Crowd Watch 2013 - Part Deux

[seanoff]

Actually you are wrong.

NTRL is getting murdered by AFL now because the commitment the NRL has made to it is hopeless.

Rugby League will fall behind further and further for the next ten years until the NRL takes it seriously.

It is becoming a lost market.

When we grow players up there, the AFL will steal them from a lack of effort.

That is what is happening and anybody involved in the NTRL will say so behind closed doors when asked.

Thats my reading of it. The aflnt have resources the ntrl must dream about.

There is also a much better and more defined pathway to the big time for the afl.

Lots of kids play both codes here and choose one or the other if they have some talent. Shaun edwards is on the GWS senior list. You would be hard pressed to find a more RL family than the Edwards but they have an AFL player. Mostly because the support and pathway to the elite level is so much more defined.

 

[VictoryFC]

Having watched both Wallabies/Lions and Cats/Hawks with 85000 each and seeing how much atmosphere contributes to making sport entertaining.

For casual or neutral fans watching at home and seeing a packed MCG one ANZ and then seeing 8000 in Darwin, if they have no strong allegiance one way or another something like atmosphere could be the thing that swings them towards another code and gets them enjoying that more.

More needs to be done to improve crowds. For a while now I've been calling for standalone origin weekends and for the NRL to get each club to offer memberships that include tickets to away games. Also automatically moving any sell out in a suburban stadium to one of the major stadiums.

I guarantee NRL average crowds would go past 20,000 in the first year.

So the 3 million who will watch SOO3 will see exactly what you just described, but in much greater numberd than the 1m odd Wallabies get.

 

[StGeorgeBull]

While it is great that we have origin to deliver great crowds and atmosphere more can be done to start making regular season club games head in that direction.

Having watched both Wallabies/Lions and Cats/Hawks with 85000 each and seeing how much atmosphere contributes to making sport entertaining.

For casual or neutral fans watching at home and seeing a packed MCG one ANZ and then seeing 8000 in Darwin, if they have no strong allegiance one way or another something like atmosphere could be the thing that swings them towards another code and gets them enjoying that more.

More needs to be done to improve crowds. For a while now I've been calling for standalone origin weekends and for the NRL to get each club to offer memberships that include tickets to away games. Also automatically moving any sell out in a suburban stadium to one of the major stadiums.

I guarantee NRL average crowds would go past 20,000 in the first year.

I agree with almost all of this. BM, when you want to you are capable of making logical and well thought out contributions. Considering you are capable of that I wish we got less of your rubbish and more of your more thoughtful posting. You could be a worthwhile poster in this forum.

 

[woodyk2]

f**k you love your AFL don't you Woody? Every post I've seen of yours today is talking down league and talking up AFL.

I just want to know what has to be done Flapper. I do not love AFL at all but what I see before me is most disheartening.Rubbish crowds,rule changes mid season,no biff,no shoulders,refs are absolute rubbish,such a simple simple game has become somehow complicated,video refs,two refs it goes on and on.

 

[BunniesMan]

So Unions once in a 12 year romp is being used as evidence of attendance strength compared to NRL crowds? Lol.

And basically every time the Wallabies host a major country.

So the 3 million who will watch SOO3 will see exactly what you just described, but in much greater numberd than the 1m odd Wallabies get.

Origin is obviously a fantastic vehicle for the game but it occurs as a spectacle 2-3 times a year (allowing for dead rubber games that really don't have the same atmosphere as an alive game). Taking nothing away from Origin. But Union and AFL have many more games per year of atmosphere like that.

The NRL needs to do more to give itself more oppurtunities to show itself in the best way it can. It needs to aim to get regular season club games at that level.

I have a dream where blockbuster regular season club games get 60/70/80 thousand. I think it is acheivable in the long term. But the NRL needs to do more than it is to get there.

Every time Souths and Easts play each other, Souths and Tigers, Souths and Dogs, Souths and Eels, Eels and Dogs, and any other rivalry game, as well as every time we have a genuine top of the table clash. Games like this should go close to filling ANZ one day.

 

[Teddyboy]

Imagine if Rugby League/Rugby Union and Aussie Rules were one in Australia and the crowds you get be great with the international of Rugby Union/the SOO of Rugby League and the AFL regular round's.

Right I bets be off before I get lynched.

 

[VictoryFC]

I just want to know what has to be done Flapper. I do not love AFL at all but what I see before me is most disheartening.Rubbish crowds,rule changes mid season,no biff,no shoulders,refs are absolute rubbish,such a simple simple game has become somehow complicated,video refs,two refs it goes on and on.

Dont let facts get in the way of a good story.

Crowds are comparable with some of the highest season averages ever.

Memberships are growing.

Lol @ refs point.

Video reffing has improved this year immeasurably.

Auskick crowds down by 4,000 compared to season high a few years ago.

 

[beave]

I am lucky enough to get to Darwin at least once a year. The joint is about 50-50 in regards to the major codes. At the moment the pop is about 130k, there will be a massive increase in population (relative) over the next 4 or so years in and around the capital........... The code that goes out on a limb up there will clean up. The question is, which code can afford it??????

 

[VictoryFC]

And basically every time the Wallabies host a major country.

Origin is obviously a fantastic vehicle for the game but it occurs as a spectacle 2-3 times a year (allowing for dead rubber games that really don't have the same atmosphere as an alive game). Taking nothing away from Origin. But Union and AFL have many more games per year of atmosphere like that.

The NRL needs to do more to give itself more oppurtunities to show itself in the best way it can. It needs to aim to get regular season club games at that level.

I have a dream where blockbuster regular season club games get 60/70/80 thousand. I think it is acheivable in the long term. But the NRL needs to do more than it is to get there.

Thats all well and fine. But the circle jerk reaction to crowds vs Wallabies is hilarious. Auskick games between hawthorn and geelong have drawn well for years now, same as carlton cwood. Whats the big surprise all of a sudden?

NRL gates are holding up on last year. AFL has recovered a bit from last seasons dismal 6,000 drop, but still 4,000 down. Much ado about nothing.

Union goes into hibernation now remember.

 

[elbusto]

Thats my reading of it. The aflnt have resources the ntrl must dream about.

There is also a much better and more defined pathway to the big time for the afl.

Lots of kids play both codes here and choose one or the other if they have some talent. Shaun edwards is on the GWS senior list. You would be hard pressed to find a more RL family than the Edwards but they have an AFL player. Mostly because the support and pathway to the elite level is so much more defined.

NTRL officials will tell you they develop these kids - they want to play League and the AFL offers the bucks and off they go. Dumb,dumb, dumb.

 

[BunniesMan]

Imagine if Rugby League/Rugby Union and Aussie Rules were one in Australia and the crowds you get be great with the international of Rugby Union/the SOO of Rugby League and the AFL regular round's.

Right I bets be off before I get lynched.

Something that is easily forgotten in all of this.

We are a very small country. When you combine the AFL/NRL crowds, as well as Union and Soccer, for a country of 20 odd million, we punch way way way way way above our weight in how much sport we support.

If someone took the time to work out how many Australians watch/attend live sport per head of population, I think it would be off the charts compared to any country in Europe or the US.

 

[woodyk2]

Dont let facts get in the way of a good story.

Crowds are comparable with some of the highest season averages ever.

Memberships are growing.

Lol @ refs point.

Video reffing has improved this year immeasurably.

Auskick crowds down by 4,000 compared to season high a few years ago.

And those averages are rubbish.Be real ...say 12000 compared to 55000? For a club game? I dunno what has to be done. Oh I used that crowd figure from a few weeks ago. Both weekends were bright and sunny.

 

[VictoryFC]

Something that is easily forgotten in all of this.

We are a very small country. When you combine the AFL/NRL crowds, as well as Union and Soccer, for a country of 20 odd million, we punch way way way way way above our weight in how much sport we support.

If someone took the time to work out how many Australians watch/attend live sport per head of population, I think it would be off the charts compared to any country in Europe or the US.

Yes, but we also rely on things other countries dont. Having up to 10 teams in cities can do wonders for averages of clubs who would struggle to post 15k. Being able to rely on another teams fanbase to fill half the stadium is a big bonus an American league doesnt have for example. The only other city in the world that comes close to Melbourne and Sydney is Buenos Aires.

Not saying its not impressive, and per capita we are probably number 1, but being one of the richest countries along with the abnormal number of teams in major cities is a major advantage for our gates.

 

[BunniesMan]

Just to continue with what I was saying about Aussies punching above their weight in terms of sport.

To put what we support in context, if you know anything about the US, imagine all of our clubs, tv ratings and crowds in all the professional sports we have. Imagine fitting all of that in the state of Texas. Texas is bigger than Australia in population.

It really is ridiculous when you think about it. Our hunger for sport is second to none.

 

[VictoryFC]

And those averages are rubbish.Be real ...say 12000 compared to 55000? For a club game? I dunno what has to be done. Oh I used that crowd figure from a few weeks ago. Both weekends were bright and sunny.

Why the sudden surprise though? The NRL v AFL situation is more or less the same as it has been for a while crowds wise. The only difference really is that AFL averages have dropped, while NRL has stagnated.

 

[elbusto]

Why the sudden surprise though? The NRL v AFL situation is more or less the same as it has been for a while crowds wise. The only difference really is that AFL averages have dropped, while NRL has stagnated.

Yep and their crowds have dropped significantly despite the huge amount they spend advertising their games.

 

[VictoryFC]

Just to continue with what I was saying about Aussies punching above their weight in terms of sport.

To put what we support in context, if you know anything about the US, imagine all of our clubs, tv ratings and crowds in all the professional sports we have. Imagine fitting all of that in the state of Texas. Texas is bigger than Australia in population.

It really is ridiculous when you think about it. Our hunger for sport is second to none.

Again youre making simple mistakes. Their leagues cover a country that has something like 40 cities over 1 million people. If there was a Texan gridiron league that grew over time with 16 teams based across Dallas, Houston, San Antonio, Austin etc you would have a 30k+ league easy today.

Their problem is their country is too big, so teams have to be spread out. They dont rely on away crowds at all, which cant be said for our sports.

 

[Flapper]

This atmosphere argument is f**king geniused. It's only of relevance if you rely on other people to have a good time. I've had an absolute ball this year at games with terrible crowds.

 

[BunniesMan]

Yes, but we also rely on things other countries dont. Having up to 10 teams in cities can do wonders for averages of clubs who would struggle to post 15k. Being able to rely on another teams fanbase to fill half the stadium is a big bonus an American league doesnt have for example. The only other city in the world that comes close to Melbourne and Sydney is Buenos Aires.

Not saying its not impressive, and per capita we are probably number 1, but being one of the richest countries along with the abnormal number of teams in major cities is a major advantage for our gates.

The fact that we have so many professional sporting clubs just further proves my point. No other city or country in the world could support the amount of sporting infrastructure our cities do, especially Sydney and Melbourne.

Think about the combined turnover of every sporting club in Sydney and Melbourne. The amount of people employed in all those clubs. The amount of paying fans necessary to support all of that. And these are cities half the size of London and New York.

 

[VictoryFC]

The fact that we have so many professional sporting clubs just further proves my point. No other city or country in the world could support the amount of sporting infrastructure our cities do, especially Sydney and Melbourne.

Think about the combined turnover of every sporting club in Sydney and Melbourne. The amount of people employed in all those clubs. The amount of paying fans necessary to support all of that. And these are cities half the size of London and New York.

Feel like Im talking to a brick wall. New York never had the opportunity to develop its own intra city league like Melbourne and Sydney. Those sports became national very quickly, and with the spread of teams around a country, it doesnt give much room for 10 pro teams to be based in one city. The AFL was known as the VFL until recently for a reason.

Comparing Aus sports and US sports is idiotic. The situations are so different that you get nowhere trying to do comparisons.