DUGAN NEXT

[rasaint]

Again Duges is being handled comfortably by opposition teams in recent years. He is a good nrl player seeking elite player money.

He was signed on the expectation that the early fabulous and prodigious ability at the Raiders would continue. He obtained a huge $ contract for those days from us after initially flicking us for the Broncos; that fell through and then we were 2nd hand rose by media reports. Since then a sort of 'folklore' has arisen around him by some Dragons supporters, despite that expectation never being realised. His 1st game against the Eels at Wollongong for us was his best.

The Dogs are about or have to signed him on a huge multi year contract? If they have I genuinely wish him the very best. Nothing wrong with any of us seeking the highest pay packet possible for our services. My opinion is that Josh is not anywhere near an elite player. Yes, he will continue to make some good runs and good tackles. However, we can not wreck our cap on a good player being paid way too much. Save it for Tedesco, Slater, Boyd, even Munster or Whiten.

 

[Saintsified]

So are you guys saying Josh Reynolds ($800K) is worth more than Dugan who wants 1m? also why compare him to Tedesco, sorry but Dugan has higher rep honours than Tedesco at this minute.

 

[Frank Facer]

So are you guys saying Josh Reynolds ($800K) is worth more than Dugan who wants 1m? also why compare him to Tedesco, sorry but Dugan has higher rep honours than Tedesco at this minute.

Well so far it looks like Wests believe that Josh Reynolds is worth 800K(to them). They were willing to pay Tedesco 1 mil plus a season. They now have to fill the fullback position and have 1 mil to spend on that position if they wish. As of yet Wests do not believe that Dugan is worth 800K plus.

As for comparing Dugan to Tedesco, they are both playing fullback, they were both off contract this year. One had numerous clubs lining up to sign him with reports of 1 mil plus a season, while Dugan thinks that he is worth 1 mil a season, but as of yet there have been no clubs who believe that Dugan is worth 1 mil a season. If you think that Dugan is better than Tedesco, based on Dugan achieving higher rep honors at this minute, then why weren't Easts and Canterbury trying to sign Dugan, instead of Tedesco?

I will put it this way, Tedesco is the player who can win you a comp, Dugan is not that player. I will now be backing Easts to win next year's premiership and minor premiership, because they will have Tedesco in their team. I will be an Easts fan next year, but my heart will be with Saints. If we had managed to sign Tedesco, with the squad we currently have and have Milne at centre instead of Aikten, I would have then believed that we were a genuine premiership threat. I doubt that we or any other club will win a comp with Dugan at fullback.

 

[Saintsified]

Well so far it looks like Wests believe that Josh Reynolds is worth 800K(to them). They were willing to pay Tedesco 1 mil plus a season. They now have to fill the fullback position and have 1 mil to spend on that position if they wish. As of yet Wests do not believe that Dugan is worth 800K plus.

As for comparing Dugan to Tedesco, they are both playing fullback, they were both off contract this year. One had numerous clubs lining up to sign him with reports of 1 mil plus a season, while Dugan thinks that he is worth 1 mil a season, but as of yet there have been no clubs who believe that Dugan is worth 1 mil a season. If you think that Dugan is better than Tedesco, based on Dugan achieving higher rep honors at this minute, then why weren't Easts and Canterbury trying to sign Dugan, instead of Tedesco?

I will put it this way, Tedesco is the player who can win you a comp, Dugan is not that player. I will now be backing Easts to win next year's premiership and minor premiership, because they will have Tedesco in their team. I will be an Easts fan next year, but my heart will be with Saints. If we had managed to sign Tedesco, with the squad we currently have and have Milne at centre instead of Aikten, I would have then believed that we were a genuine premiership threat. I doubt that we or any other club will win a comp with Dugan at fullback.

Sorry but Tedesco winning you a comp wont happen in a shit team hence why he bailed, because he cant, as for Dugan i credit him a lot for us being in the position we are in and if he stays he can win a comp and i will also credit him for having a lot to do with that....as for offers? how would we know? rumours are running around Dogs have signed him and he denies it. I rate Dugan better than Tedesco and i make no secret about it either. Look end of the day i guess it all depends what you're looking for in a player, sure Dugan cant do some of the mind boggling things that Tedesco can do, but Tedesco isnt exactly a warrior you would die for playing next too either like Dugan is...and i reckon if we made Dugan captain he would go up another level.

Anyway just my opinion, Tedesco will be like Hayne a one hit wonder or now and then pulls something off, going to Roosters was his best shot at title cause he had no balls to let Tigers build a team around him.

 

[BringTheNoise]

It is debatable what Dugan is worth. I think the 750K a season offer is quite generous. What do you think Dugan is worth?

Interesting question. Whilst I would agree $750k is a decent offer, I whole wholeheartedly disagree with Millward's suggestion that Dugan should be paid as a centre.

Dugan is right, he's the best fullback in the club. He's a world class player. He's an incumbent Test and NSW player. He has won NSW Player of the Series as a fullback. More importantly than all of that, throughout his Dragons career he has consistently been one of our best players. I can't even remember a single game where I thought to myself "geez Dugan is playing rubbish today". I don't see any of that changing in 2018 and beyond (assuming he re-signs).

I believe he's a franchise player. He has a rock star aura about him. In terms of the media and public he is probably the most talked about player in the club (and never for the wrong reasons since he joined us). He puts bums on seats, creates headlines and draws young fans to the club.

I believe the Dragons should offer him a contract that reflects his standing within the club. Offering him centre money (currently considered one of the least valued positions in terms of contract dollars) is an insult.

 

[BringTheNoise]

As for comparing Dugan to Tedesco, they are both playing fullback, they were both off contract this year. One had numerous clubs lining up to sign him with reports of 1 mil plus a season, while Dugan thinks that he is worth 1 mil a season, but as of yet there have been no clubs who believe that Dugan is worth 1 mil a season. If you think that Dugan is better than Tedesco, based on Dugan achieving higher rep honors at this minute, then why weren't Easts and Canterbury trying to sign Dugan, instead of Tedesco?.

Actually the main difference between Tedesco and Dugan being off contract is that Tedesco put himself on the open market and actively sought a contract with Roosters via Anthony Minichiello. Wests Tigers were the only club that offered a contract in the vicinity of $1 million per season and that was his biggest offer. He took unders to join the Roosters.

Dugan has made his priority to re-sign with the Dragons and openly stated as much. Bulldogs are very interested in Dugan his preference is to stay with Dragons.

 

[Ronnie Dobbs]

Well said by Duges.
He wants to stay.
He's has been over the last few years and still remains our best back.
Give him what it takes and stop the bullshit Millward. Embarrassing for Duges and our club.
FFS sign him up,
Just sort it out or let him go, FFS.

Its ultimately up to Duges whether he stays or goes.

Hey Josh, btw mate, you are playing in the Centres for Australia.

 

[dino2170]

I dont understand why he is stating that he is an elite player. In an article in the tele he says that he is not going to union and he still prefers SAINTS but does not know why SAINTS see him as a centre not a fullback. In the same article it says that both the BULLGRABS and TIGERS need a fullback.

I am sorry I cannot link the article in this post,

How can the BULLGRABS afford him under the cap????????

Me also thinks he is a spoiled person. AND he should remember that we resurrected his career.

 

[possm]

Well said by Duges.
He wants to stay.
He's has been over the last few years and still remains our best back.
Give him what it takes and stop the bullshit Millward. Embarrassing for Duges and our club.
FFS sign him up,
Just sort it out or let him go, FFS.

NO! It's now time to withdraw the offer and go in another direction. Surely members can now see the mess Millward has made and it never needed to come to this. By labelling Dugan as a centre to justify the Dragons offer, Dugan's nose was put out of joint and he had a ready made argument to hold out for 'fullback' money.

Sign up Milne, Lafai, Packer and Mann. Test Mann at fullback when Widdop returns and if he plays well, slot Mann in at fullback in 2018 and play him there until one of our juniors are ready for first grade.

The only alternative now would be to sign Hayne - with his TPA - along with Packer, Lafai and who ever else you can fit under the cap.

 

[dragonssamy61]

Dragons have a lot of excess baggage to clear (Mathews, KFL, Marketo, Masoe, Glymin, Hutchinson, Mcrone, etc.. ) between them there is $1.2M min worth of wages that will hit our bottom line .. Consider the fact that the salary cap will be increased by a $1m next year to $9.3M and w the departure of Marshall, Creagh, Rein, Farrell last year we gained an additional $1.3m in salary cap space of which only $500k and $300k went out to Vaughan and Mcdonald respectively .. So w the advent of around $500k under the cap this year plus the shedding of say $1.2M worth of talent this year plus the increase of $1m in salary cap there should be $2.7M worth of cap space plus TPAs to cover
Hunt $1M
DUGAN $850k
MANN $200k
Packer $450k
Lafai $250k

The above talent by my calculations will sit around $2.75M meaning we will need around $50k in TPA to cover..plus whatever we hs to shell out to cover Widdops additional wages.

Obviously the above is guesswork but it does give u an idea of where we could be at w salary cap management ..

I think your spot on mickeylane but I thibk we may have to pay more for mann .
He will be wanted.
Imo

 

[possm]

Mitchell is just about to turn 20 and can play with centre and fullback. He is being touted as a future star in the making.

Players like Mitchell are not in Millward's future plans. Field, Dufty, Masters and Sailor are all waiting for a chance to play fullback in first grade. This is the problem our Club will have to deal with over the next few years.

 

[Dennis Papaioannou]

NO! It's now time to withdraw the offer and go in another direction. Surely members can now see the mess Millward has made and it never needed to come to this. By labelling Dugan as a centre to justify the Dragons offer, Dugan's nose was put out of joint and he had a ready made argument to hold out for 'fullback' money.

Sign up Milne, Lafai, Packer and Mann. Test Mann at fullback when Widdop returns and if he plays well, slot Mann in at fullback in 2018 and play him there until one of our juniors are ready for first grade.

The only alternative now would be to sign Hayne - with his TPA - along with Packer, Lafai and who ever else you can fit under the cap.

I am a new participant to the forum but what about Michael Gordon for a year.
Quality fullback and great goal kicker. Would not be out of place and could also take on a mentoring role for youngsters like Dufty and Field.
One of Easts most consistent players all year - very reliable and always plays with heart.
Would be an economical pick up.

 

[possm]

Actually the main difference between Tedesco and Dugan being off contract is that Tedesco put himself on the open market and actively sought a contract with Roosters via Anthony Minichiello. Wests Tigers were the only club that offered a contract in the vicinity of $1 million per season and that was his biggest offer. He took unders to join the Roosters.

Dugan has made his priority to re-sign with the Dragons and openly stated as much. Bulldogs are very interested in Dugan his preference is to stay with Dragons.

Hoppa is the current Bulldog's fullback with a cap price of 150k. Yet when the Dog's signed him from the Eels he was on 800k. Dugan won't be offered 1m by the Dogs just like B Morris was not offered the salary he was asking the Dragons to pay him. TPAs are the Dogs answer to the salary cap. As far as I'm concerned, Dugan can go to the Dogs and risk being caught up in the salary cap fraud that the rich clubs will one day be embroiled in. All it would take is for someone to bring civil proceedings against those who are rorting the system. One thing for sure, the NRL will not address the problem themselves.

 

[BringTheNoise]

I am a new participant to the forum but what about Michael Gordon for a year.
Quality fullback and great goal kicker. Would not be out of place and could also take on a mentoring role for youngsters like Dufty and Field.
One of Easts most consistent players all year - very reliable and always plays with heart.
Would be an economical pick up.

Michael Gordon is a step backwards. We are on the brink of securing one of the most formidable spines in the competition if Millward can pull his head out of his ass and sign Dugan.

 

[BringTheNoise]

Hoppa is the current Bulldog's fullback with a cap price of 150k. Yet when the Dog's signed him from the Eels he was on 800k. Dugan won't be offered 1m by the Dogs just like B Morris was not offered the salary he was asking the Dragons to pay him. TPAs are the Dogs answer to the salary cap. As far as I'm concerned, Dugan can go to the Dogs and risk being caught up in the salary cap fraud that the rich clubs will one day be embroiled in. All it would take is for someone to bring civil proceedings against those who are rorting the system. One thing for sure, the NRL will not address the problem themselves.

Possm, with all due respect we are all well aware of your views regarding TPA's. Please try and stay on topic. Your efforts to derail every thread with your TPA and Millward rants are becoming very Ghandisevsky-ish.

 

[hewi]

If Dugan goes, Milne would be a great low price option.

 

[BringTheNoise]

Its ultimately up to Duges whether he stays or goes.

Hey Josh, btw mate, you are playing in the Centres for Australia.

Greg Inglis plays centre for QLD and Australia but Rabbitohs know better than to lowball him with an offer of "centre money".

 

[possm]

Possm, with all due respect we are all well aware of your views regarding TPA's. Please try and stay on topic. Your efforts to derail every thread with your TPA and Millward rants are becoming very Ghandisevsky-ish.

You know TPA's and Millward's mess are the two key elements causing the problems we currently have in retaining our current first graders and recruiting players we need to improve our roster. Some on here cannot see this and so I feel compelled to highlight instances of this when they arise.

 

[Dragon in enemy territory]

Sorry but Tedesco winning you a comp wont happen in a shit team hence why he bailed, because he cant, as for Dugan i credit him a lot for us being in the position we are in and if he stays he can win a comp and i will also credit him for having a lot to do with that....as for offers? how would we know? rumours are running around Dogs have signed him and he denies it. I rate Dugan better than Tedesco and i make no secret about it either. Look end of the day i guess it all depends what you're looking for in a player, sure Dugan cant do some of the mind boggling things that Tedesco can do, but Tedesco isnt exactly a warrior you would die for playing next too either like Dugan is...and i reckon if we made Dugan captain he would go up another level.

Anyway just my opinion, Tedesco will be like Hayne a one hit wonder or now and then pulls something off, going to Roosters was his best shot at title cause he had no balls to let Tigers build a team around him.

I agree, Tedesco has been in first grade since 2012, never played finals football, has shied away from being a leader of a young team to join an "established star" team. If he was a "superstar" he would of played finals by now, even if the tigers didn't have a good team. I reckon he is only "brilliant" and "magical" in the eyes of the commentators because he is the superstar of the tigers team. Put him in at the roosters, and you will see he won't be that good. To me, until you played finals footy, until you have won a grand final, and proved yourself week in and week out over the grind of NRL footy (not 3 games with 3 week gaps SOO), then you haven't proven nothing.
In my opinion, the game of rugby league is played by everyday people, the problem is the media hype up the people they want to label "superstars". There is no doubt some players are good, but they are not "superstars" or worth $1 mil a season. Tedesco is worth nowhere near a $1 mil. He has been out for 2 full seasons since 2012 with knee reco's, you think he's knees will hold up over the coming years? He is only in SOO team because the media hype him up. They hyped Latrell Mitchell up and he fell flat on his face and in NSW cup these days. As i said these people are normal people with families.
I respect Josh Dugan, and I respect the fact that he has come out and said he wants to stay at the dragons beyond this season. At least he didn't do a Brett Morris and hold up a "Dragons4life" poster and then dog us for the bulldogs...the salary cap is more than just fitting players in based on their worth, it is about putting a team together that senior management thinks can acheive the goal of winning the premiership...that is the main priority for the players.
These players have families they have to look after, sure we can look at the figures and say "WOW, i wish i was on that much a season, why doesn't he just sign", but you have to understand there is more to it than that, he has to think about providing the best possible future for his family, for his kids, and he has to be paid what he is worth, and he has to agree to that figure with the club. In the end if he is getting underpaid, then he won't be putting 100% in on the field, because it will play on his mind. The other week he said they are sorting out "chinks" in the contract and it should be done soon... a "chink" to me isn't about the money, it may be something else... we as fans are not privy to what the "chink" is... we all just speculate and we hear rumours and gossip and we make ourselves panic.
The club has been, in my eyes, transparent and forthcoming when giving updates on recruitment, they aren't going to come flat out and say this is why this person or other hasn't signed, but at least they give regular updates on the recruitment front, and update the fans weekly on the injured players and their return date.
I would like to hear more from Peter Doust, those interviews he did last year in regards to where the team is heading gave a great insight into the club's direction and future. They were great to watch and listen to.
Thanks for reading, that is my 2c worth. Have a good day

 

[Ronnie Dobbs]

Greg Inglis plays centre for QLD and Australia but Rabbitohs know better than to lowball him with an offer of "centre money".

I dunno about low balling him.

The market dictates your worth.