2023-2028 next tv deal discussion

[Colk]

There isn’t a qoute from Vlandys in that. There’s a graphic that is a journos estimate based on the figure of over $400 the nrl announced. I’ve never know a tv deal announced just on a cash basis, nor a sports org talk down a tv deal total lol

would be nice if pistol Pete would give us some transparency like Gil has, at least he’s told us $4bill is cash.

I am as critical of V’Landys as you are (well maybe not) but both the NRL and fumbleball haven’t been particularly open or provided all of the details about these deals.

A lot of the argument on here is absolute pedantry. Essentially they (fumbleball) got a crapload more than us. Whether it is exactly $150 million or whether it is $200 million is ultimately beside the point; the most pressing matter is how it is going to be resolved or fixed because the difference (despite all arguments or excuses to the contrary) shouldn’t be a lot (maybe 5-10%)

 

[Frank Burge]

Did we do the 23-27 deal pre or post dolphins announcement?

 

[Wb1234]

When it comes to analysing the media rights deal you simply dont get to pick and choose the parts you like because the NRL stopped selling the bits that the AFL does.

NRL - Announced: "more than 400m" pa to 2023-2027 inclusive. stopped selling Digital and web rights in 2017. Current deal includes Nines radio rights deal as well as tv broadcast. Fox/Kayo deal amount unknown. Includes additional Dolphins funds. Contra amount unknown.

AFL - Announced: 4.5b. 643m per year from 2025-2031 inclusive. deal includes Digital and internet rights, does not include the radio rights deal signed the week after. Fox/Kayo deal amount unknown. Contra unknown. Cash amount stated as more than 4 billion by CEO.

But you be you.

As I said before when it was payment for the streaming rights for games on the Telstra app I was fine with it

I didn’t even know it was for marvel stadium until recently. And yep I can believe whatever I want too I don’t live in an afl centric bubble where I believe all the bs that emenates from down south

the marvel deal should be excluded it’s got nothing to do with it

until disproven the figure the afl gets for its tv deals is 500 million pa as stated by news ltd

 

[Wb1234]

Did we do the 23-27 deal pre or post dolphins announcement?

Originally did a bad deal during covid

then redid it up by 20 million pa to cover that dolphins

 

[Perth Red]

I am as critical of V’Landys as you are (well maybe not) but both the NRL and fumbleball haven’t been particularly open or provided all of the details about these deals.

A lot of the argument on here is absolute pedantry. Essentially they (fumbleball) got a crapload more than us. Whether it is exactly $150 million or whether it is $200 million is ultimately beside the point; the most pressing matter is how it is going to be resolved or fixed because the difference (despite all arguments or excuses to the contrary) shouldn’t be a lot (maybe 5-10%)

You're not wrong, though tbf a $50mill difference in what it actually is is quite significant!
They've said their total deal is over $571mil a year cash. That's more detail than we got for ours.

I did a list of previous deals and the biggest gap we had from memory was around $65million a year and that was when News ltd owned the game! That gap, barring any major changes to our deal, will be around $190mill in 2025! Its just nuts how undersold the games rights have been under him. How anyone can still be trying to justify it or look for silver linings is well beyond me!

 

[Wb1234]

I am as critical of V’Landys as you are (well maybe not) but both the NRL and fumbleball haven’t been particularly open or provided all of the details about these deals.

A lot of the argument on here is absolute pedantry. Essentially they (fumbleball) got a crapload more than us. Whether it is exactly $150 million or whether it is $200 million is ultimately beside the point; the most pressing matter is how it is going to be resolved or fixed because the difference (despite all arguments or excuses to the contrary) shouldn’t be a lot (maybe 5-10%)

No it depends

if the afl deal is full of contra from Telstra for marvel then they didn’t get loads more than us and their finances are still kind of average for years to come

the financial situation of afl right now is really bad

 

[Perth Red]

Did we do the 23-27 deal pre or post dolphins announcement?

Post.
NRL called for bids in Mar 21
The NRL announced it would expand in Oct 2021 with Dolphins
The NRL tv deal of $400mil was announced in Dec 21

So no, its highly unlikely they announced the Tv deal after expansion then more money was added, why would they?

 

[Perth Red]

No it depends

if the afl deal is full of contra from Telstra for marvel then they didn’t get loads more than us and their finances are still kind of average for years to come

the financial situation of afl right now is really bad

haha such denial. $571mill a year CASH!

 

[Iamback]

Did we do the 23-27 deal pre or post dolphins announcement?

It was. Fox is paying $20m for them in.

The 4 new NRLW teams weren't

NRLW Expansion Announcement

NRL CEO Andrew Abdo will today make an announcement at Rugby League Central. The announcement will take place in the Heroes & Legends Museum at 12.30pm.

www.nrl.com

This too was announced after the TV deal

International window to capitalise on game's X-factor: Abdo

NRL CEO Andrew Abdo has described international rugby league as an ‘X-factor’ for the code and believes it will build momentum with a dedicated window at the end of the season.

www.nrl.com

So there is extra content there, As per the article yesterday

 

[Iamback]

I am as critical of V’Landys as you are (well maybe not) but both the NRL and fumbleball haven’t been particularly open or provided all of the details about these deals.

A lot of the argument on here is absolute pedantry. Essentially they (fumbleball) got a crapload more than us. Whether it is exactly $150 million or whether it is $200 million is ultimately beside the point; the most pressing matter is how it is going to be resolved or fixed because the difference (despite all arguments or excuses to the contrary) shouldn’t be a lot (maybe 5-10%)

You want PVL and the ARLC booted out, If they AFL deal and NRL are closer then that doesn't hold weight here. Hence why the Telstra component is an issue.

What ch7 and Fox are paying AFL is the AFL TV deal

Compare that to what Pay and ch9 are paying NRL and then we can discuss if NRL took a dud deal or not.

Too soon for that discussion due to both parties

 

[Perth Red]

It was. Fox is paying $20m for them in.

The 4 new NRLW teams weren't

NRLW Expansion Announcement

NRL CEO Andrew Abdo will today make an announcement at Rugby League Central. The announcement will take place in the Heroes & Legends Museum at 12.30pm.

www.nrl.com

This too was announced after the TV deal

International window to capitalise on game's X-factor: Abdo

NRL CEO Andrew Abdo has described international rugby league as an ‘X-factor’ for the code and believes it will build momentum with a dedicated window at the end of the season.

www.nrl.com

So there is extra content there, As per the article yesterday

We had internationals mid season we removed. We are juts adding the same at different time of year but hopefully with Australia involved. Given how little IRL is valued in Australia Im not sure its going to gain anything?

NRLW? what do you think 2 extra games a weekend in non viewing slots is worth?

You do realise that if Fox are paying $20mill for expansion then it must mean the deal Vlandys gave them in Mar 2020 was $20million less than they paid for the games rights in 2017 dont you? One way to prevent a cold lol

2017
Nine $125mill
Sky $20mill
Fox $240mill
$385mill

2023
Nine $130mill
Sky $32mill
Fox $240mill
$402mill

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

[Perth Red]

You want PVL and the ARLC booted out, If they AFL deal and NRL are closer then that doesn't hold weight here. Hence why the Telstra component is an issue.

What ch7 and Fox are paying AFL is the AFL TV deal

Compare that to what Pay and ch9 are paying NRL and then we can discuss if NRL took a dud deal or not.

Too soon for that discussion due to both parties

haha dodge, spin,dodge

2025-31 AFL TV $583mill ($643mill minus $60mill Telstra) $550mill cash
2023-27 NRL TV $395mill ($402mill minus radio rights $7mill) $375mill cash

Difference $188mill - Cash difference $175mill A YEAR!

How long do you want to wait before coming to the realisation we are all at that we've got well and truly screwed?

 

[Colk]

You want PVL and the ARLC booted out, If they AFL deal and NRL are closer then that doesn't hold weight here. Hence why the Telstra component is an issue.

What ch7 and Fox are paying AFL is the AFL TV deal

Compare that to what Pay and ch9 are paying NRL and then we can discuss if NRL took a dud deal or not.

Too soon for that discussion due to both parties

Sure if the details argued were not picayune. For example if there was evidence that the NRL’s deal was within 5-10% of the fumbleball deal or it was plausible to argue such a thing then yes I wouldn’t be so critical.

What people are arguing is essentially whether the fumbleball’s TV deal is what $550m cash or higher or whether the NRL’s deal is $400m in cash or less or whether one includes Telstra or not when the headline numbers are likely around $200 million or more.

All this really doesn’t matter as anyway you wish to argue those numbers it doesn’t look good for V’Landys does it?

Another thing, it is not just the numbers that the people are critical of (it is just the effect in any case), it is more about the way in which both negotiations were conducted (the cause of the difference)

 

[Wb1234]

It was. Fox is paying $20m for them in.

The 4 new NRLW teams weren't

NRLW Expansion Announcement

NRL CEO Andrew Abdo will today make an announcement at Rugby League Central. The announcement will take place in the Heroes & Legends Museum at 12.30pm.

www.nrl.com

This too was announced after the TV deal

International window to capitalise on game's X-factor: Abdo

NRL CEO Andrew Abdo has described international rugby league as an ‘X-factor’ for the code and believes it will build momentum with a dedicated window at the end of the season.

www.nrl.com

So there is extra content there, As per the article yesterday

Where’s yesterdays article

you make excellent points too

 

[Perth Red]

He's openly admitted he signed a low ball deal well below market value to help out the tv companies.
Its alleged this was against the advice of the then CEO and CFO.
He conceded a load of stuff that has damaged the game (digital reduction, mid season tests, telstra streaming, etc)
Its one of the biggest f**k ups in the games history, and that's saying something!

 

[Wb1234]

Sure if the details argued were not picayune. For example if there was evidence that the NRL’s deal was within 5-10% of the fumbleball deal or it was plausible to argue such a thing then yes I wouldn’t be so critical.

What people are arguing is essentially whether the fumbleball’s TV deal is what $550m cash or higher or whether the NRL’s deal is $400m in cash or less or whether one includes Telstra or not when the headline numbers are likely around $200 million or more.

All this really doesn’t matter as anyway you wish to argue those numbers it doesn’t look good for V’Landys does it?

Another thing, it is not just the numbers that the people are critical of (it is just the effect in any case), it is more about the way in which both negotiations were conducted (the cause of the difference)

Nrl 400 million cash (current deal)
Afl 470 million cash (to start in 2027)

 

[Perth Red]

Nrl 400 million cash (current deal)
Afl 470 million cash (to start in 2027)

cuckoo, cuckoo

2025-31 AFL TV $583mill ($643mill minus $60mill Telstra) $550mill cash
2023-27 NRL TV $395mill ($402mill minus radio rights $7mill) $375mill cash

Difference $188mill - Cash difference $175mill A YEAR!

 

[Iamback]

Where’s yesterdays article

you make excellent points too

‘We’re always negotiating’: The NRL approach to media deal-making

NRL chairman Peter V’landys says the code will take advantage of the AFL’s record-breaking media rights deal when it begins bargaining with broadcasters.

www.afr.com

From the Financial review so more trustworthy then a DT mate writing it

 

[Perth Red]

‘We’re always negotiating’: The NRL approach to media deal-making

NRL chairman Peter V’landys says the code will take advantage of the AFL’s record-breaking media rights deal when it begins bargaining with broadcasters.

www.afr.com

From the Financial review so more trustworthy then a DT mate writing it

Hmmm doesn't sound like any change until after this sht deal is finished

'V’landys confirming that the record-breaking AFL deal would not translate to any upward revision to the current rugby league deal.'

'Senior sources at News Corp and Foxtel have confirmed that no additional payments will be made to the NRL under the existing contract'

'Peter V’landys thinks the NRL will be well placed when the next formal round of media rights negotiations begins.'

Here's hoping for 2028!!

 

[Iamback]

Sure if the details argued were not picayune. For example if there was evidence that the NRL’s deal was within 5-10% of the fumbleball deal or it was plausible to argue such a thing then yes I wouldn’t be so critical.

What people are arguing is essentially whether the fumbleball’s TV deal is what $550m cash or higher or whether the NRL’s deal is $400m in cash or less or whether one includes Telstra or not when the headline numbers are likely around $200 million or more.

All this really doesn’t matter as anyway you wish to argue those numbers it doesn’t look good for V’Landys does it?

Another thing, it is not just the numbers that the people are critical of (it is just the effect in any case), it is more about the way in which both negotiations were conducted (the cause of the difference)

How can you argue it doesn't look good for PVL without the ACTUAL figures though? It isn't that hard to understand.

From the article I posted above

NRL officials are convinced the AFL deal includes a large amount of contra, or non-cash benefits, such as free TV advertising. The Herald has also reported that the new AFL deal includes money from Telstra for the AFL-owned Marvel Stadium.

Wookie said contra is believed to be $80-$96m a year. That would qualify as a large amount of contra

Telstra is $50m a year

That leaves $550m that is being brought up including Telstra, Leaving $500m cash from TV/
However if you then have money from Telstra to do up Marvel then it brings that figure down further.

Have they? There was no issue until the $643m deal was announced, If they comes in lower then it is a different conversation