Widdop seeks release

[blacksafake]

Maybe Norman took the line on a little too much during his time at the Eels?
Maybe the coach decided to draw the line on his efforts?
I wonder if Norman spun a line to get a gig with us?
I wonder which line he might take during his time with us?
It'll be interesting to see if he is in the starting line with us from Rd 1?

Well lets hope he's not a Powder puff.

 

[True_Believer]

Your fingers must be three inches shorter after writing all that.

You are trying to turn this into a black and white argument from DragonJ about who is to blame for a teams performance. He is not saying that a poor team performance is 100% due to the playmaker, he was saying he felt they should carry a larger portion of the blame because they have accepted the responsibility of directing the team.

The cause of our teams poor performance, in the back half of the year, is not due to one factor and I actually think you and DragonJ are both saying this. The main difference seems to be DragonJ feels Widdop was one of the structural problems that needed to be fixed and you feel he was not. Both opinions are acceptable and you both have valid reasons for them.

They're nubs. I have no fingers left.

OK - I just don't read it that way. The marquee comment seems to fly in the face of playmakers taking responsibility. ie Norman should take responsibility only after he became a marquee. Why not before? He's still doing the same role, just getting paid more. That's the sort of comment that makes me think it's more about the individual rather than the position and the role the player has in the team.

 

[Carlton]

They're nubs. I have no fingers left.

OK - I just don't read it that way. The marquee comment seems to fly in the face of playmakers taking responsibility. ie Norman should take responsibility only after he became a marquee. Why not before? He's still doing the same role, just getting paid more. That's the sort of comment that makes me think it's more about the individual rather than the position and the role the player has in the team.

It is about the individual, in the sense that DragonJ thinks Widdop is not as good at being a game manager and playmaker as Norman. From what you have said I think you probably like Widdop over Norman and thats fair enough.

I like Norman over Widdop as game manager and playmaker, I like Widdop as an opportunist who loves to run in broken play. Am I right, are you right, is DragonJ right, who knows? Its just great to have something like this to talk about in the off season. We have a top level player easing out, we have a top level player coming in and a lot of unknowns.

 

[RufusRex]

Dufty cannot be a wing outside Widdop.

Widdop is not going to be a Dugan kick returner so to pop dufty on an edge would essentially destroy our sets. You kick to the space between widdop and dufty. First tackle widdop with minimal gain, second tackle Dufty and drive him back or he succumbs in a dominant tackle ... Two plays gone and minimal ground made - kicking from our side of half way and rinse/repeat.

90-100kg fast wingers are a must if widdop plays fullback.

 

[Gareth67]

Is there anymore marrow left in this old bone ? Why don’t we take it down to the back paddock and give it the ‘ dignified ‘ burial that it deserves . Quickly now , before we all catch some hideous disease that will have us howling at the next full moon .

 

[DragonJ]

Actually Carlton, the comment was based solely on the conversation I was having with DragonJ and focussed on his comments around Widdop shouldering the blame for any perceived failures during the time he has played for us. I understand some posters believe that Widdop has deficiencies and I too agree consistency is a problem. But this was more to do with accusing a single player for recent results.

That is really some treatise, manifesto, thesis or whatever you call it. Whatever it is, please don't keep repeating I said what I actually said was an absurd or ridiculous (can't remember in verbatim but if it's important for you, I will find the specific post) comment to make.

That being Widdop alone was responsible for the poor performance of the team. But as the marquee playmaker for the entire 5 years and as captain for more than half, he should shoulder more blame than anyone else in the playing group.

I don't know the specifics of what has gone on at Parra. I'm not sure what team @Drag Queen supports but if it's Parra, ask him. What I know is from what I have seen of Norman, I'm optimistic he and Hunt are going to form a really good halves combo for us. Maybe I'll be wrong. If I am and you point it out at the end of the season (no June premiers or wooden spooners), I will say you were right. Is that so difficult to accept?

As for Widdop, I can only agree with what @Belta said. Playmakers are obviously (generally) paid more than fullbacks. A reduction in his salary should have been negotiated for him to play fullback. I think he will go well at fullback. If both these big, fast wingers work out, I think he will do very well but it takes a Mcfooknuckle type farce that he is being paid more than Ponga, Tedesco (officially) and RTS.

And he shouldn't be captain. Because he is leaving the club to play elsewhere and because he has never made a good captain IMO.

 

[Drag Queen]

Actually Carlton, the comment was based solely on the conversation I was having with DragonJ and focussed on his comments around Widdop shouldering the blame for any perceived failures during the time he has played for us. I understand some posters believe that Widdop has deficiencies and I too agree consistency is a problem. But this was more to do with accusing a single player for recent results.

So just to clarify the statement you have quoted, I want to point you to this statement from DragonJ



So essentially, from that, I understand he believes that if you aren’t a marquee player, you don’t shoulder the blame – irrespective of the position you play or the role you play in the team. So DragonJ’s argument doesn’t revolve around his skills or his position in the team, it revolves purely around the title “marquee” and as a result the money getting paid. Not to mention we have more than one marquee player in the team and one actually getting paid more than Widdop. However, they don’t need to shoulder the blame somehow? Am I right in in understanding that if Widdop wasn't a marquee player and Hunt was, Hunt would need to take the blame? I understand there is more expectation on a marquee player, however for one to solely take the blame above all other players in the team is ludicrous. To add to this, in previous comments, DragonJ has mentioned the C next to him name as a contributing factor.

Next statement from him refers to Norman performing behind our current pack.



Just to take this year as an example, were we not first on the table when the pack was performing? So in comparison to his first argument that he should take the blame for our performances, why does he not take the credit for our wins? Oh no – that’s given to the pack. But when the pack fails, blame falls to just 1 of the halves. Again, a completely ludicrous stance to take.

It’s not a coincidence that when the pack started to falter we started to lose games. Additionally, it coincided with Widdops injury and Ben Hunt’s loss of confidence. But lets just ignore these factors and focus on an individual.

If you then relate that back to Norman, his history in the halves has been exactly the same. In 17 when the pack was going gang busters, he was performing. In 18 when they weren’t he couldn’t do anything to save the team – and this was potentially when he was considered a marquee. He took the team to a wooden spoon. Great endorsement if what you are looking for is someone to lead the team around and close out games.

Which leads me to my final point. I’ve already pointed out that in the first game they played us last year, they were in an unlosable position – and yet they did. Where was Norman then? For all of the posters on here stating that he’s a great game manager and can close out games – this is the most obvious example that he may not be all we hope him to be. The second when they smashed us, he played fullback – which might even indicate that is where he should play.

So out of all that, I don’t see how DragonJ is basing any of his argument on Widdop’s role (as you say). And suggesting that Norman will do better is completely unfounded given the comparisons. To me at least it looks more like a dislike for the individual more than anything else.

For what it’s worth, I’m keen to see how Norman slots in and whether he can step up for us. Just as I am for all of our new recruits year after year. And this has nothing to do with a preference for Widdop. It has everything to do with team performance as a whole and not placing any blame on one or 2 players. It’s a team sport and the team has to take responsibility for their performance. And more than anything, the buck stops with the coach.

Is there anymore marrow left in this old bone ? Why don’t we take it down to the back paddock and give it the ‘ dignified ‘ burial that it deserves . Quickly now , before we all catch some hideous disease that will have us howling at the next full moon .

Is there anymore marrow left in this old bone ? Why don’t we take it down to the back paddock and give it the ‘ dignified ‘ burial that it deserves . Quickly now , before we all catch some hideous disease that will have us howling at the next full moon .

 

[Drag Queen]

Yes Gaz. I'm the chick from the El Paso advert. 'We can have both', and then everyone at the table rejoices

 

[Drag Queen]

That is really some treatise, manifesto, thesis or whatever you call it. Whatever it is, please don't keep repeating I said what I actually said was an absurd or ridiculous (can't remember in verbatim but if it's important for you, I will find the specific post) comment to make.

That being Widdop alone was responsible for the poor performance of the team. But as the marquee playmaker for the entire 5 years and as captain for more than half, he should shoulder more blame than anyone else in the playing group.

I don't know the specifics of what has gone on at Parra. I'm not sure what team @Drag Queen supports but if it's Parra, ask him. What I know is from what I have seen of Norman, I'm optimistic he and Hunt are going to form a really good halves combo for us. Maybe I'll be wrong. If I am and you point it out at the end of the season (no June premiers or wooden spooners), I will say you were right. Is that so difficult to accept?

As for Widdop, I can only agree with what @Belta said. Playmakers are obviously (generally) paid more than fullbacks. A reduction in his salary should have been negotiated for him to play fullback. I think he will go well at fullback. If both these big, fast wingers work out, I think he will do very well but it takes a Mcfooknuckle type farce that he is being paid more than Ponga, Tedesco (officially) and RTS.

And he shouldn't be captain. Because he is leaving the club to play elsewhere and because he has never made a good captain IMO.

FFS, really? You obviously don't know me very well. I am a big fan of Widdop and have said it numerous times. I have also welcomed Norman into the club because I think he's a natural. Ponga is 20 years old and earning in excess of 600K. Smart move by the Knights. Do your homework.

 

[DragonJ]

FFS, really? You obviously don't know me very well. I am a big fan of Widdop and have said it numerous times. I have also welcomed Norman into the club because I think he's a natural. Ponga is 20 years old and earning in excess of 600K. Smart move by the Knights. Do your homework.

Right. And on top of going to the forum of the team you support, you need to learn some basic comprehension skills. Or don't reply to any of my posts.

 

[possm]

In the off-season Millward signed two big, fast, young wingers. The club will have the full off-season to assess their suitability for first grade. If both or either one of them is unsuitable then it was a waste of money siging them, Maranta and Runciman. It would have been better signing George Jennings and one other first grade winger and backing those players up maybe with young juniors of the likes of Maranta or Runciman.

If these two wingers do prove to be up to first grade standard, then SGI have a real chance to improve on last season's result. These two wingers together with the experience and talent of Widdop will deliver the speed and variety in attack the Dragons have been missing over the past 7 or so years.

The combination of Norman and Hunt in the halves will relish behind our big pack of forwards in a way not seen in the past five years. I wait with excitement to see all of the above transpire in 2019.

 

[Drag Queen]

Right. And on top of going to the forum of the team you support, you need to learn some basic comprehension skills. Or don't reply to any of my posts.

Trust me when I say I have bitten lengths off my tongue not responding to your posts. I'm fairly sure this maybe only the 2nd or 3rd time at most. Not much when you consider you've posted close to a century full of posts in less than a month. Cheers.

 

[True_Believer]

It is about the individual, in the sense that DragonJ thinks Widdop is not as good at being a game manager and playmaker as Norman. From what you have said I think you probably like Widdop over Norman and thats fair enough.

I like Norman over Widdop as game manager and playmaker, I like Widdop as an opportunist who loves to run in broken play. Am I right, are you right, is DragonJ right, who knows? Its just great to have something like this to talk about in the off season. We have a top level player easing out, we have a top level player coming in and a lot of unknowns.

Actually, I don't have a problem with Norman or with Widdop or the positions they end up playing in this year - I think both will play well in either half or fullback roles. As you point out, they both have strengths and weaknesses in both positions. Additionally, I don't have a problem with DragonJ preferring Norman over Widdop as a half. I'm actually happy to see either of them in there. It's not about how they play the game or having a preference.

I just don't think you can suggest that one player should shoulder a majority of blame. I've pointed out my reasons and DragonJ has reconfirmed them in his last post. I'll leave it at that.

 

[DragonJ]

Trust me when I say I have bitten lengths off my tongue not responding to your posts. I'm fairly sure this maybe only the 2nd or 3rd time at most. Not much when you consider you've posted close to a century full of posts in less than a month. Cheers.

Even once is too much but you may continue to monitor my posting activity if you like. I find it a little weird but that's just me.

Actually, I don't have a problem with Norman or with Widdop or the positions they end up playing in this year - I think both will play well in either half or fullback roles. As you point out, they both have strengths and weaknesses in both positions. Additionally, I don't have a problem with DragonJ preferring Norman over Widdop as a half. I'm actually happy to see either of them in there. It's not about how they play the game or having a preference.

I just don't think you can suggest that one player should shoulder a majority of blame. I've pointed out my reasons and DragonJ has reconfirmed them in his last post. I'll leave it at that.

Are you taking the piss or really have dangerously bad comprehension problems?

Majority of the blame = 50.1% and up
More blame than any other player = .......... I can't do the math as it would require a tremendous amount of research as to all the players who have played in the last 5 years and even then be subject to debate.

 

[Gareth67]

Yes Gaz. I'm the chick from the El Paso advert. 'We can have both', and then everyone at the table rejoices

Really ? Hell she is one pretty hot looking gal D.Q. - I can only envy your other half , particularly on these hot summer nights .

 

[True_Believer]

Are you taking the piss or really have dangerously bad comprehension problems?

Majority of the blame = 50.1% and up
More blame than any other player = .......... I can't do the math as it would require a tremendous amount of research as to all the players who have played in the last 5 years and even then be subject to debate.

Lol - ok. If it helps, majority/more - semantics. You're missing the point.

Either way, this is the last I'll say on the topic as we're going around in circles and you're getting personal.

 

[Dragonslayer]

In the off-season Millward signed two big, fast, young wingers. The club will have the full off-season to assess their suitability for first grade. If both or either one of them is unsuitable then it was a waste of money siging them, Maranta and Runciman. It would have been better signing George Jennings and one other first grade winger and backing those players up maybe with young juniors of the likes of Maranta or Runciman.

If these two wingers do prove to be up to first grade standard, then SGI have a real chance to improve on last season's result. These two wingers together with the experience and talent of Widdop will deliver the speed and variety in attack the Dragons have been missing over the past 7 or so years.

The combination of Norman and Hunt in the halves will relish behind our big pack of forwards in a way not seen in the past five years. I wait with excitement to see all of the above transpire in 2019.

Just for your information.

Both Ravalawa and Pearson are barely 2cm taller than Periera and he is heavier (bigger) than both of them, however, as you say they are probably quicker.

Runciman isn't signed to the top 30 squad, he is only on a part-time contract to play ISP only, however I do have the unnerving suspicion he will be the one promoted before June 30 as our 30th player, hopefully based on performances in ISP.

Maranta, well even Millward was mystified at that one and alluded to same in the video when talking about his signing.

 

[possm]

Just for your information.

Both Ravalawa and Pearson are barely 2cm taller than Periera and he is heavier (bigger) than both of them, however, as you say they are probably quicker.

Runciman isn't signed to the top 30 squad, he is only on a part-time contract to play ISP only, however I do have the unnerving suspicion he will be the one promoted before June 30 as our 30th player, hopefully based on performances in ISP.

Maranta, well even Millward was mystified at that one and alluded to same in the video when talking about his signing.

We need wingers with size and speed. Let's hope our young guns step up in the off-season and gain selection to first grade.

Millward mystified, I'm confused. Didn't Millward sign him?

 

[Dragonslayer]

We need wingers with size and speed. Let's hope our young guns step up in the off-season and gain selection to first grade.

Millward mystified, I'm confused. Didn't Millward sign him?

Lets just say the video was more on I had to sign him more than I wanted to sign him. I have a feeling this one came straight out of the McGregor handbook on players he wants in the squad.

Played at NRL level - tick
Played more than 50 NRL games - tick
Will do exactly as I tell him - tick

It sounds like another McCrone to me. So don't be surprised if his name suddenly appears on the team list Tuesday's.

 

[Drag Queen]

Really ? Hell she is one pretty hot looking gal D.Q. - I can only envy your other half , particularly on these hot summer nights .

We may have watched different ads luv. The star of this ad is about 7 yrs old lol. I'll pretend to be her hot looking aunt haha. Just tuned into the cricket after our beach got evacuated with a shark siting. Ironically it's usually my partner that swims out deeper than me. I may have peed in the ocean getting back into shore