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Ultrathread I: Thread of the Year - 2014

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Misanthrope

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Just think of all the wars and/or conflicts that would have be avoided if there were only one religious belief

Not World War I, World War II, the Korean War, the Vietnamese War, or any of the recent wars in the Middle East, that's for sure.
 

Bazal

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I'm of the opinion that anyone who is against genetically modified crops is ultimately pro people starving.
 

Bazal

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Hmmm...you've made me reconsider my world view :sarcasm:

Actually, there's probably a GM crop for that
 

muzby

Village Idiot
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Just think of all the wars and/or conflicts that would have be avoided if there were only one religious belief
exactly..

the Muslims respecting other Muslims in Syria and Iraq at the moment prove your point..
 

Dragon2010

First Grade
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GM crops definitely. Golden Rice for example, getting Vitamin A to people who desperately need it without the massive cost of nation wide supplement schemes.

We've been genetically modifying crops and animals for thousands upon thousands of years. AKA - Artificial Selection.

Artificial selection is the intentional reproduction of individuals in a population that have desirable traits. In organisms that reproduce sexually, two adults that possess a desired trait ? such as two parent plants that are tall ? are bred together.

How do you think we have domesticated animals and livestock such modern day pigs and cows?

I'd be for modifying children if it were removing potentially life threatening or quality of life lowering birth defects.

I'm 100% for it. Remove the at risk chromosome, improve their quality of life.

I've got a genetic condition my self, and while it's no means as life threatening or as sever as say downs syndrome, it's' something I plan to genetically remove so I can improve the quality of my kids life (When I eventually have one). Because, for me, it caused many issues.

life threatening birth defects, yes..

but as for the others, i dunno.. if it's not going to kill them, it's part of being human really..

our 2nd was born with a 1 in 10,000 defect.. was depressing at first, trying to think of ways it can be fixed, trying to work out what happened..

but, it doesn't look like it will affect her life, and now it's actually a cute little quirk that makes her unique..

well.. unique in every ten thousand people anyway...

I don't think we should input favoured genes (Ie. Designer babies), but I do believe we should remove at risk traits. Imagine being able to remove chromosomes that put people at risk of breast cancer, downs syndrome etc - all due to hereditary traits? You'd be able to give people to make one never have to suffer, never have to worry about such condition. It's a brave new world, one that we are still learning.

If I could go back 21 years and take this stupid defective chromosome away from me, I would. Because it's caused a multitude of issues, and will continue to affect my life.

Unique? More so a diminished quality of life I'd rather not have. Who cares about being "unique", "special" or "the way god made me", I want to be healthy and like the rest of people.

if you don't know what you're missing out on, are you missing out?

Better yet, I'd rather someone not be in such situation.

True enough, but all things being equal, wouldn't it be a better world if every child at least had the same opportunity to pursue basic things like getting married, having children, and working?

Obviously, it's a much bigger task to actually fix the world so everybody has an equal opportunity. Country of birth, religion, appearance, intelligence, upbringing etc are still going to be a factor - so why not at least eliminate the hindrance we can (potentially) control?

In an ideal world, we'd be able to remove the risk of severe mental or physical handicaps. Happy as people can be with them can be, I can't imagine a negative side to ensuring no children are born with a condition that may deprive them of a full life.

In today's world - it's becoming very possible. But where do we draw the line? People with money will eventually be able to get designer babies developed. Remove bad traits from the parents, put in optimum traits. It's literally making genetic super-soldiers.

Not World War I, World War II, the Korean War, the Vietnamese War, or any of the recent wars in the Middle East, that's for sure.

Middle East is partly to religion, depends which war you look at. As of now, the place is just a dump and in poor conditions.

I'm of the opinion that anyone who is against genetically modified crops is ultimately pro people starving.

:crazy:
 

Misanthrope

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Middle East is partly to religion, depends which war you look at. As of now, the place is just a dump and in poor conditions.

The wars the west have been involved in are about as much to do with preferred flavour of toothpaste as they are to do with religion. If we had oil, the US would find reasons to invade us too.
 

muzby

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The wars the west have been involved in are about as much to do with preferred flavour of toothpaste as they are to do with religion. If we had oil, the US would find reasons to invade us too.
those maggots don't use bacon flavoured toothpaste..

invade!!!!
 

Dragon2010

First Grade
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The wars the west have been involved in are about as much to do with preferred flavour of toothpaste as they are to do with religion. If we had oil, the US would find reasons to invade us too.

I'm talking years back, when issues were over "Eretz Israel". Six day war, Yom Kippur and so forth.
 

Misanthrope

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those maggots don't use bacon flavoured toothpaste..

Invade!!!!

لحم الخنزير المقدد معجون الأسنان هو أفضل معجون أسنان!
 

muzby

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Better yet, I'd rather someone not be in such situation.

so don't mean any offence by this question, but who are you to decide that on behalf of someone else?

whilst you may not wish something upon someone, if they are born the way they are, lets let them enjoy what they have..

if you 'suffer' from a condition, but are unaware you actually are suffering, then ignorance really is bliss..
 

Misanthrope

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so don't mean any offence by this question, but who are you to decide that on behalf of someone else?

whilst you may not wish something upon someone, if they are born the way they are, lets let them enjoy what they have..

if you 'suffer' from a condition, but are unaware you actually are suffering, then ignorance really is bliss..

I can't speak for D10, but certain non life-threatening conditions do considerably hinder a person's ability to learn, to interact with other people, or to procreate.

Minor things that aren't life-threatening, sure, but I see no reason why we would leave the risk of seriously hindering conditions like dwarfism, Down Syndrome etc in play if we could be rid of them.
 

Apey

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On the religion sub-topic for a moment I echo the sentiments mentioned previously by others. Hopefully one day it will just naturally fade into complete irrelevance. I think it will take a long, long time though, centuries and beyond, and it will probably never be completely gone anyway. As long as it's at the point where it has precisely no bearing on humanity's progress.
 

Dragon2010

First Grade
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so don't mean any offence by this question, but who are you to decide that on behalf of someone else?

whilst you may not wish something upon someone, if they are born the way they are, lets let them enjoy what they have..

if you 'suffer' from a condition, but are unaware you actually are suffering, then ignorance really is bliss..

None taken, but look at this way. I've suffered first hand. So my opinion is that, no one should have to suffer if the parents are aware of such.

FGS (Foetal gene screening) is a new innovation that is coming to the market - through a small foetal blood sample that is drawn, it allows them to check for abnormalities and give the soon to be parents, data on whether their kid is at risk (Never 100% chance) if they will have autism, downs syndrome and a range of other conditions. At this stage in time, it's to late to remove said gene as the embryo is already developing, but they have the option to either terminate the pregnancy, or proceed but be made aware of the risks much earlier.

I did a survey on that last year, many people approved of such, others didn't and said "You are the way you are" (So to speak). While it's slightly off-topic, the technology now is advancing to stage where we can genetically re-combinate right at fertilisation.

My condition while it can be recessive (As noted in my mother, who got nil from it), when made an active coding trait, can cause a multitude of issues. For me, growing-up I suffered years and years on end. My holidays were spent in hospitals getting tests, I suffered socially, I was a mental mess, it cause me to have physical issues as well. Was it life threatening? No. But it's not something anyone should have to go though.

I believe, every person is entitled to life to the fullest, without having it impended by something that we have the technology to remove. I'd love for my child to live without my condition for the pure fact, I don't want them to go through the pain I did.

It's about improving a quality of life, not playing god, not taking away chance - but giving someone a chance to be healthy, to be normal and to fit in.

I can't speak for D10, but certain non life-threatening conditions do considerably hinder a person's ability to learn, to interact with other people, or to procreate.

Minor things that aren't life-threatening, sure, but I see no reason why we would leave the risk of seriously hindering conditions like dwarfism, Down Syndrome etc in play if we could be rid of them.

This.
 

Dani

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I would imagine I'd be a very different person today if I'd not grown up diabetic.

In saying that, until the past 12 months I'd have told you I never, ever wanted to have children because I could bare to pass it on (of course the father would have to be a carrier). My mum used to blame herself, obviously that's a crazy thing that loving (ha!) mothers do, and it was probably just as hard on her. And that really had an affect on me, to the point where I flat out refused the thought of children for well over a decade.

Like D2010, it's no means life threatening, to some degree, but it does make things hard sometimes, not to mention the terrible effect it'll have on my health as I get older.
 

Dragon2010

First Grade
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8,953
I would imagine I'd be a very different person today if I'd not grown up diabetic.

In saying that, until the past 12 months I'd have told you I never, ever wanted to have children because I could bare to pass it on (of course the father would have to be a carrier). My mum used to blame herself, obviously that's a crazy thing that loving (ha!) mothers do, and it was probably just as hard on her. And that really had an affect on me, to the point where I flat out refused the thought of children for well over a decade.

Like D2010, it's no means life threatening, to some degree, but it does make things hard sometimes, not to mention the terrible effect it'll have on my health as I get older.

Any condition that affects ones life to a degree should be able to be removed prior to birth.

However, that won't stop someone from developing diabetes type 2, or another type of cancer, but it can remove other traits that have a history of being hereditary. Such as, breast cancer in some family lineages.

IMO, if we could determine an unborn child's sexual orientation, it would be wrong to make them homosexual.

GO!

If I had designer babies, my daughters would most definitely be lesbians.

We're not quite that advanced with this method, yet.

If we had designer babies the average penis size would nearly triple

We're not quite that advanced with this method, yet.

However, :lol:
 

Joker's Wild

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17,894
The wars the west have been involved in are about as much to do with preferred flavour of toothpaste as they are to do with religion. If we had oil, the US would find reasons to invade us too.

The current situation in Afghanistan has nothing to do with oil. Islamic extremism was the catalyst for that particular shit storm
 
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