Do you want Brad Arthur as coach

[Poupou Escobar]

His string of games last year, where he missed simple conversions, was bewildering, and not good enough for a player commanding his salary.

But he's safe - there's no pressure on him.

Maybe he missed those kicks precisely because of the pressure on him? He was in contract negotiations at the time. His extension was announced after the Penrith win in round four.

 

[hineyrulz]

Why else would they bring Ivan back to the club. He won f**k all in his first 15 years. Hadn't even won half of his games. Bu Penrith were desperate to stop the Chooks poaching their young halfback. How many other Origin players have a relative employed at the club on stupid money and the NRL doesn't say a word?

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Yes, but that's what I mean - he's not considered, at least not unanimously, the heir apparent, and I question why.

It's because there's halves eligible for NSW who are just as good.

 

[the phantom menace]

*Luke

He wasn't even born when that show was on!

 

[King-Gutho94]

He has mate

He blocked you.

 

[Gary Gutful]

What have Ben Hunt and DCE done for their clubs since Moses got to Parra that indicates they are earning their pay check more than Moses?

Nothing.

 

[Gronk]

I disagree.

For a guy on a salary just shy of $1 million a year, his goalkicking fluctuates wildly, and he has shown he struggles to get us on the front foot when we are behind.

I'm not saying he needs to be let go.

I'm saying we need to sign/promote a half who can step in to take the reigns, to show Moses that if he underperforms, he can, and will, be replaced.

The comparison to Cleary was valid - they play the same position, and Cleary is the yardstick that all halves should be measured by.

I'm not sure that it can be reasons said that he is firmly in the next tier of half-backs - if that was the case, he'd be an automatic inclusion for NSW whenever Cleary was not available.

And yet, there's always debate as to whether NSW should go with Moses, or Hynes.

Tigers fans - though still salty about his departure - will happily point out that he is a prime example of a downhill skier.

Fans from other teams will also join this chorus.

He is the beneficiary of the halfback stocks being absolute garbage, save for a few decent players. That in, and of, itself, doesn't mean he's brilliant; it just means he's the best of a bad bunch.

When the chips are down, and we need a miracle, I see Gutherson demanding the ball. As our halfback, and a player aiming to one day get paid $1 million dollars per season, that should be Moses' attitude.

Agree. He is a decent half but he will never do what Cleary did in the grand final. I think his general play is excellent. But when the chips are down I don't see him as the type who will grab a game by the scruff on the neck and take charge.
B.Hunt,DCE,Johnson,Munster all can along with Nathan.

I just don’t get where this is going. Bagging him for something to do ? Replace him with who ?

Are some of you seriously saying that we should have not made an offer to renew his contract ? Cos a non competitive offer would have meant we walked.

I bet the guy we didn’t want would have been the hottest player on the market for ages.

 

[Eelementary]

I just don’t get where this is going. Bagging him for something to do ? Replace him with who ?

Are some of you seriously saying that we should have not made an offer to renew his contract ? Cos a non competitive offer would have meant we walked.

I bet the guy we didn’t want would have been the hottest player on the market for ages.

I've not once said we should not have re-signed him.

My criticisms of him have been supported by stats, so it's not "bagging" him.

If you feel he is performing to his price tag, fine.

I don't.

And that's all I've been saying.

 

[Eelementary]

Just do some sums and compare FFS.

Are you saying that his salary makes him not the automatic heir apparent?

I'm also not sure why you've brought hostility into this.

If you disagree, fine.

If you can't be civil, then don't say anything .

 

[hineyrulz]

@Eelementary is spot on, Moses still has flaws in his game and he still struggles to ice the big moments. He’s gotten better but still doesn’t, and he never really takes a game by the scruff of the neck when the team needs him.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

If you feel he is performing to his price tag, fine.

Just like the rest of you, I don’t know how much Moses or anyone else is getting paid. But I suspect we did have to pay more than we thought he was worth in order to avoid not having a kicking game next year.

Most clubs would have to pay overs (under the cap) in at least a couple of roster slots, and we are no different. If you only ever offer what you think players are worth you could struggle to get close to filling your cap. So you pay overs where you have to and try to make it up by underpaying in other areas. Ultimately what matters is the quality of the team, not what any individual is paid.

In the case of Moses, he doesn’t have a relative we can employ (outside the cap) on $500k more than he’s worth. Not one that he (and we) trust anyway.

 

[Gary Gutful]

Are you saying that his salary makes him not the automatic heir apparent?

I'm also not sure why you've brought hostility into this.

If you disagree, fine.

If you can't be civil, then don't say anything .

I'm saying that his salary is similar to others who have performed to a similar level as him in the same time that he has been on said salary.

 

[Gary Gutful]

My criticisms of him have been supported by stats, so it's not "bagging" him.

The goal kicking stat didn't really support much at all.

 

[Gary Gutful]

@Eelementary is spot on, Moses still has flaws in his game and he still struggles to ice the big moments. He’s gotten better but still doesn’t, and he never really takes a game by the scruff of the neck when the team needs him.

I've seen him take plenty of games by the scruff of the neck. I've also seen him ice big moments.

Is he perfect? No.

Has there been games where he could have done better? Yes.

Is he as good as Cleary? Absolutely not.

Is he as good as anyone not called Cleary? I think so.

 

[Noise]

I've not once said we should not have re-signed him.

My criticisms of him have been supported by stats, so it's not "bagging" him.

If you feel he is performing to his price tag, fine.

I don't.

And that's all I've been saying.

What stats? You haven’t provided any stats. I provided the goal kicking percentage which supports the fact he is a good goal kicker.

 

[Eelementary]

The goal kicking stat didn't really support much at all.

His kicking has fluctuated wildly since he joined us.

He joined the Eels as an above 80% kicker, and it has dipped to 78. 58%.

Gutherson's career goalkicking percentage is 71%.

 

[Eelementary]

What stats? You haven’t provided any stats. I provided the goal kicking percentage which supports the fact he is a good goal kicker.

I provided his goalkicking stats a few pages back, showing his goalkicking declined when he joined the Eels (though it has begun swinging upwards).

 

[Eelementary]

I'm saying that his salary is similar to others who have performed to a similar level as him in the same time that he has been on said salary.

Fair enough.

 

[hineyrulz]

I've seen him take plenty of games by the scruff of the neck. I've also seen him ice big moments.

Is he perfect? No.

Has there been games where he could have done better? Yes.

Is he as good as Cleary? Absolutely not.

Is he as good as anyone not called Cleary? I think so.

He’s improved but he’s hardly consistently taken games by the scruff of the neck??? Beating up on shitty teams like the Tigers or the Dogs when we are on top hardly counts. I think he's the most talented half in the cop but he just doesn't show it often enough or when it really matters.

 

[Gary Gutful]

His kicking has fluctuated wildly since he joined us.

He joined the Eels as an above 80% kicker, and it has dipped to 78. 58%.

Gutherson's career goalkicking percentage is 71%.

Thats not a significant fluctuation. I would use the word 'wildly' if it was now down at 50%.