and Russell Crowe bailed them out. Cowboys, Broncos and Knights were carrying the competiton in the 2000s. Their attendances are okay, but they're not great.

View attachment 50494

Rugby League Tables / Attendances /Souths

Rugby League Tables - NRL Stats & Tables

www.afltables.com

Nice example on how culling souths as you would have done sowith any other club, can turn it around, given similar circumstances, whos to say the fortunes of other so called basketcases can't do the same thing.... you've just proved my point!

 

[The Great Dane]

Nice example on how culling souths as you would have done sowith any other club, can turn it around, given similar circumstances, whos to say the fortunes of other so called basketcases can't do the same thing.... you've just proved my point!

I'll say it; there's effectively no chance that other failing clubs will be bailed out by an A-list celebrity and his loaded mates.

Further more, banking on clubs being bailed out in such a way instead of making sensible changes to increase their commercial opportunities is the sort of craziness that has gotten them, and the league, into the embarrassing position that it is now with only 1 or 2 financially successful football businesses in the league.

 

[MugaB]

I'll say it; there's effectively no chance that other failing clubs will be bailed out by an A-list celebrity and his loaded mates.

Further more, banking on clubs being bailed out in such a way instead of making sensible changes to increase their commercial opportunities is the sort of craziness that has gotten them, and the league, into the embarrassing position that it is now with only 1 or 2 financially successful football businesses in the league.

Yeah i get that, but there's other ways to improve the way clubs can produce revenue, there are plenty who rely on leagues clubs yes, but some these clubs will eventually find other avenues, just as souths have, its not all doom and gloom every year, and with the current covid problems, it should be a bit of a wake up for most clubs to get their respective houses in order, i get that they've historically been absolute shithouse regarding overspending, but if anything this past year has been an eye opener for clubs to manage their bottom lines more efficiently...
So if there's no bail outs, after covid surpasses in a few years from now, and the clubs are still mis managed, they cant complain to the NRL, that they weren't warned about it, but to use crowd figures of the past to set criteria to punt certain sydney clubs is another recipe for disaster

 

[The Great Dane]

Yeah i get that, but there's other ways to improve the way clubs can produce revenue, there are plenty who rely on leagues clubs yes, but some these clubs will eventually find other avenues, just as souths have, its not all doom and gloom every year, and with the current covid problems, it should be a bit of a wake up for most clubs to get their respective houses in order, i get that they've historically been absolute shithouse regarding overspending, but if anything this past year has been an eye opener for clubs to manage their bottom lines more efficiently...
So if there's no bail outs, after covid surpasses in a few years from now, and the clubs are still mis managed, they cant complain to the NRL, that they weren't warned about it, but to use crowd figures of the past to set criteria to punt certain sydney clubs is another recipe for disaster

I don't see any reason why there will be any change because of covid.

The leagues clubs will still be there, they'll still be more or less willing to bankroll the failing football clubs, and the football clubs will still ignore improving their businesses because they know the leagues clubs will bankroll them. Nothing changes the wheel keeps turning.

You can say rationalisation is a bad idea all you like, but it doesn't change the fact that Sydney is oversaturated and can't independently sustain all the clubs in the market, that despite all the clubs that it does have they don't even adequately cover all the major regional niches within Sydney, and that that state of affairs has negatively effected the sport both locally and nationally.

Now in my opinion it's extremely unlikely that rationalisation, even in it's most benign forms, will happen in the NRL in the foreseeable future, but just because it won't happen that doesn't mean that it shouldn't happen.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

GRTD sydney isn’t going to be rationalised and constantly raising it on every thread just brings the trolls like Jim to this expansion debate area. Maybe start a thread on Sydney rationalisation and keep to that so we can avoid spamming every thread with Sydney fans whinging and being abusive and others calling for something that’s never going to happen.

A moderator would be nice FRF owners!!

Good points. I genuinely worry about the direction our game is heading. Not having teams in Adelaide and Perth over the last 23 years has given our main competitor a massive advantage. The revenue gap between them and us has grown significantly during that time to the point it is hurting our game in its heartland, as we don't have the funds to compete with them at the grassroots level and they've made serious inroads in that area. All those kids playing fumbleball in NSW and QLD are probably never going to be diehard fans of our game when they grow up.

Who is going to watch our game in 20 years from now?

We have an ageing fanbase. Unless we get kids to take up the game then we'll start losing fan as the older generation dies off.

Action needed to be taken 25 years ago to future proof our game from the problems it is now encountering. Lack of action then has probably crippled us permanently.

If the Reds and Rams were still here we would be in a much stronger position. Both teams would have established fanbases and we would be getting more money from the broadcasters. Participation would be higher.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

I cannot understand the NSW Gov's decision to build more stadia. There's been one in Gosford for 20 years without an RL tennant. The NSW Gov should tell the ARLC to send the Sea Eagles up there, as the Central Coast Sea Eagles, then they'll build one in Liverpool.

The Southern Sydney area and North Shore / Northern Beaches probably don't need a stadium or team of their own. There aren't enough RL fans there to justify the expense and the other codes don't have teams in these areas, so they'll be a waste of space. Roosters could absorb the North Shore / Northern Beaches and Rabbitohs could take over Southern Sydney.

Dragons and Sharks to Adelaide and Perth.

You're probably right but I'll take them if it benefits the game in terms of growing attendances and memberships. It has been a winner for the Eels. Of the potentials, I think...

Brooky is a waste of time. A central Northern Sydney Stadium could potentially be used for Manly, some Waratahs games and some Sydney FC games

Southern Sydney Stadium is problematic because the Sharks won't play there if it is built at the Kograh site and the Dragons won't play there if it is located on the Shark Park site. The Sharks have their own ground so they probably won't move (unless Shark Park becomes unfeasible to play at in the future compared to the attractiveness of this new stadium). They could potentially pick a third neutral location but again, it depends if the Sharks will commit to it. This stadium may also attract some Sydney FC games.

Penrith seems like it is going ahead but other than buying votes it isn't going to achieve much for anyone other than the Panthers.

Liverpool seems to be a good option for the Dogs and Tigers. Will the new SW A League team play there too though? They seem to have their eye on Campbeltown. I would imagine it would be hard for them to say no to this ground if it is going to get built for them by the NSW Govt.

It seems like Liverpool and a neutral Southern Sydney venue make the most sense in terms of multiple tenants. Happy for Penrith and Manly if their local grounds get done though. Sydney should be set from there:

Brooky - Manly
Allianz - Roosters, Souths, Sydney FC & Waratahs
Southern Stadium - Sharks & Dragons
Liverpool - Dogs, Tigers & SW Sydney FC
Bankwest - Parra, WSW
Penrith - Panthers
MCG - South Melbourne Swans
Manuka Oval - Greater Western Canberra Moneypits

When those grounds are all done the NRL should no longer use Leichardt, Campbeltown, Kogarah (if the existing one is still around), Belmore, Shark Park. Instead, the NSW RL should focus their marketing around the nostalgia of these grounds.

 

[Perth Red]

That looks like the ideal but do you think the NSW govt has the will, or the money, to build three new Bankwests and significantly improve one other stadium? That probably around $1.3billion of expenditure. Realistically and ideally we'd be doing ok if we needed up with a new stadium at Liverpool for dogs and Tigers and soccer and around $150mill each spending on Manly, Penrith and Shark park. A southern stadium for dragons and sharks makes sense but those clubs would rather cut their noses off to spite their faces I suspect.

 

[MugaB]

That looks like the ideal but do you think the NSW govt has the will, or the money, to build three new Bankwests and significantly improve one other stadium? That probably around $1.3billion of expenditure. Realistically and ideally we'd be doing ok if we needed up with a new stadium at Liverpool for dogs and Tigers and soccer and around $150mill each spending on Manly, Penrith and Shark park. A southern stadium for dragons and sharks makes sense but those clubs would rather cut their noses off to spite their faces I suspect.

Cronulla doesn't want to use any new stadium, they run/own their own, st george can use win stadium moreso, but kogarah isnt worth rebuilding or refurbishing for only 6 games maximum a year,

Liverpool is a great idea for wests and dogs

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

You're probably right but I'll take them if it benefits the game in terms of growing attendances and memberships. It has been a winner for the Eels. Of the potentials, I think...

Brooky is a waste of time. A central Northern Sydney Stadium could potentially be used for Manly, some Waratahs games and some Sydney FC games

Southern Sydney Stadium is problematic because the Sharks won't play there if it is built at the Kograh site and the Dragons won't play there if it is located on the Shark Park site. The Sharks have their own ground so they probably won't move (unless Shark Park becomes unfeasible to play at in the future compared to the attractiveness of this new stadium). They could potentially pick a third neutral location but again, it depends if the Sharks will commit to it. This stadium may also attract some Sydney FC games.

Penrith seems like it is going ahead but other than buying votes it isn't going to achieve much for anyone other than the Panthers.

Liverpool seems to be a good option for the Dogs and Tigers. Will the new SW A League team play there too though? They seem to have their eye on Campbeltown. I would imagine it would be hard for them to say no to this ground if it is going to get built for them by the NSW Govt.

It seems like Liverpool and a neutral Southern Sydney venue make the most sense in terms of multiple tenants. Happy for Penrith and Manly if their local grounds get done though. Sydney should be set from there:

Brooky - Manly
Allianz - Roosters, Souths, Sydney FC & Waratahs
Southern Stadium - Sharks & Dragons
Liverpool - Dogs, Tigers & SW Sydney FC
Bankwest - Parra, WSW
Penrith - Panthers
MCG - South Melbourne Swans
Manuka Oval - Greater Western Canberra Moneypits

When those grounds are all done the NRL should no longer use Leichardt, Campbeltown, Kogarah (if the existing one is still around), Belmore, Shark Park. Instead, the NSW RL should focus their marketing around the nostalgia of these grounds.

I cannot see a Northern Sydney or Southern Sydney Stadium erected unless the A-League expands there, which is a possibility. I heard that the Central Coast Mariners are looking to relocate to Brookvale. If that's the case then it paves the way for a Northern Sydney Stadium that can be used for Sea Eagles, Mariners and possibly Shute Shield and Waratahs.

What happens to Central Coast Stadium?

If I was a NSW taxpayer I would be livid to see a new stadium built on the North Shore when there's one up in Gosford that'll never get used again.

Of all the locations, Liverpool is probably the best option. It'll have Bulldogs, Tigers and Macarthur FC as major tennants.

 

[Perth Red]

Cronulla doesn't want to use any new stadium, they run/own their own, st george can use win stadium moreso, but kogarah isnt worth rebuilding or refurbishing for only 6 games maximum a year,

Liverpool is a great idea for wests and dogs

Sharks could sell Shark park and invest that money to do away with all their financial stresses once and for all. The vast majority of money they have got from current land asset sales has gone into paying off debts and they are still losing millions every season. 14k at Shark park and losing money or 20k plus at a stunning new southern sydney stadium and $50mill in the bank?
It makes zero sense for the NSW Govt to spend $150mill on Shark park for 11 games a year and $200mill plus on Kogorah for 6 games a year!