Why does rugby league have trouble expanding internationally compared to other codes

[taipan]

Yes, because in Australia Rugby is RU. It's the accepted usage of the term.

Nice rant. Answers nothing. What many leave out of the French RL equation was the wholesale conversion of clubs from Rugby after France were banned from the then 4N's for dirty play and then their wholesale return after France was re-admitted. And didn't France contest the 1st RLWC final in 1954. Still seemed pretty competitive. No denying the Vichy period of history but I would suggest the history of French RL is more impeded by poor administration than anything.

As for being banned from the Defence Forces. Poor excuse. Rugby League had the resources to take control of its own destiny in terms of international expansio but chose to look inward.

Quite happy to use the theme song at the RWC,when it suits .The World in Union. The Australian Rugby UNION ARU

A deflection(" nice rant" ) by bringing in dirty play, when dirty play was involved well before 1941 and one of the very reasons rl took hold. Simply the French rl assets were seized and handed over eventually to the rugby union.
One of the reasons the RLWC was staged was to secure more funds.

You do understand there were rl players left over from the war years ,who continued to play when they could.
Do you understand having no Govt recognition,therefore no Govt grants, no access to schools puts a code back in the woods.If union was not allowed in Private Schools in this country for decades ,it would be stuffed by now .

French rl has indeed had poor admin at times, but having no money or assets to work with is not exactly the way to get moving.Poor admin is a minor player ,money which you are happy to admit is the most important ,was not available.You changed your tune?
The ARU is poorly administered and had $43m post RWC 2003.Look at the shambles now.

You are deluded with the poor excuse comment.
The very fact rl could not access the Armed service for decades and where these same Armed Services went to many countries to serve or to train, and spread their code,is evidence enough ,and the very reason the British Govt finally intervened due to this bigotry.
Therefore you can have the resources but if you cannot access the Armed Services the exercise is fruitless.

Funny how rl was introduced to PNG by the members of the Australian Army in the 40s.

 

[taipan]

You're not familiar with hypotheticals are you? You'll noticed I use this little two letter word 'if'. Not will, not eventually but 'if'. I've been saying that IF it were to occur then Rugby would largely absorb League.

Oh, just for a gas I quickly calculated how much those f300,000 would be worth today. Just under f5,100,000. Converting that to € that's just under €778,000. The FFR could do that easily.

Why throw in hypotheticals ,when the chances of it happening are next to zero.The NRL would have to crash, and that is extremely unlikely.
I prefer to deal with facts.

If they(FFR) could do that easily ,then why do they not do it?The French Govt pointed the finger at them in 2002.
And the other assets purloined .The opportunity income lost over the decades.What figure can you put on that?
The generations lost to the code,because they could not access the game in schools til a year ago.

 

[taipan]

Or somebody would have to walk in with a very big cheque-book. This kind of thing has happened before.

And we know how that ended up.Super league the game that brought ET to Shanghai.Oh wait.

We have an entrepreneur in the USA wanting to get involved in rugby league ,firstly by a RLWC or SOO.
A Canadian RL team will be playing in a lower division semi pro UK rl comp.

 

[Teddyboy]

Does it. Still, that's a damn sight more than 500.

Holds 20000 but that was the semi final crowd for France against Australia.
It seemed like Concord was a bit of a waste of money but looks like a nice clean stadium.

 

[Teddyboy]

My thoughts on a merger happening would be if Rugby Union rules change that much it becomes nearly identical to Rugby League.
Watching the Ireland v All Blacks game in Chicago last week was aa great result for Ireland and great crowd for World Rugby and the 2nd half was good but the game still needs to tidy up and change it's rules as from an outsider view I lot of Americans didn't know what was going on esp with the stopping/starting/penalties and kicking the ball out etc.

 

[Whatwhere]

My thoughts on a merger happening would be if Rugby Union rules change that much it becomes nearly identical to Rugby League.
Watching the Ireland v All Blacks game in Chicago last week was aa great result for Ireland and great crowd for World Rugby and the 2nd half was good but the game still needs to tidy up and change it's rules as from an outsider view I lot of Americans didn't know what was going on esp with the stopping/starting/penalties and kicking the ball out etc.

Watch much American Football? Stop start is just part of the game. For most it's more about learning the game. Which again isn't that difficult for many as AF has a lot of intricacies.

Regarding the need to tidy things up. No Rugby fan would disagree nor WR who are trialling a raft of new variations to encourage greater continuity of play.

 

[siv]

And Bob Hawke was quite friendly with Paul Keating.It's the now relationship.

I've stated there will be no merger ,for the various reasons I spelt out.Can't be any clearer.My argument is non.nay,never.
The NRL would have to be in a state of collapse, and that "ain't" likely to happen.

Whilst your'e at it ,lobby the French ru to hand back in today"s
equivalent of the 1941 300,000 French francs, nicked from the FRL's accounts in December 1941.

Now should French RL sue French RU for the return of stolen funds ?

 

[Te Kaha]

Now should French RL sue French RU for the return of stolen funds ?

There is something in law called the Statute of Limitations. Unless the French govt changes its laws it is no longer possible to sue anybody for "crimes" committed during WW2.

 

[Knownothing]

There is something in law called the Statute of Limitations. Unless the French govt changes its laws it is no longer possible to sue anybody for "crimes" committed during WW2.

If there was a case to be made, surely it would have been made 60 years ago?

 

[hutch]

My thoughts on a merger happening would be if Rugby Union rules change that much it becomes nearly identical to Rugby League.
Watching the Ireland v All Blacks game in Chicago last week was aa great result for Ireland and great crowd for World Rugby and the 2nd half was good but the game still needs to tidy up and change it's rules as from an outsider view I lot of Americans didn't know what was going on esp with the stopping/starting/penalties and kicking the ball out etc.

If rugby league didn't exist rugby union would look very similar to rugby league.

And three countries would have dominated the entire history of 'rugby', Aus, NZ and eng. How ironic!

 

[Stallion]

Quite happy to use the theme song at the RWC,when it suits .The World in Union. The Australian Rugby UNION ARU

A deflection(" nice rant" ) by bringing in dirty play, when dirty play was involved well before 1941 and one of the very reasons rl took hold. Simply the French rl assets were seized and handed over eventually to the rugby union.
One of the reasons the RLWC was staged was to secure more funds.

You do understand there were rl players left over from the war years ,who continued to play when they could.
Do you understand having no Govt recognition,therefore no Govt grants, no access to schools puts a code back in the woods.If union was not allowed in Private Schools in this country for decades ,it would be stuffed by now .

French rl has indeed had poor admin at times, but having no money or assets to work with is not exactly the way to get moving.Poor admin is a minor player ,money which you are happy to admit is the most important ,was not available.You changed your tune?
The ARU is poorly administered and had $43m post RWC 2003.Look at the shambles now.

You are deluded with the poor excuse comment.
The very fact rl could not access the Armed service for decades and where these same Armed Services went to many countries to serve or to train, and spread their code,is evidence enough ,and the very reason the British Govt finally intervened due to this bigotry.
Therefore you can have the resources but if you cannot access the Armed Services the exercise is fruitless.

Funny how rl was introduced to PNG by the members of the Australian Army in the 40s.

Great words and work Taipan!
Factor in that RU is a crap sport and propped up by the establishment to the Nth degree then we are seeing a genuine exercising of bigotry by the powers that be whom are biased toward RU at the loss for its better looking and much more appealing younger "rebel" brother rugby league!

I have an interesting tell tale article on how the RU influences have been thwarting the recognition of rugby league as a sport in South Africa. (2013) Apparently their is an ex RU player making the major government agency decisions for which sport gains recognition/funding within South Africa. Dare I say it RL doesn't get the nod & Boche along with table top dancing does etc! The repression is widespread but this article, written by a New Zealander ,whom follows both codes is very tell tale and shows how this sort of "spoiling" can be done elsewhere in other countries.

 

[taipan]

Now should French RL sue French RU for the return of stolen funds ?

If they had the money they would.It should be left to the French Govt(who provided the Commission findings) to make reparations or direct the FFR to pay up.
Why should an innocent party have to pay outlandish legal expenses.

 

[taipan]

If there was a case to be made, surely it would have been made 60 years ago?

How could a case be made 60 years ago, when the French Govt did not recognise rugby league ,instead calling it the game of X111.
Only last year rugby league could access (thanks to the govt)primary and high schools .

 

[Perth Red]

I think one thing Union can teach league is how important the international game is in attracting media, Govt support, general public interest and profile outside of the codes sporting fanbase. When the Lions tour every ex pat wants to go, many who will have never been to a union game before. When England win the RUWC it was massive media and remains talked about today, Sevens in the Olympics has been a massive boost for their profile, especially womens sevens. That sort of profile you just don't get at club level. closest we come is Origin but by its nature that still is only relevant to a sub section of the country.

How League gets money and its act together to ever get there is the unanswerable question. At our current rate we might have a decent International calendar and profile by around 2065.

In regards to on the field, League is simply 100 years of a sports evolution and what Union would look like it if evolved rather than was stuck in its traditional ways.

I do think the name similarity does League no favours though, especially once we conceded the term "Rugby" and allowed union to monopolise it.

 

[adamkungl]

I think one thing Union can teach league is how important the international game is in attracting media, Govt support, general public interest and profile outside of the codes sporting fanbase. When the Lions tour every ex pat wants to go, many who will have never been to a union game before. When England win the RUWC it was massive media and remains talked about today, Sevens in the Olympics has been a massive boost for their profile, especially womens sevens. That sort of profile you just don't get at club level. closest we come is Origin but by its nature that still is only relevant to a sub section of the country.

How League gets money and its act together to ever get there is the unanswerable question. At our current rate we might have a decent International calendar and profile by around 2065.

That's it. While we keep saying we can't have the Kangaroos play England every year because the special snowflake players want the year off or because we have to play 26 rounds of suburban footy we are limiting the game to it's tiny corners of the earth.

There should be enough test matches to play in London, Paris, Melbourne, Christchurch, Cardiff, Glasgow, Dublin, Wellington every single year - as well as the heartlands!

 

[Whatwhere]

I think one thing Union can teach league is how important the international game is in attracting media, Govt support, general public interest and profile outside of the codes sporting fanbase. When the Lions tour every ex pat wants to go, many who will have never been to a union game before. When England win the RUWC it was massive media and remains talked about today, Sevens in the Olympics has been a massive boost for their profile, especially womens sevens. That sort of profile you just don't get at club level. closest we come is Origin but by its nature that still is only relevant to a sub section of the country.

How League gets money and its act together to ever get there is the unanswerable question. At our current rate we might have a decent International calendar and profile by around 2065.

In regards to on the field, League is simply 100 years of a sports evolution and what Union would look like it if evolved rather than was stuck in its traditional ways.

I do think the name similarity does League no favours though, especially once we conceded the term "Rugby" and allowed union to monopolise it.

Part of Rugby success and thus access to increased funding etc. has been the RWC. While much of the game had to be dragged kicking and screaming into the conceptas soon as they recognised its potential they went all in.

The RWC was transformed to the centrepiece event and a huge source of financial strength for the game. Strength that it has poured back into development as a means of building it further. And it has worked. World Rugby made a record profit from England 2015 that now will permit them to spemd over $330m over the next 3 years developing the game further leading into Japan.

It has also allowed for it to make the leap into less commercially established regions for the game in terms of the event such as Japan 2019 as they know that in 2023 when it returns to Europe (most likely Ireland) they are looking at breaking records again.

 

[Knownothing]

Money talks, always has, always will, especially when it comes to professional sport.



All the talk about unfair influence, discrimination, trickery, etc etc misses the point totally.



There is huge money in international sport, but it does not come without putting a lot of time, money, and effort in.

 

[Stallion]

a

Part of Rugby success and thus access to increased funding etc. has been the RWC. While much of the game had to be dragged kicking and screaming into the conceptas soon as they recognised its potential they went all in.

The RWC was transformed to the centrepiece event and a huge source of financial strength for the game. Strength that it has poured back into development as a means of building it further. And it has worked. World Rugby made a record profit from England 2015 that now will permit them to spemd over $330m over the next 3 years developing the game further leading into Japan.

It has also allowed for it to make the leap into less commercially established regions for the game in terms of the event such as Japan 2019 as they know that in 2023 when it returns to Europe (most likely Ireland) they are looking at breaking records again.

Most of rugby unions so called "success" is based on bigotry toward a better and more attractive rugby version that being rugby league. RU has used its influence to deny natural progress and acceptance of rugby league. Hardly what I call a sport that has genuinely attracted valid popularity. It's a sham and a big one at that! But let's not tell anyone. Wouldn't want the well hidden bigotry to be made a public discourse would we? In reality rugby league rates consistently better than rugby union and this sort of appeal should transcend into mainstream world wide popularity but their is the constant "spoiler" at play in this scenario and RU is very good at hiding its devious tactics. Very unsportsmanlike to the nth degree but sadly very real. If only the public at large knew of this repression of rugby league. At least some of the tyrants would be brought to shame and rugby league could perhaps move on without the many obstacles it faces. The lack private school system access being a major barrier which leads to a lack of influence and fairness in the top end of town and government agencies at large.

 

[adamkungl]

The public wouldn't care. Rugby League isn't a human right that can be oppressed. Stop giving the clowns who have run the game with no expansion an excuse for their lack of vision.

 

[CowboyFuriousFury]

a
Most of rugby unions so called "success" is based on bigotry toward a better and more attractive rugby version that being rugby league. RU has used its influence to deny natural progress and acceptance of rugby league. Hardly what I call a sport that has genuinely attracted valid popularity. It's a sham and a big one at that! But let's not tell anyone. Wouldn't want the well hidden bigotry to be made a public discourse would we? In reality rugby league rates consistently better than rugby union and this sort of appeal should transcend into mainstream world wide popularity but their is the constant "spoiler" at play in this scenario and RU is very good at hiding its devious tactics. Very unsportsmanlike to the nth degree but sadly very real. If only the public at large knew of this repression of rugby league. At least some of the tyrants would be brought to shame and rugby league could perhaps move on without the many obstacles it faces. The lack private school system access being a major barrier which leads to a lack of influence and fairness in the top end of town and government agencies at large.

Rugby union has done things to league which isn't considered in the 'Olympic spirit' such as getting the code banned and suppressing it's potential growth. I wonder what the IOC would think of rugby actions towards league over the decades, to see a code that blatantly prevents another code from expanding by there actions.