Trent Merrin on Anthony Griffin

[Fangs]

How do you know this? Are you part of the coaching staff that you know our game plan?
Just wondering as you seem sure that we had a no grubber edict

No I am not a member of the Penrith coaching staff. If I was I'd be fired by now.

I recall a game in Brisbane earlier this year. We got towelled and made a late comeback. Brad Fittler mentioned that Penrith's gameplan revolved around not giving away 7 tackle sets, hence no grubbers. He isn't part of the coaching staff either. It was either inside knowledge, or he simply watched us play football like I did.

It was the same gameplan we ran with last year on our way to the finals. Except this year our offloads dried up as well.

 

[franklin2323]

It wouldn't have even been mentioned during the negotiations.

But there is no doubt that grubbers weren't in Penrith's game plan for most of 2016 and 2017. Thankfully that did change.

Doesn't mean it was gameplan though. I doubt Cleary would of done many grubbers while carving teams up in lower grades. Certainly Bryce would rather offload then grubber.

It is why the older head was needed for the halves

 

[franklin2323]

How do you know this? Are you part of the coaching staff that you know our game plan?
Just wondering as you seem sure that we had a no grubber edict

We don't do grubbers much in NYC either. More to do with the mindset of the players than anything I would say

 

[OldPanther]

We don't do grubbers much in NYC either. More to do with the mindset of the players than anything I would say

I suspect it stems from having good attacking teams but in 2017 our offloads/passing stopped so we couldn't offset the no kicking.

 

[franklin2323]

I suspect it stems from having good attacking teams but in 2017 our offloads/passing stopped so we couldn't offset the no kicking.

Teams learnt from 2016. Slow us down and we have nothing. It is why we struggled against good teams. CHN changed our attack gave as a forward to run on to short balls. Problem was changed fullbacks and lost the sweeping play to give us a different way to score too.

I guess it is why they say you need 50 odd FG games to become an NRL player. To develop other skills not used in juniors. I think that is all it is with us. Others think poor coaching time will tell I guess

 

[OldPanther]

Teams learnt from 2016. Slow us down and we have nothing. It is why we struggled against good teams. CHN changed our attack gave as a forward to run on to short balls. Problem was changed fullbacks and lost the sweeping play to give us a different way to score too.

I guess it is why they say you need 50 odd FG games to become an NRL player. To develop other skills not used in juniors. I think that is all it is with us. Others think poor coaching time will tell I guess

I'll wait to pass judgement. Maloney has the potential to fix these issues just by virtue of being a 2nd threat and buying us an extra second with the ball.

 

[franklin2323]

I'll wait to pass judgement. Maloney has the potential to fix these issues just by virtue of being a 2nd threat and buying us an extra second with the ball.

I am the same way. I can see reasons why we struggled so I like to keep an open mind. That said we scored more than the Roosters, NQ, Parra and Sharks so it more scoring them consistently moreso then scoring fullstop

 

[mxlegend99]

I'll wait to pass judgement. Maloney has the potential to fix these issues just by virtue of being a 2nd threat and buying us an extra second with the ball.

The problem is we had those issues with Moylan and he was more dangerous as a second threat.

Our structure needs to adapt to the strengths of the players we have. We have freaks all over the park. They just arent that threatening when we play so flat and predictably.

Cartwright firing will make more difference to our attack then any other player aswell. If we use him as a ball playing lock he's pretty much our most dangerous player. He has the size to bust through the line. Ball playing skills to put others through. An offload so you need to number up on him in defence and the strength to make good metres even when they do.

We just need to make sure he doesn't feel a need to create something from bothing all the time and that he plays what he sees. At 6 he seemed to go for a play thinking he had to. He had no patience.

 

[franklin2323]

The problem is we had those issues with Moylan and he was more dangerous as a second threat.

Our structure needs to adapt to the strengths of the players we have. We have freaks all over the park. They just arent that threatening when we play so flat and predictably.

Cartwright firing will make more difference to our attack then any other player aswell. If we use him as a ball playing lock he's pretty much our most dangerous player. He has the size to bust through the line. Ball playing skills to put others through. An offload so you need to number up on him in defence and the strength to make good metres even when they do.

We just need to make sure he doesn't feel a need to create something from bothing all the time and that he plays what he sees. At 6 he seemed to go for a play thinking he had to. He had no patience.

Using our centres and Cartwright firing will be the big difference. I think Maloney will be more a calming influence instead of us losing our heads. He can calm and get the repeat set etc.

We just need one good either try or try assist from Bryce a game and not to lose his head when nothing is happening

 

[OldPanther]

The problem is we had those issues with Moylan and he was more dangerous as a second threat.

Our structure needs to adapt to the strengths of the players we have. We have freaks all over the park. They just arent that threatening when we play so flat and predictably.

Cartwright firing will make more difference to our attack then any other player aswell. If we use him as a ball playing lock he's pretty much our most dangerous player. He has the size to bust through the line. Ball playing skills to put others through. An offload so you need to number up on him in defence and the strength to make good metres even when they do.

We just need to make sure he doesn't feel a need to create something from bothing all the time and that he plays what he sees. At 6 he seemed to go for a play thinking he had to. He had no patience.

I agree. I'm just applying an unhealthy dose of wishful thinking after the media smashed us about the poor attack. Griffin has to know it needs to be better.

 

[umina panther]

Using our centres and Cartwright firing will be the big difference. I think Maloney will be more a calming influence instead of us losing our heads. He can calm and get the repeat set etc.

We just need one good either try or try assist from Bryce a game and not to lose his head when nothing is happening

Maloney won't help anything if we keep the same flat attack. Its nonsese

 

[billypilgrimnz]

We just need one good either try or try assist from Bryce a game and not to lose his head when nothing is happening

i.e., for him to be coached better. I'm glad we agree.

 

[franklin2323]

i.e., for him to be coached better. I'm glad we agree.

Adam Blair has played for the best coaches in the game yet still has multiple brain explosions a game. It's not something you can always coach out but having more structure in the key positions may allow him to realise sometimes it is better to hold the pass instead of throwing it

 

[franklin2323]

Maloney won't help anything if we keep the same flat attack. Its nonsese

Dude we outscored 4 other Top 8 teams. the attack wasn't horrible just stupid at times. Look at the Broncs final we kept going short to CHN. Moga was helping make the tackle meaning a pass wider or a kick to DWZ or Whare we score. That is the difference between putting 40 on Newcastle and competing with top 4 teams

 

[franklin2323]

I agree. I'm just applying an unhealthy dose of wishful thinking after the media smashed us about the poor attack. Griffin has to know it needs to be better.

as I said we scored 504 points. 21 per game isn't too bad what will happen is breakdown our performances against top teams and work out where to fix that

 

[Pomoz]

Yeah that Peter Wallace really lacks experience, sorry mate but I find most of what you said ridiculous. Walsh and Burns were hardened NRL players? Lol they were garbage there is not a coach in the world that would take and combination of Walsh, Burns and John over Cleary, Moylan and TMM.

Are you saying that Walsh and Burns weren't experienced NRL players? MX argued Cleary had lots of spine changes. I countered by saying no he didn't and he also didn't have mainly rookies. If you can find the sentence where I said "Burns and Walsh were brilliant" then please quote me and highlight it in bold. I will then apologise profusely.

According to the Oxford dictionary the word hardened means and I quote "Very experienced in a particular job or activity and therefore not easily upset by its more unpleasant aspects". You will note that it doesn't mean that somebody is brilliant. According to the Oxford dictionary the word brilliant means and I quote "Exceptionally clever or talented". I don't think the words "brilliant" and "Burns" and "Walsh" have ever been used by me in a sentence (or anyone else for that matter, except their Mum's), except when I was told they were leaving. In that case I even paired it with the word "f*#king", which really means brilliant on a scale of 11 out of 10.

Sure Wallace is experienced, but he has got old and slow which was why Hook moved him to Hooker. But when all is said and done, the players doing the creative stuff, were rookies. Time will tell if Cleary, TMM and May have better careers than Walsh and Burns. I hope they do. BTW Burns and Walsh have both managed to play over 200 games each between the NRL and Super League. In Burns case, that is quite exceptional since he spent lengthy spells on the sideline for fighting, head high tackles and generally being a mad bastard.

 

[Pomoz]

That game against the Broncos was so frustrating and it is one of the reasons why I'm not sure Cleary will be as good as Brandy. Brandy would have spotted that and our winger would have had a try feast. The vision required to spot that is hard to coach into somebody and Nathan doesn't seem to have that yet. Maybe it will come with experience, but Brandy was reading games like that very early in his career. Our wingers always scored plenty when Brandy was at half. Nathan has other skills, a better defender and more physically robust, a better goal kicker, but finding gaps he is still struggling with.

Hopefully, he will get a bit more time to think in the game with Maloney there. He will give him more space because the defence will have to watch two halves now. The defence can't rely on Cleary always being the goto kicker or playmaker. If we can get Cartwright and Edwards chiming in as well, Cleary will have more game time to think about the gameplay rather than just rush to finish the set and get ready for a....let me see...a spiral bomb.

 

[mxlegend99]

Dude we outscored 4 other Top 8 teams. the attack wasn't horrible just stupid at times. Look at the Broncs final we kept going short to CHN. Moga was helping make the tackle meaning a pass wider or a kick to DWZ or Whare we score. That is the difference between putting 40 on Newcastle and competing with top 4 teams

We are flat track bullies. Didnt veat a team that finished above 5th. But racked up some good scores against shit sides.

Natural talent wins easy games. A good coach will make the most of that talent and be able to win the tough games.

I dont think our halves mean shit without a decent game plan and attacking structure. Our attack didnt change too much from TMM, Cartwright, Moylan or May at 6. All that changed was those players moments of individual brilliance.

Even Cleary didnt play too differently depending on his 6. It was the quality of our opposition that changed most.

Our coach needs to work to pur players strengths. Try to hide their weaknesses and not blame the players for his game plans and attacking structure not being good enough.

We have a roster capable of the top 4. We just dont have a coach that can get them there

 

[franklin2323]

That game against the Broncos was so frustrating and it is one of the reasons why I'm not sure Cleary will be as good as Brandy. Brandy would have spotted that and our winger would have had a try feast. The vision required to spot that is hard to coach into somebody and Nathan doesn't seem to have that yet. Maybe it will come with experience, but Brandy was reading games like that very early in his career. Our wingers always scored plenty when Brandy was at half. Nathan has other skills, a better defender and more physically robust, a better goal kicker, but finding gaps he is still struggling with.

Hopefully, he will get a bit more time to think in the game with Maloney there. He will give him more space because the defence will have to watch two halves now. The defence can't rely on Cleary always being the goto kicker or playmaker. If we can get Cartwright and Edwards chiming in as well, Cleary will have more game time to think about the gameplay rather than just rush to finish the set and get ready for a....let me see...a spiral bomb.

I am sure there were other occasions but that stood out as it was only him left. The fact he is only 20 and skipped the stint in NSW Cup imo every player needs means we are seeing him learning on field.

 

[umina panther]

100%mx

Its about scoring against top 4 sides, not toweling up plodders