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Current State of the NRL

Mr Red

First Grade
Messages
6,193
But that was the entire reasoning behind the move to ANZ for that game. The NRL and Doust have justified this move as "right game, right venue" as the tigers are seen as one of our marquee crowd pulling matches. Hence why games against Dogs (ANZ) and souffs (SCG) are also moved. And that leaves our actual home grounds with dreg matches against Cows, Panthers, Titans, Melb etc...
Agree with it or not, that is the way the NRL are now heading and I don't see them deviating from that coarse. If both teams had successful seasons last year, Sunday's match would have drawn closer to 28-30K... thus justifying the move. Even with the documented 19K I believe It pulled more than what Kogarah would have drawn on the day.

i would rather 23k packed into Kogarah with an amazing atmosphere and a TRUE home ground advantage, compared to 28k at Homebush, playing in a stadium devoid of atmosphere being 70% empty and sacrificing a true home ground advantage because its actually the other teams home ground..

sure short term you make a little more cash on gate takings + the NRL's little cash bonus, however just say you miss the finals buy 2 points having lost a game at Homebush that should have been a Kogarah home game that you increase your chance of winning...

the financial repercussions long term could far outweigh any short term advantage..
 
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Dezziedc

Juniors
Messages
665
Those figures are completely wrong.

Best advice is to be wary of using Wikipedia as a valid source, if you do then always cross check.

The 14,226 crowd for example was one of the attendance figures at Kogarah. Wouldn't surprise me if someone got 'WIN Jubilee' mixed up with 'WIN Wollongong'. That happened a lot last year.

Our crowds weren't great last year, Wollongong in particular failed to crack 10K on at least two occasions. But we had a top home crowd figure of 17,458.

OK, well here's a cross check for you - provide a link to your source?
 

GT0007

Juniors
Messages
1,967
i would rather 23k packed into Kogarah with an amazing atmosphere and a TRUE home ground advantage, compared to 28k at Homebush, playing in a stadium devoid of atmosphere being 70% empty and sacrificing a true home ground advantage because its actually the other teams home ground..

sure short term you make a little more cash on gate takings + the NRL's little cash bonus, however just say you miss the finals buy 2 points having lost a game at Homebush that should have been a Kogarah home game that you increase your chance of winning...

the financial repercussions long term could far outweigh any short term advantage..

Yeah I agree except last year we kept getting flogged at Kogarah. I'd like to see Dragons v Tigers played on Sat as a double header with Parra and Penrith every year and make it a big event as everyone is itching to see a game after the offseason so take advantage and make it an attractive option for them, give them something to travel for.

Worth note is that Dragons v Parra & Knights v Manly double header in 1999 at Stadium Australia attendence was a world record 104 000!

Other Sydney teams you could involve would be Souths, Rorters and dogs. For me it's a no brainer

F**k it lets do a tripple header lol and sell the stadium out. I believe it has been remodelled and only holds 83 500 but could it be temporarily remodelled back in an attempt to break the world record? What a great start to the season and a great promotion for NRL.........or am I just high lol

The rest of the weeks games barre maybe 1 you play outside of Sydney and the following week you play the Grandfinal rematch. If one of the previous Grandfinalists were outside sydney you give them a home game for their fans. Follow that week with a rivalry round and then Women in League round. Thats 4 weeks to start with a bang and get punters used to going back to the games.

My other big idea is to run a separate competition during the state of origin series in a group format like the world cup. That way you eliminate the unfairness of teams playing without origin stars relative to the proper season and also most of the irregularity of playing most teams twice. You would then only have to play about 2 teams twice in the proper season which you would make either rivalry or local derby games.

Last but not least I realised this season and last that the offseason is very long for supporters of teams who don't make the 8, why not run a second tier finals series. It also resolves the feeling that you get toward the end of the finals when there is not much football. These may seem like crazy idea's but they add interest.

Thoughts?
 
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Mr Red

First Grade
Messages
6,193
i think the 104,000 was also a lot of corporates, plus people itching to see the new Olympic stadium..
it was a test event for the stadium and public transport prior to the olympics..
getting flogged at Kogarah last year was an exception rather than the norm if you look historically..
 

jenninga

First Grade
Messages
8,545
Yeah I agree except last year we kept getting flogged at Kogarah. I'd like to see Dragons v Tigers played on Sat as a double header with Parra and Penrith every year and make it a big event as everyone is itching to see a game after the offseason so take advantage and make it an attractive option for them, give them something to travel for.

Worth note is that Dragons v Parra & Knights v Manly double header in 1999 at Stadium Australia attendence was a world record 104 000!

Other teams you could involve would be Souths, Rorters and dogs. For me it's a no brainer

Don't like the double header idea,the atmosphere is strange,many leave after the first game or arrive in 2nd half of 1st game.
Also,the 104,000 at that first double header,reckon 102,000 now hate the stadium ,it was a good idea at the time
 

Willow

Assistant Moderator
Messages
109,622
OK, well here's a cross check for you - provide a link to your source?
You'd rather put your faith in Wikipedia? Genuine question: Didn't the figures jump out at you as just being wrong? They seemed out of whack to me.

Anyway, for all things Rugby League - crowd numbers included - get your teeth into these websites - the guys who work on them are worth their weight in gold:

http://forums.leagueunlimited.com/showthread.php?t=412981
www.rugbyleagueproject.org
http://nrl.has.it

I'm bias, but my favourite is the top link. It is compiled each week by Timmah, he gets his figures from the LU live updates and the crowd figures there are spot on.
 
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GT0007

Juniors
Messages
1,967
Don't like the double header idea,the atmosphere is strange,many leave after the first game or arrive in 2nd half of 1st game.
Also,the 104,000 at that first double header,reckon 102,000 now hate the stadium ,it was a good idea at the time

I'm not sure if that is true or not but it has to be better than playing to 20 000. I'm only suggesting a one off at the beginning of each season. I watched one of the ANZAC day games there against the roosters and I quite enjoyed it
 

bottle

Coach
Messages
14,126
Discussions about home ground advantage and disenfranchising supporters aside for one sec, just a point of order re capacity at Kogarah.
Talk of 20K+ and 23K is a fiction isn't it?
I thought that there were restrictions in place (police?) that capped it at around 19K, or just under. My memory is a bit shaky on the actual figure.
Anyone?
 

TruSaint

Referee
Messages
20,716
Location: Sydney, New South Wales Address: 249 Princes Highway, Kogarah 2217
Capacity: 22,000 Seats: 8,500 (39% of capacity)
Record Crowd: 23,582 - 4/5/1975 NSWRL: St. George v South Sydney Highest Crowd since 1/1/2003: 20,847 - 29/03/09: NRL: Dragons v Sharks
Lights: Yes Arena Roof: No
Video Screen: Yes Arena Dimensions:
Built: 1935 Redeveloped: 2011
Former/Other Names: Jubilee Oval
Oki Jubilee Stadium
Kogarah Park Ticketing:
Sports Played: Rugby League
Rugby Union
Football Home Teams: St.George Illawarra RLC
Annual Events: Historic Events:
Last Event: 05/08/13: NRL: Dragons v Bulldogs Next Event: 19/04/14: NRL: Dragons v Warriors
 

Willow

Assistant Moderator
Messages
109,622
Discussions about home ground advantage and disenfranchising supporters aside for one sec, just a point of order re capacity at Kogarah.
Talk of 20K+ and 23K is a fiction isn't it?
I thought that there were restrictions in place (police?) that capped it at around 19K, or just under. My memory is a bit shaky on the actual figure.
Anyone?
The cops reportedly capped it years ago. I recall it was after a Canterbury game (the one where the Chaser guy did a spoof). Don't know if that cap is still in place.
 

bottle

Coach
Messages
14,126
Ok, thanks Tru and Willow.
So capacity at present appears to be a bit of a moveable feast.
 

TruSaint

Referee
Messages
20,716
From what i know from the Club itself, just under 21k is what they deem maximum.
Can they jam another 1000 in... probably, but would risk safety apparently.
 

jenninga

First Grade
Messages
8,545
Discussions about home ground advantage and disenfranchising supporters aside for one sec, just a point of order re capacity at Kogarah.
Talk of 20K+ and 23K is a fiction isn't it?
I thought that there were restrictions in place (police?) that capped it at around 19K, or just under. My memory is a bit shaky on the actual figure.
Anyone?

Think in 2010 v Scum (or Dogs) at Kogarah the crowd was capped at 18,500 for crowd safety and was packed but not uncomfortable,so official crowd figures of 22,000 will never be allowed anymore you would think.
 

bottle

Coach
Messages
14,126
Yeah that was my (albeit hazy) recollection, just under 19K or so.
I wonder if it possible to get some sort of definitive answer to this.
 

Dezziedc

Juniors
Messages
665
You'd rather put your faith in Wikipedia? Genuine question: Didn't the figures jump out at you as just being wrong? They seemed out of whack to me.

Anyway, for all things Rugby League - crowd numbers included - get your teeth into these websites - the guys who work on them are worth their weight in gold:

http://forums.leagueunlimited.com/showthread.php?t=412981
www.rugbyleagueproject.org
http://nrl.has.it

I'm bias, but my favourite is the top link. It is compiled each week by Timmah, he gets his figures from the LU live updates and the crowd figures there are spot on.

My point wasn't meant to be about the accuracy of the numbers or whether one reported figure is more accurate than the next. What I was saying is that I can see why the NRL want some of the bigger games or the more traditional games to be in larger stadiums. If certain games are traditionally packed, why not move them to a larger ground to create an opportunity for the game to grow?
 

TruSaint

Referee
Messages
20,716
My point wasn't meant to be about the accuracy of the numbers or whether one reported figure is more accurate than the next. What I was saying is that I can see why the NRL want some of the bigger games or the more traditional games to be in larger stadiums. If certain games are traditionally packed, why not move them to a larger ground to create an opportunity for the game to grow?

Just my opinion Dez,

a.) Its a disadvantage to play in an 80k stadium for a home team, with only 20k there.
The home ground advantage is nullified, as 20-30% of the crowds are members of that venue and not supporters.

b.) Its an awful spectacle for the game. Watching a slow motion replay with nothing but empty seats for a game like ours is an ugly sight. The argument will be TV rights. If they drop? what then.

c.) It alienates our core supporters. The people in the Gong, etc are now part of this club. The argument that Homebush or Moore Park are easily accessible doesn't hold. 2 or 3 more years of average performance may well diminish our base even more so.
 

giboz71

First Grade
Messages
9,518
b.) Its an awful spectacle for the game. Watching a slow motion replay with nothing but empty seats for a game like ours is an ugly sight. The argument will be TV rights. If they drop? what then.

Yep, totally agree. Even for TV viewers, it's all about perception isn't it? Showing games with empty stadiums is not a good look. If viewers see no one bothered to show up live, they may wonder whether they should tune in next week. And it's not like there no other options on TV?

Not talking about the tragics that will always watch the game, but rather the casual or fringe fans that the TV bosses are counting on. There is no guarantee they will continue to tune in.
 

TruSaint

Referee
Messages
20,716
Yep, totally agree. Even for TV viewers, it's all about perception isn't it? Showing games with empty stadiums is not a good look. If viewers see no one bothered to show up live, they may wonder whether they should tune in next week. And it's not like there no other options on TV?

Not talking about the tragics that will always watch the game, but rather the casual or fringe fans that the TV bosses are counting on. There is no guarantee they will continue to tune in.

That is my point in essence giboz.
Its a commercial matter. We take it for granted that our code will always dominate TV ratings.
Traditionally it has, but we are not in traditional times.
 

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