2019 Discussion

[umina panther]

It’s been this way for 3+ years. Not going to change in an off season.

hmmm I dunno, the Cows for one will improve massively

 

[OldPanther]

hmmm I dunno, the Cows for one will improve massively

So will we with Ciro the destroyer.

 

[franklin2323]

Not sure the sky is falling that much.

Should/could of won last night, putting us one game from GF & we were in the top 4 for the majority of the year. Few minor tweaks wouldn’t go astray but I don’t think we’re in dire straights by any means.

There’s gonna be a lot of natural improvement due to age/experience. That includes Katoa & Egan. Both are very very early in their careers.

We also lose 12 games of finals experience. Knights, Canberra Atleast will be better. Who from the 8 seems to be weaker so far? Natural progression alone won't be enough

 

[franklin2323]

hmmm I dunno, the Cows for one will improve massively

Knights keep Ponga and Pearce on the field they will make the 8. No one in the 8 looks any weaker

 

[maple_69]

Our season changed when half our spine disappeared, out champion half got injured, our best prop dropped 10kg and the rest of them collectively lost their edge after covering a record injury toll throughout the year. We didn’t have any chance to build structure nor a coach capable of it based on his 3 years.

We rode a wave of good form in 2016. We were awful for all of 2017 and ground out heaps of arsey wins. This year we hit another level but couldn’t maintain it due to the above adversity.

I don’t think there is reason to panic or suggest we won’t be better next year. We need the right coach though. Premiership or nothing next year really.

 

[martielang]

We also lose 12 games of finals experience. Knights, Canberra Atleast will be better. Who from the 8 seems to be weaker so far? Natural progression alone won't be enough

When we had Hook everyone was saying we are underperforming, we should be winning the Comp, the coach is the issue not the squad etc etc Now he’s gone & we suddenly need mass changes to our squad? Cmon. Which is it?

We led the comp at halfway & spent 1 week outside the top 4. Clearly origin impacted our squad both physically & emotionally. That’s the type of thing we’ll learn from next year. From a coaching perspective maybe we’ll deal with it better as well.

I’m not saying we couldn’t do with a more experienced Player or two within the squad, but we don’t need to release 4 players & sign another 6. It’s time to back the squad & process we have.

 

[OldPanther]

When we had Hook everyone was saying we are underperforming, we should be winning the Comp, the coach is the issue not the squad etc etc Now he’s gone & we suddenly need mass changes to our squad? Cmon. Which is it?

We led the comp at halfway & spent 1 week outside the top 4. Clearly origin impacted our squad both physically & emotionally. That’s the type of thing we’ll learn from next year. From a coaching perspective maybe we’ll deal with it better as well.

I’m not saying we couldn’t do with a more experienced Player or two, but we don’t need another marquee. It’s time to back the squad we have.

At the very least Merrin is done.

 

[martielang]

At the very least Merrin is done.

I think he was tapped on the shoulder a while ago.

 

[umina panther]

When we had Hook everyone was saying we are underperforming, we should be winning the Comp, the coach is the issue not the squad etc etc Now he’s gone & we suddenly need mass changes to our squad? Cmon. Which is it?

We led the comp at halfway & spent 1 week outside the top 4. Clearly origin impacted our squad both physically & emotionally. That’s the type of thing we’ll learn from next year. From a coaching perspective maybe we’ll deal with it better as well.

I’m not saying we couldn’t do with a more experienced Player or two within the squad, but we don’t need to release 4 players & sign another 6. It’s time to back the squad & process we have.

We improved undeniably as soon as he went. You know this

 

[franklin2323]

When we had Hook everyone was saying we are underperforming, we should be winning the Comp, the coach is the issue not the squad etc etc Now he’s gone & we suddenly need mass changes to our squad? Cmon. Which is it?

We led the comp at halfway & spent 1 week outside the top 4. Clearly origin impacted our squad both physically & emotionally. That’s the type of thing we’ll learn from next year. From a coaching perspective maybe we’ll deal with it better as well.

I’m not saying we couldn’t do with a more experienced Player or two within the squad, but we don’t need to release 4 players & sign another 6. It’s time to back the squad & process we have.

I never once have said we should win the comp. I want us to have some luck with injuries and 50/50 ref calls. To see what the squad has. Let's look at the last 4 standing this year

Look at the Sharks team we played last night. 10 or so are from when they won the comp. added SOO and test players in Dugan and Woods. Added Josh Morris next year.

Souths half, GI and several others from when they won the comp. Cook and Crichton now are Origin players.

Roosters Keary/Cronk won comps. Tedesco Origin player of the year. Several other that won the comp with them.

Storm speak for themselves

Meanwhile you can count on one hand the amount of guys we have with even 200 games experience.

 

[martielang]

We improved undeniably as soon as he went. You know this

We played 2 weeks of good football. Neither game surpassed our games against Warriors & Dragons earlier in the year. Last night if Hook was coach, he would of been destroyed for the way we played & some of the tactical decisions.

Sort of irrelevant to my argument anyway. A lot of the same people saying our squad isn’t good enough are the same people who were saying Hook needs to be sacked because he wasn’t getting the best out of the team & our team should be doing better etc. Its a complete contradiction.

 

[martielang]

I never once have said we should win the comp. I want us to have some luck with injuries and 50/50 ref calls. To see what the squad has. Let's look at the last 4 standing this year

Look at the Sharks team we played last night. 10 or so are from when they won the comp. added SOO and test players in Dugan and Woods. Added Josh Morris next year.

Souths half, GI and several others from when they won the comp. Cook and Crichton now are Origin players.

Roosters Keary/Cronk won comps. Tedesco Origin player of the year. Several other that won the comp with them.

Storm speak for themselves

Meanwhile you can count on one hand the amount of guys we have with even 200 games experience.

Wasn’t aiming that swipe at you at all.

We’re too far down the rabbit hole now. We’ve invested to much money, time & resources, we need to back what we have in place imo.

 

[Kilkenny]

Who do we need to move on to tweak the squad and free up some cap space:

1. Trent Merrin. I don't think he is done and I think he can get back to somewhere near his best footy but he was disappointing in 2017 and hasn't played anywhere near his best in the 2nd half of 2018. If it is true the Knights may be interested then I think it might be in everyone's best interest to see a deal struck between the two clubs.

2. Tyrone May. Natural footy player but I just don't see where he fits into our squad. Needs to find a club where he may be given an opportunity to find a regular spot either as Lock (Best Position) or perhaps 5/8th.

3. Dean Whare. Very popular club man and true professional but another serious injury had ended another season. He was pretty decent in 2018 until his arm injury but his strengths are the defensive side of the game and frankly we need more speed, power and strike in the outside backs. Dean not on big money and would have no problems finding another NRL club in Sydney. We need to fast track one of our young guns such as Stephen Crichton.

4. James Maloney. Won't be going anywhere for 2019 but certainly come 2020 we should be hoping we have another alternative and someone ready to take over.

 

[franklin2323]

Wasn’t aiming that swipe at you at all.

We’re too far down the rabbit hole now. We’ve invested to much money, time & resources, we need to back what we have in place imo.

Not saying we stop Flegg and Ball have some great prospects. Our backrow, Blake, Cleary, Mansour, DWZ (somewhere in the backline) are at a level now we want them.

Then you have guys like Leota, Edwards, Luai etc that you are building now to get to get that level. I am talking about having 3 or 4 extra experienced guys in the 30 man squad.

To help to get to that next step

 

[mxlegend99]

Well our stats against top 4 teams went up under Ciro. But they were incredibly low so it's not overly impressive.

Hook had 2 wins in his time here. Once over Raiders in 2016. Once over Souths in 2018. This year though we ended up winning 2 of our 6 games against top 4 teams. Wins over Storm and Souths. A loss to Roosters and 3 to Sharks. Ciro has won 50% of our 2 top 4 games in his reign as coach.

Ciro bagging a win over Storm in his first season is huge. Hook has lost 10 from 10 to them.

So there are some positives to read into if Ciro is our 2019 coach. But with so much inexperience on the field. I think its crucial for us to have an experienced coach if we want to be a premiership threat.

 

[franklin2323]

Who do we need to move on to tweak the squad and free up some cap space:

1. Trent Merrin. I don't think he is done and I think he can get back to somewhere near his best footy but he was disappointing in 2017 and hasn't played anywhere near his best in the 2nd half of 2018. If it is true the Knights may be interested then I think it might be in everyone's best interest to see a deal struck between the two clubs.

2. Tyrone May. Natural footy player but I just don't see where he fits into our squad. Needs to find a club where he may be given an opportunity to find a regular spot either as Lock (Best Position) or perhaps 5/8th.

3. Dean Whare. Very popular club man and true professional but another serious injury had ended another season. He was pretty decent in 2018 until his arm injury but his strengths are the defensive side of the game and frankly we need more speed, power and strike in the outside backs. Dean not on big money and would have no problems finding another NRL club in Sydney. We need to fast track one of our young guns such as Stephen Crichton.

4. James Maloney. Won't be going anywhere for 2019 but certainly come 2020 we should be hoping we have another alternative and someone ready to take over.

Stuff like this. Clubs will shed guys in the off season. If we can get some of the deal covered may pick up 2 guys with Merrin's money. Already that would give another older head and help not gas a young guy as it seemed we did

 

[PenrithPanther45]

Who do we need to move on to tweak the squad and free up some cap space:

1. Trent Merrin. I don't think he is done and I think he can get back to somewhere near his best footy but he was disappointing in 2017 and hasn't played anywhere near his best in the 2nd half of 2018. If it is true the Knights may be interested then I think it might be in everyone's best interest to see a deal struck between the two clubs.

2. Tyrone May. Natural footy player but I just don't see where he fits into our squad. Needs to find a club where he may be given an opportunity to find a regular spot either as Lock (Best Position) or perhaps 5/8th.

3. Dean Whare. Very popular club man and true professional but another serious injury had ended another season. He was pretty decent in 2018 until his arm injury but his strengths are the defensive side of the game and frankly we need more speed, power and strike in the outside backs. Dean not on big money and would have no problems finding another NRL club in Sydney. We need to fast track one of our young guns such as Stephen Crichton.

4. James Maloney. Won't be going anywhere for 2019 but certainly come 2020 we should be hoping we have another alternative and someone ready to take over.

If Whare is on little money surely we keep him. He was one of our best in attack before the arm injury. Fast and had a great step - doubt an arm injury will impact that too much.

May we can keep on little money but I don't think he's what we need off the bench utility wise. I'd put Luai there as he is versatile and a genuine game breaker.

Maloney will be leaving by 2020 or otherwise we would have probably lost Luai.

Merrin can go because he's on big money. Just hasn't been the same threat as he was in 2016. As many have said, we really need one more dynamic, experienced forward.

 

[Kilkenny]

I've been saying in for a couple of seasons now, we lack size, power and above all pace in our three quarter line. Billy pointed out similar opinions a very good recent post highlighting similar concerns.

If we are honest our three quarters are a long way behind the better sides in the competition.

Josh Mansour was a beast a couple of seasons back but there has to be doubts he is ever going to rediscover his best form.

Dallin is Dallin, ever dependable at either fullback or on the wing but let's face it he is not known for his try scoring record and that is what the better wingers do in the modern game, score tries and lot's of them.

Dean Whare similar to DWZ hasn't played a lot in recent years but when fit he is solid at a time when we need more. We need another strike weapon in the centres to compliment Waqa Blake. Blake is the closest thing we have to a powerful, fast attacking weapon but he suffers from our teams game plan and our halves inability to create opportunities for him.

Given we have issues in our outside backs, halves, hooker and are lacking a top quality front rower then I don't see top 4 in 2019 unless we address some or all of our deficiencies.

 

[PenrithPanther45]

I personally see no reason to change our backline. Mansour still provides plenty of yardage and you can't fault his efforts. DWZ is still explosive as ever. Blake is our speed and has a great offload. Whare rediscovered his best form, is a bloody good defender and very experienced. Edwards is a great support runner and dependable under the high ball. They collectively have their weaknesses but I see no reason to go to the market for anyone. We have MWZ, Aekins etc. if needed

 

[Kilkenny]

I personally see no reason to change our backline. Mansour still provides plenty of yardage and you can't fault his efforts. DWZ is still explosive as ever. Blake is our speed and has a great offload. Whare rediscovered his best form, is a bloody good defender and very experienced. Edwards is a great support runner and dependable under the high ball. They collectively have their weaknesses but I see no reason to go to the market for anyone. We have MWZ, Aekins etc. if needed

I don't fault the efforts of any of those you have mentioned. I love Josh, Dallin etc and I am not saying we need to go into the market for anyone, we can't anyway, but we urgently need to identify the cream of the crop from our juniors and fast track them into the top grade. Our current outside backs are not good enough compared to the better sides and accordingly we will not make the top four or go one step further in winning a competition until we find at least one superstar in this area. As I also said there are other areas as well which need addressing before we can confidently start talking about being a real top four side.