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The Rally 10:00 am tomorrow

Suitman

Post Whore
Messages
56,195
Its not meant to be personal, at least not from my point of view.

Agreed.
I'm not, and haven't attacked the person. Just the opinions he generates.
MITS and I are like brothers. Seriously, next time we catch up, we'll have a drink and discuss all this stuff. As we have done before.

However, I just disagree with just about everything he says.

Suity
 

bazza

Immortal
Messages
31,540
Do the clubs Directors and CEO have an agenda, I can say with certainty that they do. It is to make Parramatta the best club going in the NRL. In every way possible, and to do so responsibly.

I have no doubt that the board and employees of the club all aim to make Parramatta the best club it can be and to win a premiership

I also believe that John Howard, Kevin Rudd, Paul Keating and Bob Hawke all wanted Australia to become a better country and that the Parramatta players and coach go out into every game to win.

However, I don't always think that the Parramatta team has the right players on the field or use the best tactics. Similarly I don't always agree that policies put in by politicians are always what is best for the country.

I do know that politicians always want to get re-elected and football players don't want to get dropped. I am sure that the current board of the football club aren't going out of their way to make it easier for new people to get voted in - even though new people might be able to do a better job than them
 

fish eel

Immortal
Messages
42,876
Sorry Suity but all of those comments are a complete cop out.

We all know the club is confusing. What you all don't know is why, I have tried to explain it, but you want the club back the way it was. Okay then I suggest you vote for Robert Forsmbee in the election as he wants the same thing.

No Mark, what people want is not the way the club was, because, tbh, the 70s mindset your mates on the board are locked into is what is holding this club back from fullfilling it's potential.

What people want is the club to move forward and be the biggest and best it can.

Time and again, on this board, you have defended yourself against accusations of just defending the club, of just being a mouthpiece for them - but it seems discussions around the election have finally smoked you out of your cave, and forced you into line behind your mates.

But thats OK. I understand you might want to go into bat for them, because you know, if you dont, they might read what you say...
 

Suitman

Post Whore
Messages
56,195
No Mark, what people want is not the way the club was, because, tbh, the 70s mindset your mates on the board are locked into is what is holding this club back from fullfilling it's potential.

What people want is the club to move forward and be the biggest and best it can.

Time and again, on this board, you have defended yourself against accusations of just defending the club, of just being a mouthpiece for them - but it seems discussions around the election have finally smoked you out of your cave, and forced you into line behind your mates.

But thats OK. I understand you might want to go into bat for them, because you know, if you dont, they might read what you say...

And that is the crux of it.

Suity
 

PJ Marshal

Coach
Messages
13,525
after reading alot of stuff on these forums latley...i think one of the clubs biggest problems at the moment is its supporters
 

bartman

Immortal
Messages
41,022
Thanks for taking the time to make this post quoted below Mark. I read it at the time, and think it's probably the clearest description of the events that led to our NRL club becoming a unique entity at arms length from direct membership that I have read.

I didn't want this post to get lost in this thread, as the issue of where the NRL club sits structurally seems to be coming up as an election issue... and we all might want to think this through.

The club has moved the NRL license to the Leagues Club, hence creating a New Company PNRLC.

PNRLC was created at a time of change in the National First grade competition, around 1999 or 2000.

The Football club was at that time a board that held a 5 - 2 leagues club director vs Football Club director split.

Those 2 directors started asking for more money than the leagues club directors (for want of a better term, i.e. those that were members of each board). believed to be required for the continued operation of the PDRLC in the NRL competition as well as all other competitions.

The recent collapse of the Bears and the poor state of players contracts also caused issues with player retention and a general nervous feeling among players in the NRL competition.

The Parramatta club was also starting to worry about the amount of grant being given as it would start to attract a tax in NSW. Being as the Parramatta DRLC was one of the most heavily subsidized clubs in the NRL. If the amounts continued to increase its grants could be taxed, meaning an extra amount of money would need to be found to pay the government to allow the club to make the transfer. Every dollar after the limit would also include a tax meaning the PDRLC might not be able to react well to sudden increased needs for funding (Super League still fresh in everyones mind).

Parramatta's 5 Leagues club directors the moved to have the NRL transferred to the Parramatta Leagues club in the understanding that the Leagues Club would create a separate company to run the Club. This would mean all funding requirements were guaranteed which appealed to players. Ensured the NRL side and the football club were singing off the same Hymn sheet in regards to requirements and reduced the amount of possible tax the club was exposed to.

At the Parramatta DRLC AGM many questions were raised about this. There was a loud and vocal group that Represented the 2 non leagues club aligned directors, who were from the NPT (New Parramatta Team). Before the Election of directors (which takes placed before the Notice of motions). Tony Zappia, removed himself from the Ballot after discovering he had been placed on the NPT's how to vote ticket, without his permission. Coach Brian Smith, and Fullback Clinton Schifcofske spoke about the stability having a guaranteed contract would have for Parramatta in the player market.

The Members voted, Ovo asked if a show of hands or actual election was required. A show of hands was tried and a majority voted for the motion so no ballot casting was required.

From that time on the PNRLC was created and the PDRLC only dealt with Reserve Grade/ Premier League, Jersey Flegg, SG Ball and Harold Matthews.

The provision is that to play for the PNRLC you must be a member of the PDRLC, and abide by the terms laid out as a member of the PDRLC (can't play for anyone else and the like).

So the side effects are, The NRL club has only 7 members, they are the current directors. The PDRLC does not control the NRL club directly as it is a leagues club asset. PNRLC does all season tickets as it is the main show at the stadium, it then asks the PDRLC to help "fill the card" as it were, in regards to who plays.

You buy your Season ticket from the PNRLC, as well as Blue and Gold Army Membership.

In 2000 or 2001, the PDRLC year book came out, sans the NRL club photos, reports and stats due to the PDRLC not being in control of the side, members were outraged and asked that such information be allowed back into the report, so as to continue to accurately document the activities of the Parramatta Eels in all grades they compete in, from 2001 or 2002 this was re-added.

Having read it again, and having been of the belief that whatever the history behind it, the NRL club operations should be a bit closer to fans/membership influence, I have a few questions.

These questions aren't necessarily for you Mark to answer. They are just general questions that I feel remain unaddressed in terms of why the club board(s) should stick to this structure moving forward in the future. I acknowledge I could direct these questions to the club itself or current directors for an answer, but this is more me thinking out loud, and whoever answers (if anyone) then so be it.

OK.

1. Why was our NRL team/club one of the most heavily subsidised clubs in 1999 or 2000? What did the other NRL clubs/teams have going for them revenue wise that we didn't? And is that still the case?

2. Fair enough about the benefits of having guaranteed player contracts following the Bears demise. But how did other clubs respond to this challenge, without creating a separate entity/structure for their NRL club, arms length away from any members? Did we gain an advantage in the player market from this unique move? Is that advantage still in place or has it proved an irrelevant tactic when compared with how other clubs operate and the game has moved on?

3. Fair enough about the (Leagues) club trying to minimise it tax payable on the subsidy grant to operate our league teams as we know them. Why was tax minimisation not a priority for other clubs in the same way at that time? How have other clubs then and since gone about subsiding their NRL and other operations without this unique structure? Has this structure achieved its goal or is its goal relevant anymore, given we are now told the pokie tax and smoking ban are the big threats to the Leagues club subsidy in the future?

4. If the PNRLC controls Season Tickets and Blue and Gold Army, what is stopping them offering/opening up an NRL "Membership", as other clubs have been doing. Either as an inclusion to the Season Ticket package or the B&G Army package, or as a costed optional add on? I don't get why this isn't a possibility.

5. Instead of "getting real" and joining in promoting NRL memberships (not just the merchandising B&G Army or STs without a say) for the good of the game, it seems our (leagues) club was content to push it back into the Footy Club as far as the annual report NRL content went following an outrage. Why hasn't the club instituted or promoted an NRL membership - or pushed that concept back to the accompanying Footy Club membership to take on that nominal role (regardless of the technicalities of the structure) as well?

The 5-2 split reads now like it might have been the Leagues Club reps using their power/numbers to achieve what at the time was deemed (by them, and a membership that voted with them) in the overall clubs' best interests. It will be an interesting scenario down the track if there are some people on both the Footy Club and Leagues Club Boards who use their numbers/power (should they get any in the coming elections and in April) to propose what they deem to be in the best interest of the overall club in terms of the PNRLC structure for the future, and again let the membership(s) decide on that....
 
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