Do mergers and joint-ventures work?

[HowHigh]

Would I be happier for a 100% local based team out of Wollongong? yes
I'd still take the joint venture any day over not having a team here at all and we can all share 2010

 

[macavity]

No I'm talking about a club that hasn't made the finals since 2011. The fans are there just worn out!

The Knights record since the end of the Johns era juxtaposed with their attendances ... prove true fans stick solid.

 

[unforgiven]

The Knights record since the end of the Johns era juxtaposed with their attendances ... prove true fans stick solid.

That's because Newcastle is a hole with nothing else to do

 

[macavity]

That's because Newcastle is a hole with nothing else to do

I’m currently in Sydney wishing I was in Newie

 

[Vic Mackey]

The Knights record since the end of the Johns era juxtaposed with their attendances ... prove true fans stick solid.

No one doubts the Knights fans passion, well done to them. However as mentioned there’s f*#k all to do there. A mate of mine moved to Wallsend years ago, he’s a dragons fan yet goes to most Knights home games, so no doubt there’s a fair bit of that.

Considering the cluster f*#k we’ve been given over the past decade the fact that the club has any fans is truly marketable. Our crowd numbers are very good for Sydney, most years we’re in the top 2-3 for Sydney averages, a few years ago we were the highest.

I’m an old Balmain fan, I’ve seen my team make 3 semi final series in 30 years. If you think we’re band wagon fans seriously go f*#k yourself. Half of the clubs would have folded if they had that record.

 

[unforgiven]

I’m currently in Sydney wishing I was in Newie

I'm originally from the Hunter!

 

[unforgiven]

If you think we’re band wagon fans seriously go f*#k yourself.

In fairness he was responding to my comment saying we have the largest dormant supporter base.

 

[Mr Spock!]

Bears f**ked themselves over with infighting and being whiny merkins

Bit more than that though wasn't it when you had News Corp and Arko in the background trying to destroy the JV.

Nice bit of history about it here....

https://forums.leagueunlimited.com/...he-north-sydney-bears-northern-eagles.168925/

Apparently the JV was basically Manly especially when they rolled out their maroon strip.

And the ARL sacrificed the Central Coast to get that wonderfully successful area - the Gold Coast.

 

[mongoose]

That's because Newcastle is a hole with nothing else to do

so is canberra, doesn't help their crowds

 

[unforgiven]

so is canberra, doesn't help their crowds

Canberra is a bigger hole though, so everyone leaves town at any opportunity!

 

[Willow]

It appears that some people still don't know the difference between a merger and a joint venture.

St George Illawarra Dragons is a Joint Venture between two entities. This JV is reviewed every five years.

The SGID JV is currently between St George Dragons (50%) and WIN Corporation (50%), as WIN Corp bought out the Illawarra Steelers' final 25% share in 2018.

 

[LeagueXIII]

This was before my time but weren’t many of these clubs in a bad situations to begin with?
When did Steelers or West’s last win a title?

Administration of the past is nowhere near as good as today, also the money from TV revenue is way higher. Take Souths as a prime example, a club on the edge in the 70's, 80's and 90's who struggled compared to today a powerhouse.

Judging a team by how many titles they have won is not what it's about otherwise most soccer league's in Europe would have 3 or 4 teams. The Premier League would lose 85% of their clubs..

 

[Knuckle-dragger]

Judging a team by how many titles they have won is not what it's about.

What is your criteria?

 

[LeagueXIII]

I understand where you are coming from, but comparing teams who had little success in the past compared to today when there is a totally different playing field, with the money in the game, more professional administration, very efficient salary cap etc. is unfair.
As I said look how Souths are today to how they were from about 1973-2000.
Just because teams haven't won anything for years you don't kick them out, it's stupid. There are teams in all leagues around the world who have had little success but they always have hope that one day just one day they will be triumphant. Given our salary cap and governance today alot of our clubs now have this chance.
Clubs should protect their histories and not just sell them off easily.
St.George should be huge like Collingwood in the AFL.

 

[LeagueXIII]

Parra just wanted the Tiger, it was nothing but a take over to get that brand.They were going to be the Parrmatta Tigers playing in Blue and Gold at Parramatta with Parra coach and most of the players and staff. Wests was the better move for Balmain!

That just sums up rugby league administration, we'll sell out everything so we can get a mascot in order to sell more merchandise. Pathetic, what other sport with soul and history does that. Very Sad.

 

[LeagueXIII]

Bears f**ked themselves over with infighting and being whiny merkins

Norths actually made the original News Ltd criteria but stuck with the ARL.

 

[LeagueXIII]

Mergers only work if (a) the two teams are geographically close to each other and b) there's not real animosity between the sides. Dragons makes perfect sense geographically and also cause St George have the established history and the 'brand' power, while Illawarra has the talent pool.

Wests Tigers is tricky. Balmain have a big fanbase, but they moved out of the heartland long ago and are spread all across the country. The inner-west is no longer a big League area. People there would rather go to foreign film festivals or Swans games when it's trendy to do so. The Magpies had already moved from their traditional heartland of Lidcombe to Campbelltown when they merged, They had a small supporter base on top of that. So now you have a franchise with three home grounds, no real identity, the longest finals drought of the current NRL teams and playing uninspiring footy.

I don't know how you fix that?

Mergers only "work" when they are takeovers. St.George took over Illawarra and Balmain originally took over Wests but that has turned around now as the Magpies have all the money.

It's an accountants decision basically.

 

[Pommy]

Administration of the past is nowhere near as good as today, also the money from TV revenue is way higher. Take Souths as a prime example, a club on the edge in the 70's, 80's and 90's who struggled compared to today a powerhouse.

Judging a team by how many titles they have won is not what it's about otherwise most soccer league's in Europe would have 3 or 4 teams. The Premier League would lose 85% of their clubs..

My post was quoting the original op who was trying to suggest the mergers haven’t worked as the clubs have only one a title each. The clubs that were merged weren’t really in the best positions prior to the mergers.

 

[Billythekid]

There’s plenty to do in Newy. It’s always funny seeing this argument coming from people living in Sydney. I’ve seen this argument made about Melbourne, Brisbane, Newcastle, Canberra and yet all of those places are far better than Sydney. Place is a goddamn dump but whatever makes you feel better about your shitty crowds.

 

[t-ba]

Bit more than that though wasn't it when you had News Corp and Arko in the background trying to destroy the JV.

Nice bit of history about it here....

https://forums.leagueunlimited.com/...he-north-sydney-bears-northern-eagles.168925/

Apparently the JV was basically Manly especially when they rolled out their maroon strip.

And the ARL sacrificed the Central Coast to get that wonderfully successful area - the Gold Coast.

The JV was Manly because it was Manly's license. The Bears went into administration like a week before the licenses were handed out and merged with Manly, who had gotten one of the license under the cereal box toy 'criteria' a few weeks later. Our deal was by far the least predatory. Newcastle basically floated (not too seriously imo) the idea to absorb the bears with out a colour or name change, Parra (Well, more accurately, Fitzgerald) offered to take up the Bears mascot in Blue and Gold. Neither countenanced playing games at Gosford.

Norths should have joined Souths in the Trenches. Unfortunately they were under control of an administrator at the time, and weren't given that choice.

The JV was a f**k but Manly isn't the big bad here.