The LJC\Stallion Thread

[DC80]

I agree with almost all of that.
I don’t believe the issue is that the sport doesn’t appeal but that the sport continues to sell itself short and fails to give people the chance to experience it.
You only have to read Facebook to see how many fans hate the teams in France, Canada, London or even f**king Gateshead.
Rugby league has a lot of issues but the ones of its own creation far outweigh the ones imposed by union.

The not appealing part is not something I would come up with myself, as I watch RL and it appeals to me, rather from what I have been told from those who don't watch it. Most people I know do not, and they are not interested in RU either so there isn't any class issue involved. If you look at videos of sports online the ones that generate by far the most views are those with moments of skill, a trick, a wow moment. Messi, Federer, Jordan, non contact skill dominated sports and with an aesthetically pleasing way of scoring, or even in golf with that famous putt of Tiger Woods at the Masters that hung on the edge of the cup and then went in. Also in these sports individuals are allowed to excell and really stand out, this obviously also applies to individual sports such as athletics with Bolt.

Unfortunately for collision dominated sports there is much less of these important appealing factors. Colliding with another person is seen as run of the mill. I got into RL after I was taken to a game at St Helens as witnessing the actual collisions in the flesh works much better than on tv.

Collision based sports have less appeal borne out by much lower participation numbers and viewing figures. Each collision based sport is biggest in its cultural heartland - country of origin - as there is an inherent cultural connection to it, it's a built in loyalty, but where there is no cultural connection it struggles to generate interest.

The key for any collision sport is how to create more wow moments. Less straight up collisions, and more skills that generate interest among the masses.

The 'focus' on this tiny footprint as you put it is based on an assessment that the private school sector are extremely influential at the top end of town, be it government or business. A bias against the code of rugby-league has occured over many decades and this has restricted/ repressed the progress/growth of rugby league in most places around the world. You have underestimated the power and intent of anti rugby league sentiment against the code of rugby league. An example of how this repression of rugby league has occured is in the following attachment article which is well put together by a New Zealand journalist that follows both

"most places around the world"..there you go again. RU has barely any footprint in over 90% of the planet. You have a very myopic view of the world. The world is not Australia, or England. 95% of the countries and population of the planet have no interest in RU. Nothing is stopping RL from being as big as it wants to be except RL itself.

 

[Stallion]

The not appealing part is not something I would come up with myself, as I watch RL and it appeals to me, rather from what I have been told from those who don't watch it. Most people I know do not, and they are not interested in RU either so there isn't any class issue involved. If you look at videos of sports online the ones that generate by far the most views are those with moments of skill, a trick, a wow moment. Messi, Federer, Jordan, non contact skill dominated sports and with an aesthetically pleasing way of scoring, or even in golf with that famous putt of Tiger Woods at the Masters that hung on the edge of the cup and then went in. Also in these sports individuals are allowed to excell and really stand out, this obviously also applies to individual sports such as athletics with Bolt.

Unfortunately for collision dominated sports there is much less of these important appealing factors. Colliding with another person is seen as run of the mill. I got into RL after I was taken to a game at St Helens as witnessing the actual collisions in the flesh works much better than on tv.

Collision based sports have less appeal borne out by much lower participation numbers and viewing figures. Each collision based sport is biggest in its cultural heartland - country of origin - as there is an inherent cultural connection to it, it's a built in loyalty, but where there is no cultural connection it struggles to generate interest.

The key for any collision sport is how to create more wow moments. Less straight up collisions, and more skills that generate interest among the masses.


"most places around the world"..there you go again. RU has barely any footprint in over 90% of the planet. You have a very myopic view of the world. The world is not Australia, or England. 95% of the countries and population of the planet have no interest in RU. Nothing is stopping RL from being as big as it wants to be except RL itself.

Dissagree. Its a combination of poor administrators and repression courtesy of rugby union. You are basically blaming rugby league for having players banned by rugby union, not being recognised as a sport, not gaining presence in many schools around the world, being outlawed as a sport in France, not being funded as a sport in many countries where rugby union is. No doubt you will dismiss the well articulated and to the point article by NZ sports journalist Malcolm Dreaneen? Perhaps you haven't bothered to read it given your stance? Id say thats the case! Their is something very dodgy going on against the code of rugby league. You have wrongly articulated its tv drawing power. In Australia, rugby league has consistently had the highest tv seasonal ratings of any code of football for the past 3 or 4 decades. Your trivialising of contact football sports is so out of touch its ridiculous! Are you aware that American football (gridiron) is deemed a contact sport? This football code is the most watched programme/show/sport on tv with college football coming 2nd in the USA . Amazingly your skewed slant ignores such facts in missing so many areas where a contact football code is clearly the most popular product on tv. We are discussing football codes so would appreciate you stick to the topic. My opinion is that the code of rugby union is suppressing /repressing rugby league as it sees rugby league as a superior code and is steadfast in stopping this contact football code grow in its own right. Their is mounting evidence of the repression toward the code of rugby league yet you choose to ignore it. This is reality and I believe that this very easy to follow code could/would be as big as soccer had it not been for the repressive tactics used by union against the code and incompetent administrators within the code of RL itself. An untapped football code with immense potential is rugby league. It's just not given the chance or a fair go big time!

 

[Stallion]

The not appealing part is not something I would come up with myself, as I watch RL and it appeals to me, rather from what I have been told from those who don't watch it. Most people I know do not, and they are not interested in RU either so there isn't any class issue involved. If you look at videos of sports online the ones that generate by far the most views are those with moments of skill, a trick, a wow moment. Messi, Federer, Jordan, non contact skill dominated sports and with an aesthetically pleasing way of scoring, or even in golf with that famous putt of Tiger Woods at the Masters that hung on the edge of the cup and then went in. Also in these sports individuals are allowed to excell and really stand out, this obviously also applies to individual sports such as athletics with Bolt.

Unfortunately for collision dominated sports there is much less of these important appealing factors. Colliding with another person is seen as run of the mill. I got into RL after I was taken to a game at St Helens as witnessing the actual collisions in the flesh works much better than on tv.

Collision based sports have less appeal borne out by much lower participation numbers and viewing figures. Each collision based sport is biggest in its cultural heartland - country of origin - as there is an inherent cultural connection to it, it's a built in loyalty, but where there is no cultural connection it struggles to generate interest.

The key for any collision sport is how to create more wow moments. Less straight up collisions, and more skills that generate interest among the masses.


"most places around the world"..there you go again. RU has barely any footprint in over 90% of the planet. You have a very myopic view of the world. The world is not Australia, or England. 95% of the countries and population of the planet have no interest in RU. Nothing is stopping RL from being as big as it wants to be except RL itself.

Btw Their are about 65 countries that have rugby league struggling to make its way. That's a decent figure and will get bigger. Although its a precarious existence for many of these developing rugby-league competitions. And I suggest the struggle of such competitions relate in many ways to the establishment based biased that exists against the code plus poor administrators.

 

[Pommy]

Btw Their are about 65 countries that have rugby league struggling to make its way. That's a decent figure and will get bigger. Although its a precarious existence for many of these developing rugby-league competitions. And I suggest the struggle of such competitions relate in many ways to the establishment based biased that exists against the code plus poor administrators.

About 10 countries and about 55 ethnic groups in western Sydney more like.

 

[Stallion]

About 10 countries and about 55 ethnic groups in western Sydney more like.

No thats not fair or true. Their are a number of fledgling leagues and their is growth momentum. However had the world cup been run better a bigger interest in this code would have eventuated. Instead it moves slowly forward courtesy of its nature as a challenging and enjoyable football code to play. The electronic media has helped in this respect but securing a strong base for these fledgling competitions is another very real battle!

 

[Pommy]

No thats not fair or true. Their are a number of fledgling leagues and their is growth momentum. However had the world cup been run better a bigger interest in this code would have eventuated. Instead it moves slowly forward courtesy of its nature as a challenging and enjoyable football code to play. The electronic media has helped in this respect but securing a strong base for these fledgling competitions is another very real battle!

It’s not far off I bet.

 

[Stallion]

It’s not far off I bet.

Nope. If you read some of the international threads you will find information on RL competitions elsewhere in the world. Struggling but yes they battle along in Europe, North and South America, Asia, Middle east, Pacific Islands, and Africa.

 

[Pommy]

Nope. If you read some of the international threads you will find information on RL competitions elsewhere in the world. Struggling but yes they battle along in Europe, North and South America, Asia, Middle east, Pacific Islands, and Africa.

Or you could provide a list to back up your claim.

 

[Stallion]

Or you could provide a list to back up your claim.

I provided a very telltale and informative article about how a sport(rugby league) can be repressed within a government that has people in positions of power and a dislike for the code. You didn’t have the decency to discuss refer/comment/perhaps read it? So you can source such information yourself. But I will give you the fledgling RL competitions in Europe: Czech Republic , Estonia, Germany, Netherlands, Holland,Greece (just 4"clubs), Serbia, Russia, Ireland, Turkey, Lithuania, Ukraine, Catalonia, Belarusia, Malta, Italy. Competitions are forming in the middle East especially Lebanon. Their is also some African competitions; Kenya(the code was declined govt funding with union the benefactor -so maybe no Kenya nowadays), South Africa, Ghana, Gambia, Nigeria,Morocco and Burundi There's a start. Note the major well established countries playing rugby league are not in the European list.

 

[Pommy]

I provided a very telltale and informative article about how a sport(rugby league) can be repressed within a government that has people in positions of power and a dislike for the code. You didn’t have the decency to discuss refer/comment/perhaps read it? So you can source such information yourself. But I will give you the fledgling RL competitions in Europe: Czech Republic , Estonia, Germany, Netherlands, Greece (just 4"clubs), Serbia, Russia, Ireland, Turkey, Lithuania, Ukraine, Catalonia, Belarusia, Malta, Italy. Competitions are forming in the middle East especially Lebanon. Their is also some African competitions; Kenya, South Africa, Ghana, Gambia, Morocco and Bowana. There's a start. Note the major well established countries playing rugby league are not in the European list.

Are Morocco playing? I believe they are a nation really under the pump from union to the point that they don’t.
How’s the league in Bowana?

What’s you SA article got to do with anything?

 

[Stallion]

Are Morocco playing? I believe they are a nation really under the pump from union to the point that they don’t.
How’s the league in Bowana?

What’s you SA article got to do with anything?

It's a very informative and telltale piece on what can and has gone on behind the scenes against rugby league. Very relevant. An awareness of such repression should be noted and known. Where their is smoke their is fire. Similar things are happening elsewhere but have not been as well documented. A very telltale piece of information which should not be ignored. It shows the lengths and intent of rugby union bias within the establishment scene. And how this repression is exerted within a government.

 

[DC80]

Dissagree. Its a combination of poor administrators and repression courtesy of rugby union. You are basically blaming rugby league for having players banned by rugby union, not being recognised as a sport, not gaining presence in many schools around the world, being outlawed as a sport in France, not being funded as a sport in many countries where rugby union is. No doubt you will dismiss the well articulated and to the point article by NZ sports journalist Malcolm Dreaneen? Perhaps you haven't bothered to read it given your stance? Id say thats the case! Their is something very dodgy going on against the code of rugby league. You have wrongly articulated its tv drawing power. In Australia, rugby league has consistently had the highest tv seasonal ratings of any code of football for the past 3 or 4 decades. Your trivialising of contact football sports is so out of touch its ridiculous! Are you aware that American football (gridiron) is deemed a contact sport? This football code is the most watched programme/show/sport on tv with college football coming 2nd in the USA . Amazingly your skewed slant ignores such facts in missing so many areas where a contact football code is clearly the most popular product on tv. We are discussing football codes so would appreciate you stick to the topic. My opinion is that the code of rugby union is suppressing /repressing rugby league as it sees rugby league as a superior code and is steadfast in stopping this contact football code grow in its own right. Their is mounting evidence of the repression toward the code of rugby league yet you choose to ignore it. This is reality and I believe that this very easy to follow code could/would be as big as soccer had it not been for the repressive tactics used by union against the code and incompetent administrators within the code of RL itself. An untapped football code with immense potential is rugby league. It's just not given the chance or a fair go big time!

You clearly don't read. You make comments that have no connection to what I posted.

You made no remark on sports that generate interest online. Rugby league is completely unhindered in this regard. There are no excuses.

If you look at videos of sports online the ones that generate by far the most views are those with moments of skill, a trick, a wow moment. Messi, Federer, Jordan, non contact skill dominated sports and with an aesthetically pleasing way of scoring, or even in golf with that famous putt of Tiger Woods at the Masters that hung on the edge of the cup and then went in. Also in these sports individuals are allowed to excell and really stand out, this obviously also applies to individual sports such as athletics with Bolt.

I stated;

Unfortunately for collision dominated sports there is much less of these important appealing factors. Colliding with another person is seen as run of the mill. I got into RL after I was taken to a game at St Helens as witnessing the actual collisions in the flesh works much better than on tv.

Collision based sports have less appeal borne out by much lower participation numbers and viewing figures. Each collision based sport is biggest in its cultural heartland - country of origin - as there is an inherent cultural connection to it, it's a built in loyalty, but where there is no cultural connection it struggles to generate interest.

The key for any collision sport is how to create more wow moments. Less straight up collisions, and more skills that generate interest among the masses.

You responded, "Amazingly your skewed slant ignores such facts in missing so many areas where a contact football code is clearly the most popular product on tv."

Again, you don't read. Read what I wrote, digest it, think, and then respond.

Where there is no cultural connection to it, collision based sports do not generate much interest, either in viewing figures, or participation. Aussie NRL is virtually unknown outside Australia (and a suburb of Auckland). The NFL, less than 2 million outside North America watched its final, and inside North America over half tune in to the final for commercials.

Rugby league is ranked 27th in England for participation, 12th in Australia, and these are its cultural heartlands. What then for any country where there is no inherent cultural loyalty to the sport? Non contact sports dominate participation figures in both countries, like they do in almost every country on the planet - Pacific islands would be an exception.

"most places around the world"..there you go again. RU has barely any footprint in over 90% of the planet. You have a very myopic view of the world. The world is not Australia, or England. 95% of the countries and population of the planet have no interest in RU. Nothing is stopping RL from being as big as it wants to be except RL itself.

You responded, "RL is not gaining presence in many schools around the world."

Where "around the world"? Neither RU or RL generate any interest in 95% of the world, so what are you talking about?

 

[Stallion]

You clearly don't read. You make comments that have no connection to what I posted

You made no remark on sports that generate interest online. Rugby league is completely unhindered in this regard. There are no excuses.



I stated;

You responded, "Amazingly your skewed slant ignores such facts in missing so many areas where a contact football code is clearly the most popular product on tv."

Again, you don't read. Read what I wrote, digest it, think, and then respond.

Where there is no cultural connection to it, collision based sports do not generate much interest, either in viewing figures, or participation. Aussie NRL is virtually unknown outside Australia (and a suburb of Auckland). The NFL, less than 2 million outside North America watched its final, and inside North America over half tune in to the final for commercials.

Rugby league is ranked 27th in England for participation, 12th in Australia, and these are its cultural heartlands. What then for any country where there is no inherent cultural loyalty to the sport? Non contact sports dominate participation figures in both countries, like they do in almost every country on the planet - Pacific islands would be an exception.


You responded, "RL is not gaining presence in many schools around the world."

Where "around the world"? Neither RU or RL generate any interest in 95% of the world, so what are you talking about?

You can ridicule the intent and thrust of my comments. That's fine as you discuss totally irrelevant discourse on non contact sport. The cultural significance , as you rightly point out, is fundamental to most football codes relevance. I grew up in a city where rugby league is/and still to a lesser extent number one in crowds and viewing figures. This cultural advantage mostly starts from school and proximity along with peer group or social introduction to the code. If the particular code is not given any latitude as seen in most places you refer to then ofcourse it does not grow! The knowledge and appreciation of a spartan Iike football code in rugby league is nowhere near where it should be. Where you have repressive undermining of the code such as described in the South African plight article (which I hope you have bothered to read?) is a pertinent example of unfairness by another code toward another. That sort of deliberate and damaging activity behind the scenes is not right and is not well known. The world most of us rugby league 'fans' are privy to is our world and this sort of repression is happening. By trying to trivialize it is a way of deflecting it. Haven't noticed you comment on the NZ journalist's "The Plight of South African RL "article? It does mention/conclude that FEAR is the motivation behind such repressive manouverings. Their are plenty of other examples from other nations, however this article succinctly portrays how the repression of rugby league occurs in detail. The fear is based on rugby-league becoming the dominant rugby code in the 'world' as most of us (some genuine RL fans I think?) relate to.
Live and let live is a philosophy not being followed by the various rugby union types in places of authority . If they (RU despots) tolerate rugby league it's only if the sport lives on its knees and not with its head held high!
Open mindedeness verse bigotry is the struggle being played out in this very pervasive and well concealed/ignored scenario and it's a 'worldwide' issue for the slowly growing rugby-league 'world' as we know it.

 

[DC80]

Non contact sport dominating popularity lists in participation and viewership numbers is hardly irrelevant. Fact is there is a ceiling on what contact sports can achieve regards growth. Online is free for everyone to view. How many people watch videos of RL?


At least you were more specific this time by referring to South Africa and not the usual "around the world".

RL in South Africa has virtually no chance of growing. RU is in the heart and soul of the Afrikaans, arguably even more so than the people of NZ. They are not going to ditch something that is in the fabric of their being for another sport. The Springbok jersey is the ultimate for most white South Africans. The bafana bafana, South African football team, holds a similar status for the black populous.

What you are demanding of them is absurd. Why don't you ditch RL for American football?

RU and Cricket are English artistocracy sports, exported from England to outposts of the British Empire in the late 19th century via colonial governors. They were (are) the sporting activities in newly created elite private schools. It's not my scene, I can't stand either, but I don't demand they give up their cultural heritage like you seem to be doing.

 

[Stallion]

Non contact sport dominating popularity lists in participation and viewership numbers is hardly irrelevant. Fact is there is a ceiling on what contact sports can achieve regards growth. Online is free for everyone to view. How many people watch videos of RL?


At least you were more specific this time by referring to South Africa and not the usual "around the world".

RL in South Africa has virtually no chance of growing. RU is in the heart and soul of the Afrikaans, arguably even more so than the people of NZ. They are not going to ditch something that is in the fabric of their being for another sport. The Springbok jersey is the ultimate for most white South Africans. The bafana bafana, South African football team, holds a similar status for the black populous.

What you are demanding of them is absurd. Why don't you ditch RL for American football?

RU and Cricket are English artistocracy sports, exported from England to outposts of the British Empire in the late 19th century via colonial governors. They were (are) the sporting activities in newly created elite private schools. It's not my scene, I can't stand either, but I don't demand they give up their cultural heritage like you seem to be doing.

Your comments on South Africa show your close mindedness. Their is a deliberate and deceitful repression of the code of rugby league and you label that as cultural!? You're a disgrace mate! You are advocating the repression of rugby league. This repression is not isolated to South Africa. I suspect you are a plant from rugby union doing the deflection and 'justification ' bit. Shame on you. Then again someone with your mindset would not understand shame! You should not be on this site. You are not what I would call a genuine rugby league fan and definitely your stance is remarkably and consistently aimed at rugby league not being an attractive enough code to grow? I'm of the opinion it has been held back by repressive activity from rugby union origins and poor administration. We differ completely! Lets leave it at that. You have a low regard for rugby league and I don't. I've noted the real issues hurting rugby league's growth and you argue rugby league isn't worthy of such growth. Black and white champ. I suggest you hold your place well and sheepishly on the dark side!

 

[DC80]

I've just said it's not my scene. The point I'm making is RU is in the blood of white South Africa.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/30028782

"rugby union is a cherished tenet of Afrikaans life - learned from the British in prisoner-of-war camps during the Boer War, spread by the ideology of muscular Christianity, essential to the resurgent Afrikaner nationalism of the middle 20th century that also produced the Broederbond, a secret masonic society that ran apartheid-era South Africa."

RU has a disgraceful history as I said, it's the sporting face of Apartheid. Along with Cricket it is the sport of the English artistrocracy, middle class private school games. With it being part of their cultural heritage there is no chance of a rival rugby code in RL taking off there.

They are rival codes. Where one is popular the other is not.

They are also both niche. If less than 5% of the planet is interested in RU, that's niche. In 100 plus years of RU it is still largely confined to the British isles, Aus, South Africa, NZ, Pacific islands, i.e. the British Empire, with only a region in the south west of France and a small middle class segment in Argentina outside that.

RU is not the all conquering behemoth you are making it out to be, and you are not being realistic in where you believe RL should be.

 

[Stallion]

I've just said it's not my scene. The point I'm making is RU is in the blood of white South Africa.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/30028782

"rugby union is a cherished tenet of Afrikaans life - learned from the British in prisoner-of-war camps during the Boer War, spread by the ideology of muscular Christianity, essential to the resurgent Afrikaner nationalism of the middle 20th century that also produced the Broederbond, a secret masonic society that ran apartheid-era South Africa."

RU has a disgraceful history as I said, it's the sporting face of Apartheid. Along with Cricket it is the sport of the English artistrocracy, middle class private school games. With it being part of their cultural heritage there is no chance of a rival rugby code in RL taking off there.

They are rival codes. Where one is popular the other is not.

They are also both niche. If less than 5% of the planet is interested in RU, that's niche. In 100 plus years of RU it is still largely confined to the British isles, Aus, South Africa, NZ, Pacific islands, i.e. the British Empire, with only a region in the south west of France and a small middle class segment in Argentina outside that.

RU is not the all conquering behemoth you are making it out to be, and you are not being realistic in where you believe RL should be.

You are dellusional. Sure it's not your scene. It's the truth and it's an unfair reality in action against rugby league! Too hard basket for you! You are aware that the repression of rugby league is not just occuring in South Africa. Many places have had rugby league introduced with rugby union already in place. In Australia rugby league became the dominant code. The point is that the repression tactics being adopted by rugby union is not right or fair and should not be explained as cultural. It's a very deceitful form of bigotry. Both pervasive and well hidden. You dismiss it as not a big deal? Try telling the millions of potential people that have missed out on enjoying the true spartan challenge of playing rugby league! You do not get it DC80. I'm astounded at your bigotry and disrespectful stance on the principle of ' live and let live'. No open mindedness in your make up or common decency/regard for rugby league. I've infomed others of the examples of the repression against the code of rugby league and they are both amazed and cognisant that this sort of thing can happen and clearly has happened. They all comment that its unfair and had no idea/knowledge until they read the articles! And yet you justify it as cultural and insignificant. Once again SHAME ON YOU!

 

[LeagueXIII]

Just wanted a straight up answer Pommy. Not a quiz ! Its a very good article. It reveals how people in power can influence the destiny of a sport. Rugby league being the sport in focus not only in South Africa but elsewhere. The article shows exactly how the unfairness is perpertuated. He has a telltale conclusion which identifies the source of this repression. The source happens to be " Fear" . And that is fear of rugby league becoming the dominant code of rugby!

True, the biggest problem league faces is the mass media attempting to marginalise the game, it is happening in Australia and the sport is popular here but the people who are not "rusted on supporters" are the ones we are losing to AFL or other sports. These were the ones we were winning over during the Tina Turner years etc.

It is what is holding back the game from growing in all other countries as it struggles to expand it's popularity.

 

[Stallion]

True, the biggest problem league faces is the mass media attempting to marginalise the game, it is happening in Australia and the sport is popular here but the people who are not "rusted on supporters" are the ones we are losing to AFL or other sports. These were the ones we were winning over during the Tina Turner years etc.

It is what is holding back the game from growing in all other countries as it struggles to expand it's popularity.

Very much agree. And we have spoilers at work within the administration and on sites like this that compound the growth issue for rugby league in the face of a hidden and very deviously influential rival code in rugby union. GLAD YOU ARE AWARE! Shame these so called fans of rugby league don't understand or appreciate how pervasive and damaging the repression is. The telltale article by the NZ journalist pinpoints what and how this repression takes place. The so called fans that dont read it or dismiss it as a South African only thing are way off the mark. The repression of rugby league is extensive, pervasive and aimed to keep rugby union in its undeserving presence over the more attractive and entertaining code to both play and watch in rugby league. It's there but some on this site and within RL choose to either ignore or avoid the issue. Until this is proactively acknowledged and aired in the public eye rugby league will continue to struggle..It's not right or fair! And this code can do something about it but it needs to actively engage the public about the many injustices and anomalies (like continued no elite private school access) that are not questioned in the public sphere or psyche.
My previous degree in Communication Studies alerted me to the way the media can influence society and this is a real life scenario for this code under attack and stifled by containment with its true "strength" the NRL also being attacked with subversive ill directed development and splits (superleague) that we have sadly winessed.

 

[DC80]

The principle of ' live and let live' is a bizarre way to look at this. That's not the real world.

Let's take out the cultural connection/loyalty to a code, like you and I have with RL, like white South Africa has to RU, and let's look at the competition aspect.

RU and RL are competing codes, just as McDonald's and Burger King are competing fast food chains. It's ridiculous to think one will give the other a leg up.

When RL split from RU in 1895 - and justifiably so - it created two competing codes, a dog eat dog environment, both fighting for the same players, the same audience. That's the consequence of the split. Sport is business, you don't give a direct competitor a slice of your pie.

Drop the vague "rest of the world" nonsense and just focus on the countries where the two codes have any meaningful footprint.

RU = British isles (Eng, Ire, Sco, Wales), France (south west), Aus, NZ, South Africa, Argentina, minor Pacific islands.
RL = England, Australia, NZ (Auckland), Fra (Catalans), PNG, minor Pacific islands.

That's it. The rest of the world don't give two hoots about either code.


England, RL is predominantly popular in towns along the M62 motorway in the north of England. This is where all 11 English teams in SL are from. Go a few miles outside these towns the sport barely exists. Major northern English cities, working class cities, Liverpool, Manchester, Sheffield, there is little interest in either rugby code. RU is predominantly popular in the south of England, wealthy suburbs in the Home Counties, and the middle class in the West Country.

Ire and Scot only RU is played, both in colleges, with RU being the 4th choice sport in Ireland, and second choice in Scotland - a distant second to football.

Wales, RU is in the blood. Football would have a significant presence also. Like NZ, RL will always be a distant second to RU. While Wales RU team sell out 74k Millenium stadium for just about every game, in 2013 the Wales RL team played a RLWC game in Wales and got 5k in a small stadium in Wrexham, that's an indication of where the two codes rank there.

France, both codes support is based in the south west, though RU far outweighs RL.

Aus, you know the situation there.

NZ, RU is in the blood, RL has a decent presence but will always play second fiddle to RL.

South Africa, RU is in the blood of the white populous, football of the black.

Argentina, RU is a minority sport, played in colleges.


So what exactly do you want from each of those nine countries for RL?