The T.V Rights Thread Part III

[BuffaloRules]

They have very strict restrictions on how they invest.

Anyway, the point is that if you throw lots of money at things in a business environment, you have higher ROI expectations. You'd want better than 10% profit margin right?

Yes, restrictions to protect their members...

Your point is moot as there are no guarantees about anything at the moment in the current business environment..

 

[Karl]

Yes, restrictions to protect their members...

Your point is moot as there are no guarantees about anything at the moment in the current business environment..

The point is not moot. I have made it badly however and used an example that was not very good and not very relevant in many ways. The games have a value in terms of the amount someone will pay for the rights to televise them. That value is a product of the profit thy will generate for the Network that buys those rights. If they pay 10Million per game they must make 10 Million back plus cover their costs to get the gamea to air plus make a profit on top of that. There may be intangibles like the halo effect and perceived prestige etc, but they are the cream. You need to show a cash dollar profit first and it needs to be sufficient to justify the risk.

They would need to make at least 15 Million a game if they pay 10 Million in my view. The question is, can they do that from advertising in a, maybe, 3 hour window?

 

[Edwahu]

So explain to me, on an ROI basis, how 9, 7 or 10 makes a commercial rate of return on an outlay of the 10 Million Dollars per Game.

If you have $10,000,000 you can invest that in the sharemarket/equities/property and with little to moderate risk make say 10% return per annum, or a million dollars on it. I should get some capital growth as well, maybe 5%, so after a year I have $11.5 Million.

If I throw it at a Television Broadcast then the risk obviously is higher, there is no residual capital value so I need to make all of the investment back plus the return. I therefore want a much higher ROI in order to justify the risk and lack of capital security. A combined 11.5% return ain't gonna cut it, but for this lets say it does, that I am happy to spend 10 to make 11.5.

How do I generate 11.5 Million dollars from 1 State of origin game, even as an average return over 3 games in the series? Someone explain the numbers because I can't make it add up based on available advertising revenue, even allowing for a "halo effect" etc.

(forget for a second that if i have 30 Million to invest I can make a LOT more than 11.5% returns and still run very moderate risks compared to a major TV event.)

Ok, what advertising rate did you use to calculate the potential revenue?

 

[docbrown]

The point is not moot. I have made it badly however and used an example that was not very good and not very relevant in many ways.

Television is its own beast. Trying to compare it with real estate or the stockmarket is fraught with danger and is usually a sign of a non-creative mind trying to frame it an incorrect manner.

As for the argument - "Why aren't entertainment companies diversified with other (potentially higher yielding) revenue streams?" - tell me how well you think GE-NBCUniversal are going at managing NBC...

It's like diversifying into the film industry and going "You guys have been making too many flops. Here's the new strategy - make more hits".

(that's based on a real event btw) :lol:

If you take over Channel 9 what will you say - "Hey, instead of making shit, let's make shows people want to watch!" or "Hey, instead of making shit, let's gamble on the stock market!" The company is what it is, the industry is what it is. Why do they exist? Because they already existed. To some degree it's a glamour industry - make of that what you will...

As for how television networks makes money - it's things like direct ad revenue, indirect sponsor revenue and international rights sales. Why do you think 9 loves Underbelly? It's not because it made a bundle here - it's because it sold to a huge number of countries.

So how can they fund say $10 million game tilt at Origin. Well current figures suggest it currently makes about $6-7 million a game approx for 9 already. Increase ad breaks to the degree that's been discussed elsewhere, tie into other programming, cross promotion and overall halo - definitely capable of a few million more. It'll come close.

It may be a loss leader - but pay attention next time you see a Channel 9 add. They usually show 'NRL' and 'State of Origin' as two separate marquee programmes - and although it might be February, they'll pull ever cent from year round promotion that they can.

I'd be keen to see what Channel 7 can do with Origin. They will treat it for the Goliath that it is.

From memory 9 had a rare weekly ratings win for last week. I wonder why that is.

 

[colly]

OK first post, this is what I would like to happen with the media rights negations. eg. NINE/ TEN Free to air to be given 4 games each, with 3 exclusive




Friday night football shared between 2 FTA TV Stations. Eg Nine/Ten whom seem up for it. One can have NSW market the other QLD,( they could swap/and show alternative game on other digital channels. Free to air has 2 Sat nights games (one after the other) probably 5.30/7.30 or 6.00/8.00
Each channell will get either a Sunday avo 4.00 live or Monday night live.


Fri 7.45 live Qld game Nine (NSWgame on other digital channel) Three month rotation.
Fri 7.45 live NSW game Ten (Qld game on other digital channel)
Sat 5.30 /6.00 Live Nine
Sat 7.30/8.00 Live Ten
Sun 4.00 Live Nine
Mon 7.00 Live Ten
I will explain latter why latte. To this schedule work a anther QLD team ie 17 Teams(possibly Brisbane) AND the game clock stops for all stoppages. Also adds strategically placed ie Dropouts. More game time is needed/and WANTED. There is ten minutes wated with try restarts.dropouts, srum formations equals less product.
The reason why the game schedule and TV arrangements work best is because if you sell this to Nine and ten FOR $65 MILLION each per year you have enough bargaining power over Foxtel.
Ten 70m times 6 years equals 420m
Nine 70m times 6 years equals 420m Total FTA NRL only 840 million
In the Australian newspaper Nine was reported to make $60-70m per year in add revenue (with 1 live and two delayed)
If your following this then 2 game remain for Foxtel/Telstra maybe Fetch. Anyway now you are in a better barging position in regards FOXTEL. I currently pay Austar/Foxtel (which is maj. Owned Telstra) and you look out for the fans if it is on free to air (when it is live) and in showbiz you can neve3r get enough exposure (you die when you don't get exposure)
In my game theory Foxtel will hold out because it can. Neither Nine or ten can spend over 450 million, remember Kerry STOKES/Seven payed I think 450 for AFL. But we are going to get 375 to 420 million each from Ten and Nine. Now Fotel can be told NO, that’s not enough. We could survive on this ie 820 million and Foxtel and Austar loses subs big time, After half a year they will come crawling back. However we don’t have much for them 2 games exclusive and 1 Game Sat (5.30) and 1 game Sunday in conjunction with TV. In this example Foxtel line up ( see above)could be Sat 5.306.00 game (in conjunction with nine) Sat 7.30 one of their excliusive games. (Then repeat of the Sat 7.30/8.00 Ten game at 9.30 Sat . So they have a super saturday in king 5.30 game 7.30 exclusive and repeat of the ten game.
Sunday Foxtel can eith have a 2pm game as now. It is less games than their 5 live but here the kicker Too bad Mr Ken Williams in law to Gough and now News chief, Further refinement whereby possible one other game could be shared with the FTA but THEY MUST PAY MORE THAN AFL PRICE (600M) ONLY SLIGHT ADJUSTED .I would expect something like the FTA PAY PER YEAR IE 375-420 M or 70-80m per year. Now how to divy up the Sate of origin and finals, Ten has first 2 state of origins (all finals except the grand final( Nine has the third State of origin and the grand final. Can change yearly if it pleases the networks. This deal ensuresthe networks make money.. Each network has more games than Nine has and their all live, some exclusive (like Friday) punters/fans id desired can forgo Foxtel and everyone a winner.

 

[PaddyBoy]

Seven plus Nine would be a number too big for Ten
Garry Linnell
June 1, 2012
Read later
TELEVISION'S two fiercest rivals - the Seven and Nine networks - have discussed an unprecedented deal to share coverage of Australia's two biggest football codes.

Under the proposal, Seven would show at least one NRL game live in NSW and Queensland, while Nine would broadcast an AFL match in the southern states.

The move, which would quash any hopes by the Ten network of gaining a ratings foothold in either code, comes amid manoeuvring for the upcoming league broadcast rights which are expected to reap more than $1 billion for the NRL.

Advertisement: Story continues below
''It's definitely on the table,'' said a source close to the discussions. ''It's been discussed and there's a real chance it could happen.''

It is believed the Nine-Seven discussion about the potential sharing of AFL and NRL games was first raised several months ago.

A Seven-Nine free-to-air trade would allow pay TV's Fox Sports the flexibility to simulcast all rugby league matches as it presently does with AFL matches, further adding value to any future rights package.

The chief executive of the NRL, David Gallop, said he was unaware of the Nine-Seven talks but was not surprised that such an unprecedented option was being considered.

''We're at a stage where there's no doubt there is a lot of talk going on behind the scenes,'' Mr Gallop said.

''While not privy to all discussions, it does underline the interest out there in all of our products.''

The NRL held initial talks with Ten and Seven last month after current rights holders Nine and Fox Sports submitted their first formal bids. A joint bid by both is expected in the next two months, with the League hoping to reach an agreement by September.

The Australian Rugby League Commission has joined forces with corporate advisers Greenhill Caliburn to negotiate the new rights package. Industry analysts have valued the rugby league five-year package at $950 million but league sources say they may consider extending any deal by another year to capitalise on the current market interest.

A key aspect of the negotiations will revolve around State of Origin matches and the potential of Fox Sports to set up a dedicated rugby league channel along the lines of its AFL version.

The NRL was buoyed last month by the record television audience for this year's first State of Origin, in which an average nationwide audience of 2.51 million watched Queensland defeat NSW at Melbourne's Etihad Stadium.

Last year Seven, Foxtel and Telstra paid a record $1.25 billion over five years for the AFL broadcast rights, a rise of more than $400 million on the previous deal and underscoring Australian football's status as the nation's richest code.

Industry analysts believe Seven and its partners ultimately paid too much for the AFL package, but the main free-to-air networks and Foxtel are content to view them as ''loss leaders'' and key audience drivers.

Ten has signalled a strong interest in bidding for the NRL rights.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/sport/seven-p...big-for-ten-20120531-1zkvi.html#ixzz1wSOKRwyr

 

[Canard]

Mick Molloy had a mini-tiff with Eddie McGuire on Melbourne Triple M this morning about Channel 10 moving the AFL show Before the Game being moved from Saturday night to Thu night.

Eddie is claiming that it's all because 10 is making a run at NRL.

He was saying 10 is going to "split" up the game(as in hurt AFL)

 

[Broncos thats my team]

I dont like the 7&9 proposal, sounds like RL would get same terible treetment in the other states.

 

[carlosthedwarf]

I dont like the 7&9 proposal, sounds like RL would get same terible treetment in the other states.

Agreed 100%. But it shows that the Ten bid is serious and Nine is desperate to have some form of major sport, even if it means sharing the NRL with Seven.

 

[Silent Knight]

I dont like the 7&9 proposal, sounds like RL would get same terible treetment in the other states.

I concur. It is my dream to see Channel Nein lose the NRL rights completely. No more Rabs, Gus, Hadley or Fatty. Rugby league deserves a better commentary team. I was hoping it was Channel 7's intention to bury Nein, not to jump in bed with them.

 

[BuffaloRules]

Mick Molloy had a mini-tiff with Eddie McGuire on Melbourne Triple M this morning about Channel 10 moving the AFL show Before the Game being moved from Saturday night to Thu night.

Eddie is claiming that it's all because 10 is making a run at NRL.

He was saying 10 is going to "split" up the game(as in hurt AFL)

So Ten does not have the rights to any AFL games, but Eddie still expects them to stay loyal and show some stupid pre game show at the expense of having some actual sport to broadcast?

Strange blokes these Victorians...

 

[El Diablo]

could force Ten to put in a big bid if they have the coin

it would be disastrous for them if 7 and 9 had both NRL and AFL

 

[Brutus]

So Ten does not have the rights to any AFL games, but Eddie still expects them to stay loyal and show some stupid pre game show at the expense of having some actual sport to broadcast?

Strange blokes these Victorians...

Wow. So these clowns have a pre-game show despite not actually having the rights. That will do me.

 

[Canucks]

could force Ten to put in a big bid if they have the coin

it would be disastrous for them if 7 and 9 had both NRL and AFL

I'm not much into conspiracys however I still think Ten will put in a massive bid. The fact that Rinehart has invested in Ten is an indication, in my opinion, that Rinehart wants to manage the message from the news etc and influence dialog. This can only be done if enough people watch Ten. I'm less convinced that her investment is about making a return, I mean come on, in the last month she has made 300m or something, what's her ten investment... 70m?

I think she'll tip some in.... It will be a competitive bid.... High ratings for Ten and she wins.... regardless of share price.....

 

[El Diablo]

get Gina to back a WA team

 

[carlosthedwarf]

Wow. So these clowns have a pre-game show despite not actually having the rights. That will do me.

I think they have a post game show too (After The Game)

 

[El Diablo]

I think they have a post game show too (After The Game)

aka In The Boggers

 

[applesauce]

Wow. So these clowns have a pre-game show despite not actually having the rights. That will do me.

9 do the same.

 

[Phil McGrawhan]

Does anyone else here suspect that 7 ALSO has a co-sharing arrangement plan with 10.
I would think that 7 have all contingenies covered .
Plus at the moment 10 seems to be quiet& not showing their hand.

A week on the piss if its a 7/10/Fox or 10/Fox combo & 9 are left to rot.

 

[Silent Knight]

A week on the piss if its a 7/10/Fox or 10/Fox combo & 9 are left to rot.

A-f***ing-men to that. League followers everywhere would rejoice.