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The shoulder charge debate thread

adamkungl

Immortal
Messages
42,971
can you provide examples of something in the workplace that doctors or experts said should be banned but not ?

No, nor will I try, because that's not what I said.

I said you can apply "if it saves just 1 life..." logic to countless every day activities that could be safer.
 
Messages
1,630
that 1 incident resulted in a dead player.

can you imagine if that was Live Friday night NRL game.

when someone dies from a shoulder charge that all 16 doctors wrote a letter to the NRL to ban then the game has massive liability.

do you understand anything about the law ?

ethical, legal and moral responsibility ?

Red the article in 2012 from below

http://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nrl...ge-from-the-game/story-fn2mcuj6-1226423232247

LEADING sports doctors are united - the shoulder charge should be outlawed in the NRL as soon as possible.

After 104 years, the game's most controversial tackle is finally set to be banned. The Daily Telegraph can reveal all 16 NRL club doctors are united in calling for an immediate ruling from the league.

Amid worldwide fears about concussion in sport, a committee has been set up to investigate the physical impact a shoulder charge can have on a player's neck, head or brain.

Exhibit A should be Saturday night's horror tackle on Dragons' Dean Young by Rabbitoh Greg Inglis. The Souths fullback collected Young in the head with his shoulder, and the Dragon had to leave the field in a neck brace aboard a medicab.

The committee will be headed by former Sydney Roosters chief executive Brian Canavan and include ex-rugby league doctor Hugh Hazard, NRL chief medical officer Ron Muratore, principal scientist at the NSW Institute of Sport Kenneth Graham and Donna O'Connor, an associate professor at Sydney University.

Spokesman for the Rugby League Medical Officer's Association of club doctors, orthopedic surgeon Sam Sorrenti, said last night the shoulder charge must be banned.

"It is only a matter of time before there is a major disaster," Sorrenti said. "It's very dangerous and if it goes wrong, there can be terrible concussion. There is no point reacting after something has gone wrong. We don't want to turn rugby league into a sissy's game but we have a duty of care for the players' welfare.

"Our job is to warn the NRL of the potential problems. It's up to the NRL to take that advice. The rules need to be modified ASAP to protect the players' long-term wellbeing."

The NRL match review committee is today expected to charge Inglis.

SG Managament, the company which looks after Young, went on Twitter yesterday, revealing how sick the Dragons player was.

"True story. Dean Young told trainer: 'Tell Brownie (former Dragons coach Nathan Brown) to put me back on'. Gaga land last night. Lost five years of memory," the company tweeted.

Canavan's committee, set up before the Inglis incident, hopes to have a report for the NRL in the coming weeks.

"We will do it thoroughly and it will be all evidence-based rather than opinion," Canavan said.

Michael Johnson, who was Parramatta's doctor for 33 years, also called on the NRL to eradicate the shoulder injury.

"It should be banned because of the risk to the head and neck," Johnson said.

"It's becoming an epidemic now - it is the current-day stiff arm tackle. I don't think it will be long before there is a serious neck or brain injury. Players hit repeatedly in the head will be punch-drunk 20 years after they stop playing."

Roosters medical officer Dr John Orchard says there have been 15 players taken out of games by dubious tackles, but in only one instance was there a send-off, with Dragons star, Matt Prior marched for elbowing Cowboys skipper Johnathan Thurston.

NRL director of football Nathan McGuirk confirmed the tackle was under scrutiny.

"It is too early to come to any conclusion but hopefully it will be completed by the end of the year," he said.

All well and good, but we haven't seen any shoulder charges this year. You have to charge for it to be a shoulder charge.
 

Tinkler

Juniors
Messages
430
Not worth it.

This logic could be applied countless times in every day situations.

No, nor will I try, because that's not what I said.

I said you can apply "if it saves just 1 life..." logic to countless every day activities that could be safer.

shoulder charging is not an everyday activity ?

is the removal of shoulder charging in the NRL impacting your quality of life ?

99.9999% of the people in the world never watch shoulder charging in daily life.

do you understand this logic ?
 

Tinkler

Juniors
Messages
430
First they banned fists. Then they banned shoulders. They'll be coming for the elbow next.

its cleaning up the game happening in all sports around the world as well, no more fighting

its about attracting the biggest audience which includes more women and kids.

more sponsors more money $$$


if you want fighting watch UFC there is more then enough violence in other areas.
 

insert.pause

First Grade
Messages
6,461
The NRL set the rule, then they changed it 4 weeks prior to the finals because of 1 incident that got some media attention. So that is piss poor imo.

Also how does Willie Mason get suspended but Guerra and Luke get off? Parker, GI and Mason were on sterlo last night when the Luke decision came through. Parker was basically in the middle of saying he supports the black and white stance the NRL are taking and then once the decision came through he just said he has no idea about the rule now. Everyone is confused by this crap. Rushing rule changes late midseason because of individual incidents not being handled the way they want is absolutely ridiculous IMO.

The NRL changed the interpretation because the MRC screwed up in not charging Evans, had they done that we wouldn't have an issue, now the MRC has gone to the extreme opposite and is charging players for anything that resembles a shoulder charge according to the strict wording of the law, despite context of the tackle, it's one thing to have a rule but the reason the MRC is made up of former players is because they are supposed to have a feel for the game to then apply the rule to proper purpose- the context for what the rule is intended to do.
 
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Nice Beaver

First Grade
Messages
5,920
its cleaning up the game happening in all sports around the world as well, no more fighting

its about attracting the biggest audience which includes more women and kids.

more sponsors more money $$$


if you want fighting watch UFC there is more then enough violence in other areas.

I understand the point you are trying to make, but to say this ridiculous knee jerk reaction rule the NRL have brought in will bring more sponsorsip $$ is at best speculation, at worst utter rubbish.

The sanitising of league with the rule changes over the past few deasons is turning spectators and viewers away from the game.

I fail to see how your argument on one hand is to mitigate legal action but then also to bring in more dollars and fans.

League has its supporter base because of its gladiatorial nature.

In saying that, I am happy for the shoulder charge, in its pure form of forcibly hitting a bloke with the intent of leading with the shoulder,being banned.

The issue everyone has is the dickheads at NRL headquarters thinking split second defensive actions constituting a shoulder charge.
 

Tinkler

Juniors
Messages
430
I understand the point you are trying to make, but to say this ridiculous knee jerk reaction rule the NRL have brought in will bring more sponsorsip $$ is at best speculation, at worst utter rubbish.

The sanitising of league with the rule changes over the past few deasons is turning spectators and viewers away from the game.

I fail to see how your argument on one hand is to mitigate legal action but then also to bring in more dollars and fans.

League has its supporter base because of its gladiatorial nature.

In saying that, I am happy for the shoulder charge, in its pure form of forcibly hitting a bloke with the intent of leading with the shoulder,being banned.

The issue everyone has is the dickheads at NRL headquarters thinking split second defensive actions constituting a shoulder charge.

rubbish... maybe some old farts turn off because they are old grumpy and hate anything thats changed

more younger and more female fans are watching...the game

every football code AFL, Rugby and even NFL are stopping fighting and cleaning up the game and the tv rights get bigger every year...

there is no shoulder charge in rugby... and AFL has cleaned up its game more then NRL and its more popular every year
 

Mr Spock!

Referee
Messages
22,502
Latest news.

Motor racing is following NRL's guidelines.

Formula one and all vehicular events (such as Bathurst) have now banned speeding and overtaking.

Just to keep the softcocks happy.
 

adamkungl

Immortal
Messages
42,971
]The NRL changed the interpretation because the MRC screwed up in not charging Evans, had they done that we wouldn't have an issue[/B], now the MRC has gone to the extreme opposite and is charging players for anything that resembles a shoulder charge according to the strict wording of the law, despite context of the tackle, it's one thing to have a rule but the reason the MRC is made up of former players is because they are supposed to have a feel for the game to then apply the rule to proper purpose- the context for what the rule is intended to do.

Completely false.

The MRC did their job according to the rules, which stated that only shoulder charges that make head contact result in a judiciary charge. Which looking back, was a pretty sensible rule...
 

Nice Beaver

First Grade
Messages
5,920
rubbish... maybe some old farts turn off because they are old grumpy and hate anything thats changed

more younger and more female fans are watching...the game

every football code AFL, Rugby and even NFL are stopping fighting and cleaning up the game and the tv rights get bigger every year...

there is no shoulder charge in rugby... and AFL has cleaned up its game more then NRL and its more popular every year

OK, tried to have a reasonably adult conversation with you, but you are clearly just an idiot so why bother.

Don't sit there and quote a bunch of shit, trumpeting your evidence then start with the "oh rubbish" like that is some sort of factual evidence.

"Old farts" ??? :crazy: Who the f*ck are you kidding? What are you? 16?

To even try and bring rugby union into your argument on popularity of sports is completely laughable and debases your entire argument. Union is and has been a dead sport walking in Australia for years. :roll:
 

Tinkler

Juniors
Messages
430
OK, tried to have a reasonably adult conversation with you, but you are clearly just an idiot so why bother.

Don't sit there and quote a bunch of shit, trumpeting your evidence then start with the "oh rubbish" like that is some sort of factual evidence.

"Old farts" ??? :crazy: Who the f*ck are you kidding? What are you? 16?

To even try and bring rugby union into your argument on popularity of sports is completely laughable and debases your entire argument. Union is and has been a dead sport walking in Australia for years. :roll:

Rugby world cup is the third biggest sports event in the world behind olympics and soccer world cup and the sevens are in the olympics.

In America rugby is the fastest growing team sport.
 

bfoord

Juniors
Messages
433
Completely false.

The MRC did their job according to the rules, which stated that only shoulder charges that make head contact result in a judiciary charge. Which looking back, was a pretty sensible rule...

So then you wouldn't have charged Molo for the shoulder charge that killed Ackerman?

Because that didn't hit him in the head.
 

adamkungl

Immortal
Messages
42,971
OK, tried to have a reasonably adult conversation with you, but you are clearly just an idiot so why bother.

Don't bother. He's an already banned multiple account shit talker who spends 90% of his time on here making threads about Cronulla.
 

adamkungl

Immortal
Messages
42,971
So then you wouldn't have charged Molo for the shoulder charge that killed Ackerman?

Because that didn't hit him in the head.

Correct. Since those were the rules.

Giving Molo 8 weeks doesn't bring Ackerman back and certainly pales in comparison to the mental impact of accidentally killing someone. Completely pointless.
 

insert.pause

First Grade
Messages
6,461
Completely false.

The MRC did their job according to the rules, which stated that only shoulder charges that make head contact result in a judiciary charge. Which looking back, was a pretty sensible rule...

No, the rule says contact with head or neck or create whiplash effect. There was clearly whiplash on Kasiano.

Bennett summed up my thoughts on the whole mess today when he said the system worked the way it's supposed to,

But the issue of the week is the shoulder charge and it was apparent Bennett caught the throng off-guard with his response to three players escaping suspensions at the judiciary on Wednesday night.

A member of the NRL rules committee, Bennett has been critical of the NRL in a number of areas during the course of the season but on this occasion applauded a system that permits a successful defence to be made.

"The match review committee charged some players and the judiciary found them not to be guilty and I think that's a wonderful system, we should applaud it," Bennett said. "It's not a closed shop.

"I thought it was a great win for the game personally."

But isn't there a mixed message that is confusing the rugby league public?

"I know what a shoulder charge is and I'm not confused."

Simple as that.
http://www.nrl.com/what-on-earth-is-wayne-bennett-thinking/tabid/10874/newsid/89082/default.aspx
 

Tinkler

Juniors
Messages
430
Correct. Since those were the rules.

Giving Molo 8 weeks doesn't bring Ackerman back and certainly pales in comparison to the mental impact of accidentally killing someone. Completely pointless.



62718455.jpg
 

POPEYE

Coach
Messages
11,397
Don't bother. He's an already banned multiple account shit talker who spends 90% of his time on here making threads about Cronulla.

I've got AG stalking me pretending to be Mogsheen someone or other but he serves a purpose, Tinkler on the other hand is becoming a real nuisance
 

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