Widdop seeks release

[Gareth67]

Somewhere in your post we actually agree on a number of points and yes, the media is most responsible for espousing Widdop's virtues as a player. Doesn't mean a lot really.
No one is trying to pull him down, just offering a different perspective based on observing him over the last 5 years.
As for carrying the team for years - well let just say that is a stretch.
Our main strength in recent seasons has been our pack of forwards - not Widdop.
I loved caning the Broncs up at Suncorp in a semi but the undeniable blunt instrument that crushed Brisbane that day was our forwards.
Sims was a wrecking ball backed by Frizzell, JDB and the others.

Have just finished watching the semi highlights and there is one thing that is most obvious , and that is that the Big Red V is going to have a great year .

 

[DragonJ]

Have just finished watching the semi highlights and there is one thing that is most obvious , and that is that the Big Red V is going to have a great year .View attachment 26483

I can send you a link where you can d/l the entire game if you like. Widdop was not close to one of our best despite the forwards rampaging all over their weaker opponents.

So in 2018 the one game he played against us as 5/8 the eels lost, trying their heart out, but still lost to an underperforming Dragons. He sure didn't pull them out of the shite that game - or many of the games going by their final position on the table.

I remember the game. Norman was good and frankly speaking, we were very lucky to get away with that game. The game that really sticks in my memory is one late in the 2017 season. At the business end of the season, we were as usual in free-fall and really needed to win. Along came Parra and Norman toyed with us. Up until that point I had no idea he could play that well. Behind our superior forward pack, I expect him to do what Widdop hasn't done for the past 5 years and really do some serious playmaking.

It sounds to me you are preparing to throw Norman under the bus in order to make excuses for Widdop. In the last 2 or 3 weeks I have seen this done with JDB, the forwards generally, Ben Hunt, Benji Marshall, Chinless and Brainless Price and Mary McFooknucle.

Good luck to you. I think he is going to play so well, you won't get the opportunity.

He doesn't have to he has carried the team for years

In theory this is true. It is the job of the marquee playmaker to carry the team. That's why he is paid the big bucks. And in the case of Widdop, it's why we have been such a rabble for the past 5 years. A bit of improvement last year on the back of Hunt and the still awesome forwards.

 

[RufusRex]

Yes .. if you look at it in terms of dollars per position we have close to the highest paid fullback in the league and will for 2019
We also have close to the best value half in the league with Norman being heavily subsidized by the eels for the same season

So the blokes you are lambasting for wasting dollars on fullback are saving us dollars in the halves. Circles and roundabouts.

As for use of the dollars - Johnson and Jennings probably the only players that could have boosted the team.

Widdop hanging around is giving us a chance at two things:

1. Giving Dufty time in the reggies to develop strengthen his game to the point where he could return in 2020 a better player - OR
2. Giving us a chance to enter the market and spend decent coin in 2020 on a fullback.

Plus the much needed depth in the halves which hurt us last season.

 

[Saint_JimmyG]

I prefer to call that era “the dark age”

Bubonic Plague also works.

 

[DragonJ]

Yes .. if you look at it in terms of dollars per position we have close to the highest paid fullback in the league and will for 2019
We also have close to the best value half in the league with Norman being heavily subsidized by the eels for the same season

So the blokes you are lambasting for wasting dollars on fullback are saving us dollars in the halves. Circles and roundabouts.

As for use of the dollars - Johnson and Jennings probably the only players that could have boosted the team.

Widdop hanging around is giving us a chance at two things:

1. Giving Dufty time in the reggies to develop strengthen his game to the point where he could return in 2020 a better player - OR
2. Giving us a chance to enter the market and spend decent coin in 2020 on a fullback.

Plus the much needed depth in the halves which hurt us last season.

No, no, no, no, no! You have to take the long view. Parra subsiding a player of Norman's ability is giving the club an almost unbelievable opportunity to recruit a top class player where we really need one (wingers) or to recruit some of the best young talent coming through or upgrade our existing young talent coming through.

But no. The f**king idiot McFooknuckle will spend it on a 29 year-old who has played very little fullback over a number of years, may or may not be good (and I think he will be) but most certainly won't be near as good as guys like Ponga, Tedesco and RTS who will be on less money.

 

[RufusRex]

Which top class player could we recruit for this season?
Johnson or Jennings would give us a boost this year but are not long term viable. Melbourne are the benchmark in wingers find ones on the fringe and give them a chance. We are doing that this year.

Widdops dollars this year dont impact on retaining the blokes we already have - opportunity may.

The long view is 2020 and beyond not 2019.


Of course there is the final thing that Widdop has a contract for 2019 that he is not asking to be released from and that the club can not cancel.

 

[True_Believer]

I remember the game. Norman was good and frankly speaking, we were very lucky to get away with that game. The game that really sticks in my memory is one late in the 2017 season. At the business end of the season, we were as usual in free-fall and really needed to win. Along came Parra and Norman toyed with us. Up until that point I had no idea he could play that well. Behind our superior forward pack, I expect him to do what Widdop hasn't done for the past 5 years and really do some serious playmaking.

It sounds to me you are preparing to throw Norman under the bus in order to make excuses for Widdop. In the last 2 or 3 weeks I have seen this done with JDB, the forwards generally, Ben Hunt, Benji Marshall, Chinless and Brainless Price and Mary McFooknucle.

Yes we were, but towards the end it was Widdop that stood up and coordinated the attack to get a severely underwhelming side over the line. It was Norman during that game that failed to close it out - so don't start bagging Widdop for that same action when your hero failed to do the same in a game that was virtually unlosable.

You are putting words in my mouth. I'm in no way throwing Norman under the bus or making any excuses. I am actually pointing out that you are creaming your pants over a player who has been totally underwhelming for years now - purely based on your dislike of Widdop. If anything, you are actually throwing Widdop under the bus and trying to talk up a player who has been nothing short of disappointing since his move to Parramatta. He has a good game here or there, but, as you like to point out with Widdop, he has failed to perform consistently no matter how much you talk him up.

If he was as good as you say, Parra would have performed much better over the years he's been there.

 

[Old Timer]

No, no, no, no, no! You have to take the long view. Parra subsiding a player of Norman's ability is giving the club an almost unbelievable opportunity to recruit a top class player where we really need one (wingers) or to recruit some of the best young talent coming through or upgrade our existing young talent coming through.

But no. The f**king idiot McFooknuckle will spend it on a 29 year-old who has played very little fullback over a number of years, may or may not be good (and I think he will be) but most certainly won't be near as good as guys like Ponga, Tedesco and RTS who will be on less money.

If we had not picked up Norman, Dufty would be FB and Widdop 5/8 and we would have progressed on that way.
Norman was never the target and we were not looking for another 5/8 however recruitment have made a snap last minute decision and we again end up with 3 halves on $$$$.
If the coach has any brains at all he will progress with Dufty at the back to begin the season as that in fact was the reality we were faced with once the Hayne plane crashed.
Not buying a FB was bad enough (if that was what we really needed) but manufacturing one is going to be even worse and then trying to take Dufty and make him into a winger is insanity.

 

[possm]

If we had not picked up Norman, Dufty would be FB and Widdop 5/8 and we would have progressed on that way.
Norman was never the target and we were not looking for another 5/8 however recruitment have made a snap last minute decision and we again end up with 3 halves on $$$$.
If the coach has any brains at all he will progress with Dufty at the back to begin the season as that in fact was the reality we were faced with once the Hayne plane crashed.
Not buying a FB was bad enough (if that was what we really needed) but manufacturing one is going to be even worse and then trying to take Dufty and make him into a winger is insanity.

Sorry OT. Recruiting Norman is the best thing that has happened for Dufty. Now he gets a year to address is problems and prove 'on the field in ISP' he has improved his defence, positional play, taking of the high ball and ability to run straight stepping through the line at speed. No doubt this season will be the make of break of Dufty.

If we played Dufty in first grade this season, there is a real prospect of him not being up to scratch on the skills mentioned above and 'as with Mann' be dropped to ISP never to see first grade at the Drgaons ever again.

 

[Como Connection]

Sorry, Norman was always the target.
CC

 

[DragonJ]

Which top class player could we recruit for this season?
Johnson or Jennings would give us a boost this year but are not long term viable. Melbourne are the benchmark in wingers find ones on the fringe and give them a chance. We are doing that this year.

Widdops dollars this year dont impact on retaining the blokes we already have - opportunity may.

The long view is 2020 and beyond not 2019.


Of course there is the final thing that Widdop has a contract for 2019 that he is not asking to be released from and that the club can not cancel.

Are you serious? Do I have to be specific? Myriads of ways. Front end some contracts now. Signing bonuses. Entice contracted players to break their contracts.

A hard, ruthless coach would tell Widdop he is playing in ISP as he is now superfluous to our needs. In the end, we would probably have to pay some of his salary but not much for him to go to the ESL immediately.

Yes we were, but towards the end it was Widdop that stood up and coordinated the attack to get a severely underwhelming side over the line. It was Norman during that game that failed to close it out - so don't start bagging Widdop for that same action when your hero failed to do the same in a game that was virtually unlosable.

You are putting words in my mouth. I'm in no way throwing Norman under the bus or making any excuses. I am actually pointing out that you are creaming your pants over a player who has been totally underwhelming for years now - purely based on your dislike of Widdop. If anything, you are actually throwing Widdop under the bus and trying to talk up a player who has been nothing short of disappointing since his move to Parramatta. He has a good game here or there, but, as you like to point out with Widdop, he has failed to perform consistently no matter how much you talk him up.

If he was as good as you say, Parra would have performed much better over the years he's been there.

Toward the end when? What season?

Well I'm not "creaming my pants". Just stating the fact that from what I have seen of him play, not too much, he is going to be a fantastic signing. It's just that unlike you I don't "cream my pants" over Widdop. We been a rabble ever since he arrived. I guess the most unsuccessful 5 years in the entire history of St George or SGI. As the (C) for around half and marquee playmaker for the entire period, surely you can admit more blame should be placed on him than anyone else. Does he mean that much to you that you can't accept that?

If we had not picked up Norman, Dufty would be FB and Widdop 5/8 and we would have progressed on that way.
Norman was never the target and we were not looking for another 5/8 however recruitment have made a snap last minute decision and we again end up with 3 halves on $$$$.
If the coach has any brains at all he will progress with Dufty at the back to begin the season as that in fact was the reality we were faced with once the Hayne plane crashed.
Not buying a FB was bad enough (if that was what we really needed) but manufacturing one is going to be even worse and then trying to take Dufty and make him into a winger is insanity.

Hayne didn't crash. I admit, now wouldn't be a good time to sign him due to "the optics" but I very much doubt he is guilty of any crime or will be found guilty of any crime.

I'm not too optimistic in regard to Dufty. One can't train him not to be manhandled by the opposition. PEDs, specifically human growth hormone, or irrelevance as an NRL player IMO. I think Widdop will be a significant improvement. But to have Widdop playing fullback and on more money than the likes of RTS, Ponga and Tedesco is a farce only McFooknuckle could be incompetent enough to oversee.

 

[to_ddeath]

Norman can definitely play on his day, but that's still a big if based on his dodgy network of mates & general tosserdom.
Very skeptical that he is the missing link, 2 years ago I would have said yes to him partnering Widdop well before Hunt entered the fray....but loose unhinged units like him are hard to rely upon for anything.
Let's hope he puts his footy and contract before his recreational habits this time around, they turned Packer around but this is a much bigger assignment.

 

[possm]

Are you serious? Do I have to be specific? Myriads of ways. Front end some contracts now. Signing bonuses. Entice contracted players to break their contracts.

A hard, ruthless coach would tell Widdop he is playing in ISP as he is now superfluous to our needs. In the end, we would probably have to pay some of his salary but not much for him to go to the ESL immediately.



Toward the end when? What season?

Well I'm not "creaming my pants". Just stating the fact that from what I have seen of him play, not too much, he is going to be a fantastic signing. It's just that unlike you I don't "cream my pants" over Widdop. We been a rabble ever since he arrived. I guess the most unsuccessful 5 years in the entire history of St George or SGI. As the (C) for around half and marquee playmaker for the entire period, surely you can admit more blame should be placed on him than anyone else. Does he mean that much to you that you can't accept that?



Hayne didn't crash. I admit, now wouldn't be a good time to sign him due to "the optics" but I very much doubt he is guilty of any crime or will be found guilty of any crime.

I'm not too optimistic in regard to Dufty. One can't train him not to be manhandled by the opposition. PEDs, specifically human growth hormone, or irrelevance as an NRL player IMO. I think Widdop will be a significant improvement. But to have Widdop playing fullback and on more money than the likes of RTS, Ponga and Tedesco is a farce only McFooknuckle could be incompetent enough to oversee.

I feel Widdop will start the season at fullback and Norman at five-eighth. That's not to say that if either does not perform well, there won't be changes made.

As far as salary comparisons are concerned, we really do not know the true facts but it was reported that Tedesco signed a 700k NRL contract and received a 500k TPA. I can't see Widdop anywhere near the figure of 1.2m per season.

 

[TruSaint]

@DragonJ .....

LMAO, .... Widdop, a premiership winner, 5/8th of the year, representing his country would be dumped to ISP...

As to your garbage that being a "rabble" since he arrived, how is that his fault ? ,... Lets bag him though because he was appointed Captain. His halves partners included a retiring Benji playing out of position and McCrone.

Good to see you are a legal eagle as well, .. you must know more about Haynes issues than most. Also, as to your last sentence, Mary is not in charge of recruiting.

PS Im not sold on Dufty either, but your obsession with Widdop is laughable.

Put t this way, I would rather have Gareth represent our club that Hayne / Norman / and co.

 

[Old Timer]

@DragonJ .....

LMAO, .... Widdop, a premiership winner, 5/8th of the year, representing his country would be dumped to ISP...

As to your garbage that being a "rabble" since he arrived, how is that his fault ? ,... Lets bag him though because he was appointed Captain. His halves partners included a retiring Benji playing out of position and McCrone.

Good to see you are a legal eagle as well, .. you must know more about Haynes issues than most. Also, as to your last sentence, Mary is not in charge of recruiting.

PS Im not sold on Dufty either, but your obsession with Widdop is laughable.

Put t this way, I would rather have Gareth represent our club that Hayne / Norman / and co.

Gotta love our colleagues obsession and willingness to bring everything onto the shoulders of 1 man
That being the case he should be able to do a simple comparison of what Norman has delivered as the “go to man at the Broncos and Eels” and also assess how sad the respective clubs and fans were to lose his services.

 

[JDHD]

If we had not picked up Norman, Dufty would be FB and Widdop 5/8 and we would have progressed on that way.
Norman was never the target and we were not looking for another 5/8 however recruitment have made a snap last minute decision and we again end up with 3 halves on $$$$.
If the coach has any brains at all he will progress with Dufty at the back to begin the season as that in fact was the reality we were faced with once the Hayne plane crashed.
Not buying a FB was bad enough (if that was what we really needed) but manufacturing one is going to be even worse and then trying to take Dufty and make him into a winger is insanity.

I don’t think recruitment made a snap decision so much as they were forced into one by Widdop asking for a release. I’d also argue that we had such poor halves for so long that having three rep quality halves on our books for one season is actually an excellent position to be in.

 

[Old Timer]

I don’t think recruitment made a snap decision so much as they were forced into one by Widdop asking for a release. I’d also argue that we had such poor halves for so long that having three rep quality halves on our books for one season is actually an excellent position to be in.

If the club thought FB was the issue buying another half doesn’t fix it.
We have a bad habit of using band aid solutions to fix major issues.
Going for Norman so early clearly shows we have no confidence in any of our young halves coming through the ranks and is one of the reasons I argue having Nicholls achieves nothing other than to block progress.

 

[Gareth67]

Dragon J - thanks for the offer however I have watched the game on a number of occasions . As to Widdop being the best player was not what I said , but that aside what I fail to understand is WHY oh WHY bring the man down in this his final season with the club ?

He certainly does not deserve this , he is not the perfect player , but has worn the Big Red V with distinction ever since he came to the club and is the ultimate professional.

Would much prefer that we all concentrate on looking forward to what promises to be a standout year for the Dragons and get behind each and everyone of our boys than nitpick deficiencies in particular players games , more so - before a ball has been kicked in this the new season .

 

[red rocket]

Sorry OT. Recruiting Norman is the best thing that has happened for Dufty. Now he gets a year to address is problems and prove 'on the field in ISP' he has improved his defence, positional play, taking of the high ball and ability to run straight stepping through the line at speed. No doubt this season will be the make of break of Dufty.

If we played Dufty in first grade this season, there is a real prospect of him not being up to scratch on the skills mentioned above and 'as with Mann' be dropped to ISP never to see first grade at the Drgaons ever again.

What a load of rubbish

 

[BLM01]

Are you serious? Do I have to be specific? Myriads of ways. Front end some contracts now. Signing bonuses. Entice contracted players to break their contracts.

A hard, ruthless coach would tell Widdop he is playing in ISP as he is now superfluous to our needs. In the end, we would probably have to pay some of his salary but not much for him to go to the ESL immediately.



Toward the end when? What season?

Well I'm not "creaming my pants". Just stating the fact that from what I have seen of him play, not too much, he is going to be a fantastic signing. It's just that unlike you I don't "cream my pants" over Widdop. We been a rabble ever since he arrived. I guess the most unsuccessful 5 years in the entire history of St George or SGI. As the (C) for around half and marquee playmaker for the entire period, surely you can admit more blame should be placed on him than anyone else. Does he mean that much to you that you can't accept that?



Hayne didn't crash. I admit, now wouldn't be a good time to sign him due to "the optics" but I very much doubt he is guilty of any crime or will be found guilty of any crime.

I'm not too optimistic in regard to Dufty. One can't train him not to be manhandled by the opposition. PEDs, specifically human growth hormone, or irrelevance as an NRL player IMO. I think Widdop will be a significant improvement. But to have Widdop playing fullback and on more money than the likes of RTS, Ponga and Tedesco is a farce only McFooknuckle could be incompetent enough to oversee.

The fact that you dont know the total all encompassing salaries of Tedesco & RTS or Widdop's flaws your argument re playing Widdop at fullback because of $$. You fail to mention the salaries of Munster (new deal) will play fullback, Hopoate, Trobejvich, Gutherson (do you know their salaries)