Dragons v Broncos Rd 3 2023

[Old Timer]

As good as Sullivan and Amone may be, it's rarely wise - and almost never successful - to blood two young halves together for extended periods. There's few better examples of this than our round 3 opponent, the Broncos. The best thing for Bud and Junior's development, but also best for the team, is that we have one accomplished, experienced player in the halves.

And that's obviously going to be our biggest name player in Hunt. And if it's Hunt, then for the balance of the team, the right halves partner is Sullivan.

You seem a bit hyper-focused on what people in this place say, and quick to take the contrarian view at the expense of clear evidence

The clear evidence is how many years has Hunt been our half and how have we gone?

If it has been a failure to now so how will that remedy itself with a 34 year old that plays a different position for his state and country?

 

[Victoire]

The clear evidence is how many years has Hunt been our half and how have we gone?

If it has been a failure to now so how will that remedy itself with a 34 year old that plays a different position for his state and country?

lol you get your knickers in a bunch over people apportioning blame to Moses Mbye for a single loss, yet are in here blaming Hunt for seasons' worth of dud results?

Plenty of players get picked in different positions for state and rep teams. Andrew Johns is a fkn Immortal and he played half of his Test matches at hooker. We're lucky to have a player so good that the Qld and Kangaroo selectors want him in their 17 somewhere.

But to answer the question in good faith: I think the team will improve because Sullivan is a more complimentary halves partner for Hunt. Especially as he grows in confidence and experience over the season he can take on more of those game management responsibilities. I dont think Amone has that in him, and I don't think Sullivan is ready to do all of it just yet

 

[Old Timer]

lol you get your knickers in a bunch over people apportioning blame to Moses Mbye for a single loss, yet are in here blaming Hunt for seasons' worth of dud results?

Plenty of players get picked in different positions for state and rep teams. Andrew Johns is a fkn Immortal and he played half of his Test matches at hooker. We're lucky to have a player so good that the Qld and Kangaroo selectors want him in their 17 somewhere.

But to answer the question in good faith: I think the team will improve because Sullivan is a more complimentary halves partner for Hunt. Especially as he grows in confidence and experience over the season he can take on more of those game management responsibilities. I dont think Amone has that in him, and I don't think Sullivan is ready to do all of it just yet

So IYO Amone is not the future at 6 so who do we buy to join us in 2 years time when Hunt goes?

 

[Victoire]

So IYO Amone is not the future at 6 so who do we buy to join us in 2 years time when Hunt goes?

Umm I've never said Amone wasn't the future at 6. Either your powers of comprehension are lacking or you're inventing things to be contrarian about.

 

[Mojo]

The other players saw the replacement and decided Griffin had given up, so they may as well too.

Quite seriously, I reckon the team may well have had the shits with the fact that they'd busted their guts for 70 minutes and Hook sends one of his favourites on. It would have given me the shits if I was on the field. In fact it did give me the shits and I was only watching from an armchair. I turned to my son and said, very calmly, 'what the fkkkk is he doing sending Mbye on at this stage of the fknnnn game? Fkkkkkk!'. He said ‘father, really, it’s a game for ruffians. Please curtail your resort to using expletives and please desist from spitting when you speak’.

 

[Old Timer]

Umm I've never said Amone wasn't the future at 6. Either your powers of comprehension are lacking or you're inventing things to be contrarian about.

Ok so are you saying that Amone should be the 5/8 in two years when Hunt finishes his contract?

 

[Mojo]

What about the time Sloan was tackled in the air..didn't even get a replY just fox saying a foot just touched the ground

I hate that bs rule anyway.

 

[Mojo]

It's working ok with two halfbacks but we lose the advantages of a running 5/8. Hard to set up sweeping plays a la Hunt & Widdop. Hopefully we will one day get to see an Amone/Bud combo working some set plays together, some off the cuff stuff and some magic like they did in the lower grades.

SullIvan is a much better player than Amone (even at 5/8) IMO. Liddle‘s killing it at 9. If Amone comes back as a bench player then we have 6, 7 and 9 covered. Our exposure is at fullback - Sloan’s going well but god forbid he gets injured. I reckon Lomax is a fullback.

 

[jak]

at the end of the day the nrl did not want the bronco's or dolphins to lose before they meet next week , lets wait and see what happens with kaufusi this week.

 

[possm]

The clear evidence is how many years has Hunt been our half and how have we gone?

If it has been a failure to now so how will that remedy itself with a 34 year old that plays a different position for his state and country?

I agree! I would have rather Hunt go to the Dolphins and after that we:
Sullivan to 7
Amone to 6
Plus a couple of good first-grade props.

 

[Wolfgang90]

Our players were hanging on until the 70th min but that all changed once hass returned. Mbye nor anyone else was going to stop him. That's why he's an elite player, he won the broncos the game with his stints. We just didn't have the cattle to stop him at the end.

 

[Mojo]

It's good to have arguments about who should be playing in a positive light rather than which duds we can replace this week haha. Mbye is my biggest pet peeve at the moment & just the mins played but other than that our 17 looks pretty solid!

It’s not Mbye’s fault that the coach uses him the way he does.

 

[Mojo]

A

Amone 6 Sullivan 7 Hunt 9

That’s what it should be but Hunt rhymes with … which is why I hope Liddle nails the 9 spot.

 

[Dragon David]

at the end of the day the nrl did not want the bronco's or dolphins to lose before they meet next week , lets wait and see what happens with kaufusi this week.

It will smack of unbelievable hypocrisy if Kaufisi gets off with just a fine, but some rules can be bent for the betterment of making sure that all players are available for this blockbuster while some other player will cop the wrath of the judiciary instead.

 

[Gourley's Socks]

Our players were hanging on until the 70th min but that all changed once hass returned. Mbye nor anyone else was going to stop him. That's why he's an elite player, he won the broncos the game with his stints. We just didn't have the cattle to stop him at the end.

I didn't think this at the time but in hindsight, we were already outpointed two tries to nil in the second half by that stage.

It was telling in the post-match interviews that the Broncos were apparently given a spray at half-time for not playing well. That's why we were still in it at the 70th minute.

They're a top 8 side and we're not. We're a long way off the pace so we were always going to struggle. But I don't mind because there were still some good signs throughout the game even if we were ultimately out-gunned.

 

[Saints Forever]

A

Amone 6 Sullivan 7 Hunt 9

Sullivan 7
Hunt 6
Amone 14 goes to 6, Hunt goes to 9 to give Liddle a 20-30 minute rest

 

[Number of the Beath]

Seriously, one loss and we're back to this ? It wasn't Hook making all those stoopid errors or missing tackles or giving the Broncos a free ride like that poxy ref, or deciding drinks breaks wouldn't be required.

We just matched it for 70 minutes with arguably the benchmark team of the competition (at home) and definitely a top 4 or even top 2 forward pack. Forget the last 10 minutes, didn't happen. I thought our boys were great and once again big wraps to our bench coming on and playing above their weight. The combination of Kerr's quick play the balls and Liddle's darts out of dummy half need to be happening shortly after kick off though with Sloan and Bud ready to capitalize and with Mbye back to the bench. I also wonder why we put the Off Loads away this week with only 4 but the 12 last week got us some line breaks and a try.
I'll say it now, with more time together and with some tweaking and not too many injuries or suspensions we're a real chance of making the 8.

The lads were gassed before 70 minutes, that was just when the wheels really fell off.
But, if you're happy with 70 minutes of football followed by a major fade at the end then you've got the coach you deserve. And you'll get a repeat of 2021 and 2022.
Someone else on here said that most teams train to play for 100 minutes - we clearly don't.
So far we've won one game against a team that played like utter $hite and you've got us pegged for a top eight spot?! It's gonna take a lot more than Liddle and a revitalised Josh Kerr to get us there!

I'm happy to be proven wrong - I hope to be, cos I want us in the eight. But I've got as much chance of flying by flapping me ears in the wind that we have of making the eight with Hook at the controls.

 

[kit66]

All the negative concentration on Mybe as if he single handedly lost us the game is just typical of many in this place who refuse to appraise games correctly. I think it's more that people were confused about him being our starting Hooker and also getting put on for 8 minutes at the end when a forward might have been more handy.

Their constant talking up of Hunt, Sloan, Bud with no proper reflection is a great example of how wrong people get it.

Hunt is an arm grabber in defence which causes lots of issues for the defensive line, a ball hog at critical moments, has a dreadful kicking game, is a poor game manager but also has the great ability to produce moments of brilliance such as a 40/20 or break the line and score. The halves in nearly every team have more missed tackles than anyone else, they get run at by big forwards constantly. Hunt's clean up work with try savers and cover tackles is excellent, puts his body on the line, never leaves it to others. Saying his kicking game is dreadful is a bit rash, he puts in plenty of good attacking kicks that get us tries or repeat sets and he had the most 40-20s last year, so hardly dreadful. His game management could be better and I agree he has to let others make a call, for example let Liddle decide sometimes who gets the ball when and not carry on like a spoiled brat when he doesn't get it.

Sloan is a WIP and has many issues to work on that actually cost us games, poor front on defence, lopes along behind the defensive line instead of busting his gut to get there and of course very confused about when to attack the ball from opposition kicks but of course he is silky in attack and can score from long range due to his great pace. You better hope he improves because the alternatives aren't very inspiring. We gave Dufty 5 years, we can give this guy a full season.

Bud is also a WIP with issues that cost us games, poor defence, wrong options at critical moments but of course can be very dynamic in attack and had good vision. He's played a handful of games and already his defence is better than either Hunt or Amone. He'll improve in attack, the ability is there for anyone to see. Has he cost us any games ?

So the 3 of these are what can actually win you games single handedly but also contribute heavily to you losing games but Mybe will neither win you a game nor lose you a game due to his singular involvement. I don't know how you come to that conclusion - or understand why you think your conclusion (about Mbye) is a good or desirable thing, you've lost me. Mbye is an ok utility if you don't have anyone better but a starting Hooker ? when we have Liddle who has performed really well.

He is now the whipping boy because so many are blinkered and lack proper objectivity when analysing our games. Again, it's the "why is he our starting hooker" and some posters like to get a little personal and even more so love a juicy scapegoat. Whip it !

The wax lyrical about Bud is almost sickening and if people are really honest they will find it difficult to reason why he should get the nod over Amone for the 6 jumper (talking pure footy here) as Amone had made that position his at the end of 2022. Simple, Bud didn't attack anyone with a hammer plus Bud is a game manager and we need one of those - he hasn't been handed that cap yet but the day will come.

Bud's position is the 7 and instead of people arguing that he should be there right now they create false narratives around Amone.

So in the end we have youngsters making critical mistakes as we always knew they would plus Hunt being Hunt yet people choose to ignore / underplay it and instead focus on Mybe and for the record I'm not saying he is in fact the right option for the team but there are issues with other players that are more important and when / if they are addressed that will actually see us not lose games. The people we have making mistakes are the same people who always make mistakes, every week without fail, guaranteed, not the young ones but the older guys who should know better and be better at holding a frigging ball by now - Lomax, Su'a, Suli and Bird, - dropsies, penalties, six agains and brain explosions. They'll do it again next week. That's what's costing us games.

 

[Wolfgang90]

I didn't think this at the time but in hindsight, we were already outpointed two tries to nil in the second half by that stage.

It was telling in the post-match interviews that the Broncos were apparently given a spray at half-time for not playing well. That's why we were still in it at the 70th minute.

They're a top 8 side and we're not. We're a long way off the pace so we were always going to struggle. But I don't mind because there were still some good signs throughout the game even if we were ultimately out-gunned.

Yep, the dressing room view footage showed kevvie giving a spray to the broncos about playing too lateral & not direct enough. He gestured to go straight through them, which they did & then hass broke us in the last 10. To be fair both packs made plenty of meters, they just did better on the kick returns (thanks to reynolds monster bombs) & hass elite last 10mins.

No shame in losing that much, we showed plenty of heart, had good moments in attack & courage in defence. I can't ask for much more.

 

[Victoire]

Ok so are you saying that Amone should be the 5/8 in two years when Hunt finishes his contract?

If Amone is still around (ie not in jail) both he and Sullivan will be more seasoned. Next year a transition of Hunt to DH might make more sense. We also have Zach Herring coming through. Or we could go to market. Hopefully a new coach is appointed soon and can start making these plans