DT: Tim Smith leaves dark place for comeback

[parra pete]

Ignore them Mr Fawlty, ignore them....

 

[lingard]

This is the problem with any Tim Smith discussion; we always have two topics - his football ability and his bi-polar disorder. I'm not interested in his psychiatric/psychological problems. They either exist or they don't, it's not for me to say. But his football ability is what interests me, because I've been able to observe that over the years. It's a shame that the two issues seem to get so muddled together.

 

[caylo]

This is the problem with any Tim Smith discussion; we always have two topics - his football ability and his bi-polar disorder. I'm not interested in his psychiatric/psychological problems. They either exist or they don't, it's not for me to say. But his football ability is what interests me, because I've been able to observe that over the years. It's a shame that the two issues seem to get so muddled together.

Any player is judged on two things, 1. their ability and 2. their attitude. I would never sign someone like Watmough because he is a d*ckhead. I would prefer Hindy and Cayless because they offer alot ability wise (not as much as Watmough maybe) but they have better attitudes on and off the field.

I would love someone with Tims ability here but with his talent comes his history (esp because he was at this club) and we have had a very clean year this year in a pretty bad season for off field incidents. Without these distractions it becomes more about football, even when we were playing poorly they were talking about us on the field not attitude issues in the club which compound problems.

ATM we don't need a halfback that is plays Tims style and we dont need a player of Tims history. I am pro-Tim and I love the guy and my heart wants him back in the blue and gold but my head knows better. We have 2 very good young prospect in the halves (KK and Mortz), plus Hayne and Mateo in there for support. We also have another jnr who is ready to take the step up coming into the team (humble) plus the remote possibility that a steady halfback in Robson could stay. This is not the mention the strike power we now have outwide (Tahu, Inu, Reddy, Grothe and Burt). We will score plenty of points so realistically Tim Smith would not add much to this team, he should join a team that is lacking a halfback (Brisbane, Sharks, Warriors or Canberra)

 

[yy_cheng]

What do you guys reckon is the baseline for a Halfback out of 10

8 Clearing Kicks
7 Running Metres
8 Error Free
6 Defense
6 Line Breaks
8 Line Breaks/Try Assists
7 Touch Kicks from Penalties
8 Maintaining Pressure
8 Organizing the Forwards

Anything Else

 

[Casper The Ghost]

Any player is judged on two things, 1. their ability and 2. their attitude. I would never sign someone like Watmough because he is a d*ckhead. I would prefer Hindy and Cayless because they offer alot ability wise (not as much as Watmough maybe) but they have better attitudes on and off the field.

I would love someone with Tims ability here but with his talent comes his history (esp because he was at this club) and we have had a very clean year this year in a pretty bad season for off field incidents. Without these distractions it becomes more about football, even when we were playing poorly they were talking about us on the field not attitude issues in the club which compound problems.

ATM we don't need a halfback that is plays Tims style and we dont need a player of Tims history. I am pro-Tim and I love the guy and my heart wants him back in the blue and gold but my head knows better. We have 2 very good young prospect in the halves (KK and Mortz), plus Hayne and Mateo in there for support. We also have another jnr who is ready to take the step up coming into the team (humble) plus the remote possibility that a steady halfback in Robson could stay. This is not the mention the strike power we now have outwide (Tahu, Inu, Reddy, Grothe and Burt). We will score plenty of points so realistically Tim Smith would not add much to this team, he should join a team that is lacking a halfback (Brisbane, Sharks, Warriors or Canberra)

The 80 minute organiser in the present team is Robson. Without Robson the Eels do not have another 80 minute organiser with the toughness and determination Robson has to replace him with.

In comes Tim Smith.

KK is not an 80 minute organiser and neither is Mortimer (yet). Mateo and Hayne are not 80 minute organisers either. Bar Robson, all the above are STRIKE WEAPONS, they are not generals overseeing the battle ground while all-caught-up intensely in the middle of it.

Hayne picks his moment as do the others but Tim (and Robson) will pick moment after moment across 80 minutes in the job of organising the team.

Without Tim Smith or Robson who else do we have that can conduct the team next year, in the heat of battle, for 80 minutes week after week after week???

If I was DA & PO I would be doing everything possible to keep Robson and sign up Tim Smith. It's best we do not crowd the head space of all our brilliant attacking players with the weight of having to organise the team for 80 minutes as well. Leave that to Jeff Robson and Tim Smith. As we witnessed over the past 2 years everyone who stepped forward in this roll could not handle it week after week.

Since 2001 the Eels were only ever a genuine top 4 NRL team when Tim Smith was at his best (and we know the reasons why he fell apart including the other reasons/circumstances I detailed in many of my earlier posts back in June/July/Aug 09).

Under the inspiring care (and discipline) of DA & PO (and others) Tim Smith will finally blossom to consistently reveal his full array of skills that will blow footy fans away for many years to come. He has met his demons and he has now conquered them. He is focused and determined to do the extra heavy workload required in his training (both brain & body) to fulfill his true potential which so far has been neglected and wasted.

Remember Jarryd Hayne after Fiji world Cup?

Boooooooooooo Casper

 

[benoir91]

The 80 minute organiser in the present team is Robson. Without Robson the Eels do not have another 80 minute organiser with the toughness and determination Robson has to replace him with.

In comes Tim Smith.

KK is not an 80 minute organiser and neither is Mortimer (yet). Mateo and Hayne are not 80 minute organisers either. Bar Robson, all the above are STRIKE WEAPONS, they are not generals overseeing the battle ground while all-caught-up intensely in the middle of it.

Hayne picks his moment as do the others but Tim (and Robson) will pick moment after moment across 80 minutes in the job of organising the team.

Without Tim Smith or Robson who else do we have that can conduct the team next year, in the heat of battle, for 80 minutes week after week after week???

If I was DA & PO I would be doing everything possible to keep Robson and sign up Tim Smith. It's best we do not crowd the head space of all our brilliant attacking players with the weight of having to organise the team for 80 minutes as well. Leave that to Jeff Robson and Tim Smith. As we witnessed over the past 2 years everyone who stepped forward in this roll could not handle it week after week.

Since 2001 the Eels were only ever a genuine top 4 NRL team when Tim Smith was at his best (and we know the reasons why he fell apart including the other reasons/circumstances I detailed in many of my earlier posts back in June/July/Aug 09).

Under the inspiring care (and discipline) of DA & PO (and others) Tim Smith will finally blossom to consistently reveal his full array of skills that will blow footy fans away for many years to come. He has met his demons and he has now conquered them. He is focused and determined to do the extra heavy workload required in his training (both brain & body) to fulfill his true potential which so far has been neglected and wasted.

Remember Jarryd Hayne after Fiji world Cup?

Boooooooooooo Casper

Brilliantly Put!

 

[yy_cheng]

At the moment. Everyone is doing their job, everyone is putting their hands up, everyone is remembering the game plan and so leading the cattle is easy.

After 2005, we struggled. Timmy tried to take upon himself to get us out of trouble time and time again. He was courages. But without a team supporting him, he struggled big time. The team failed and the blame went to the next Peter Sterling.

However, in this current team, Do we need one?

I think KK will fit just fine in place of Robbo.

Once you throw in Tahu and Poore, who should know what they need to do without someone telling them, I really don't think we need an 80min organizer.

If a forward needs to hit out, Hindy. FFMM and Caylo will be the first ones there. If not, Grothe will do the hard yards. When nothing is happening in attack, the word will go out to Hayne and he will get involved.

In defense, Hindy, Caylo and Big Benny goes on and on.

This team now knows what they need to do under the coach's instruction.

Mortz seems to have the brain to remember the game plan and as I mentioned earlier, Smith struggled when the team was not firing.

So again do we need an 80min organizer?

 

[Casper The Ghost]

At the moment. Everyone is doing their job, everyone is putting their hands up, everyone is remembering the game plan and so leading the cattle is easy.

After 2005, we struggled. Timmy tried to take upon himself to get us out of trouble time and time again. He was courages. But without a team supporting him, he struggled big time. The team failed and the blame went to the next Peter Sterling.

However, in this current team, Do we need one?

I think KK will fit just fine in place of Robbo.

Once you throw in Tahu and Poore, who should know what they need to do without someone telling them, I really don't think we need an 80min organizer.

If a forward needs to hit out, Hindy. FFMM and Caylo will be the first ones there. If not, Grothe will do the hard yards. When nothing is happening in attack, the word will go out to Hayne and he will get involved.

In defense, Hindy, Caylo and Big Benny goes on and on.

This team now knows what they need to do under the coach's instruction.

Mortz seems to have the brain to remember the game plan and as I mentioned earlier, Smith struggled when the team was not firing.

So again do we need an 80min organizer?

Yes, without Robson we (all Eels supporters) will already be thinking about next year. Robson is the anchor in this present squad. DA had no idea he could do this 80 minute organising so well, and probably, neither did Robson as well.

So much of the Eels success has come off the back of Robson taking on the 80 minute roll of organiser allowing all our strike weapons to do just that and look how brilliant this team is going and look how quickly Mortimer is blossoming.

Robson is the glue to the team winning this years GF. Without him, its going to be a huge uphill battle to win even one game in the coming semis.

Robson is now one of the top three 7 in the NRL.

He is the reincarnation of Phar Laps heart.

WOW what a general he is today.

Boooooooooooo Casper

 

[BURT]

Rememeber timmy only went off the rails when that Bozo Hagan took over. DA would be a stable influence and I think you could see him go to another level with time.

 

[lucablight]

The 80 minute organiser in the present team is Robson. Without Robson the Eels do not have another 80 minute organiser with the toughness and determination Robson has to replace him with.

In comes Tim Smith.

KK is not an 80 minute organiser and neither is Mortimer (yet). Mateo and Hayne are not 80 minute organisers either. Bar Robson, all the above are STRIKE WEAPONS, they are not generals overseeing the battle ground while all-caught-up intensely in the middle of it.

Hayne picks his moment as do the others but Tim (and Robson) will pick moment after moment across 80 minutes in the job of organising the team.

Without Tim Smith or Robson who else do we have that can conduct the team next year, in the heat of battle, for 80 minutes week after week after week???

If I was DA & PO I would be doing everything possible to keep Robson and sign up Tim Smith. It's best we do not crowd the head space of all our brilliant attacking players with the weight of having to organise the team for 80 minutes as well. Leave that to Jeff Robson and Tim Smith. As we witnessed over the past 2 years everyone who stepped forward in this roll could not handle it week after week.

Since 2001 the Eels were only ever a genuine top 4 NRL team when Tim Smith was at his best (and we know the reasons why he fell apart including the other reasons/circumstances I detailed in many of my earlier posts back in June/July/Aug 09).

Under the inspiring care (and discipline) of DA & PO (and others) Tim Smith will finally blossom to consistently reveal his full array of skills that will blow footy fans away for many years to come. He has met his demons and he has now conquered them. He is focused and determined to do the extra heavy workload required in his training (both brain & body) to fulfill his true potential which so far has been neglected and wasted.

Remember Jarryd Hayne after Fiji world Cup?

Boooooooooooo Casper

so you still maintain Tim Smith will be at the Eels in 2010?

 

[caylo]

The 80 minute organiser in the present team is Robson. Without Robson the Eels do not have another 80 minute organiser with the toughness and determination Robson has to replace him with.

In comes Tim Smith.

KK is not an 80 minute organiser and neither is Mortimer (yet). Mateo and Hayne are not 80 minute organisers either. Bar Robson, all the above are STRIKE WEAPONS, they are not generals overseeing the battle ground while all-caught-up intensely in the middle of it.

The bold points, first Robson is not an 80 min organiser neither is Mortimer or Hayne, or Mateo. Our game plan is to go through the forwards and force second phase play with a deep backline.
Now Robson is doing well to set the depth in the backline required along with Mortimer, MK organises the Forwards and Hayne generally organises a backline movement, Mateo is ad-lib does not do much organising just asks players to follow him.

KK is actually a very good talker and probably a has a better kicking game and organises a backline movement better then Robo. Simply atm Robson is doing a very good job and playing well with the team while KK was out injured. I expect after he get over his injury and is in full time squad over the offseason our football may become more expansive and we could become a better attacking team. The positive thing for KK and Mortz next year is they will have Hayne and Mateo to fall back on, the pressure wont be on their shoulders.

Tim Smith is the traditional halfback (unlike Mortz or KK) in which he will organise his forwards, his backline depth and the lines he expects to be run but this does not work with second phase play because timmy often will turn his back after a pass to set up the next play while KK and Mortz are in there supporting the play like a good half should (something Robson also does very well). Timmy will not suit our style of play IMO, he would be better off going to a team like the sharks that does not have the speed to capitalise off second phase play and must rely on set plays.

 

[yy_cheng]

Yes, without Robson we (all Eels supporters) will already be thinking about next year. Robson is the anchor in this present squad. DA had no idea he could do this 80 minute organising so well, and probably, neither did Robson as well.

So much of the Eels success has come off the back of Robson taking on the 80 minute roll of organiser allowing all our strike weapons to do just that and look how brilliant this team is going and look how quickly Mortimer is blossoming.

Robson is the glue to the team winning this years GF. Without him, its going to be a huge uphill battle to win even one game in the coming semis.

Robson is now one of the top three 7 in the NRL.

He is the reincarnation of Phar Laps heart.

WOW what a general he is today.

Boooooooooooo Casper

I like Robbo, he is doing his job but I don't think he is the glue. If he was out this week. I don't think he will be that missed. He is soooooo much better than Finch

I would stick Reddy at 5/8th as a defensive 6, Mortz to 7 and Benny to centre.

Hell, I would bring back Wags and play him at 6 and I think the team will still go allright.

Every man in this team is taking the initiative. It is not Robbo leading them per se.

 

[Casper The Ghost]

The bold points, first Robson is not an 80 min organiser neither is Mortimer or Hayne, or Mateo. Our game plan is to go through the forwards and force second phase play with a deep backline.
Now Robson is doing well to set the depth in the backline required along with Mortimer, MK organises the Forwards and Hayne generally organises a backline movement, Mateo is ad-lib does not do much organising just asks players to follow him.

KK is actually a very good talker and probably a has a better kicking game and organises a backline movement better then Robo. Simply atm Robson is doing a very good job and playing well with the team while KK was out injured. I expect after he get over his injury and is in full time squad over the offseason our football may become more expansive and we could become a better attacking team. The positive thing for KK and Mortz next year is they will have Hayne and Mateo to fall back on, the pressure wont be on their shoulders.

Tim Smith is the traditional halfback (unlike Mortz or KK) in which he will organise his forwards, his backline depth and the lines he expects to be run but this does not work with second phase play because timmy often will turn his back after a pass to set up the next play while KK and Mortz are in there supporting the play like a good half should (something Robson also does very well). Timmy will not suit our style of play IMO, he would be better off going to a team like the sharks that does not have the speed to capitalise off second phase play and must rely on set plays.

Caylo, one of the primary hallmarks of the eels 2005 and 2007 seasons was their 2nd phase play with Tim leading them around the park. I suggest you go back and have a very good look at the 2005/2007 games when the Eels played brilliantly and often you will find it was the second phase plays that caused all the damage.

Also, its very important for every player to take full-responsibility for their roll in the team game and one of those rolls is the organiser. How many teams won the GF over the past 100 years without a chief in control, particularly the last 30 years???? What about Sterling what do you think he was doing for 80 minutes while surrounded by one of the best attacking squads in NRL history when the Eels won the GF 1981/82/83/86??????

Boooooooooooo Casper

 

[caylo]

Caylo, one of the primary hallmarks of the eels 2005 and 2007 seasons was their 2nd phase play with Tim leading them around the park. I suggest you go back and have a very good look at the 2005/2007 games when the Eels played brilliantly and often you will find it was the second phase plays that caused all the damage.

Boooooooooooo Casper

Casper lets just agree to disagree because I have followed Tims footy closley (he coached me in school footy) and unfortunatly his support play is not one of his strong points. Timmy was at his best against retreating defenders but rarley was he around the ruck area looking for an offload like Morts, KK or Robson does. Often he waited one or two plays off the ruck while he organised his backline. Essentially Timmy did all the organising instead of sharing it with a 5-8 and his 5-8 ended up as just link players rather then actual 5-8.

 

[Casper The Ghost]

Caylo, also, its very important for every player to take full-responsibility for their roll in the team game and one of those rolls is the organiser. How many teams won the GF over the past 100 years without a chief in control, particularly the last 30 years???? What about Sterling what do you think he was doing for 80 minutes while surrounded by one of the best attacking squads in NRL history when the Eels won the GF 1981/82/83/86??????

The structures put in place by Brian Smith 2005 and Michael Hagan 2007 was for Tim to organise the next wave of attacks so he stood back while the 6 got involved in the second phase plays until he called for the ball.

DA will have a different structure for Robson & Timmy to play under next year if they both play for the Eels. Timmy is not a hog for the ball. He was their number 1 go to man and it was expected of him and was coached that way 2005 to early 2008. This does not mean that Timmy always plays like this. You seem to overlook the fact that Timmy is a very clever player... he actually has a brain for footy and can easily adapt if given the opportunity. I think most Eels fans (critics or not) will be shocked how well Timmy will play under DA and PO.

Boooooooooooo Casper

 

[Eelementary]

I have a mate who suffers from depression (not bi-polar but not to dissimilar). He used to get angry alot and was on meds etc but apart from being moody the guy is normal, he did very well in his HSC (over 94) even thou it stopped him from studying alot, he is pretty focused at uni now (studies engineering) and he decided to stop taking the meds and he actually improved.

I believe psycological diseases are over diagnosed (and the opinnion of alot of specialist) and people then catergroise themselves believe its ok to act like that. Everyone gets upset and had mood swing but you put it behind you and move on.

Many of you may think this is a naive point of view but its the way I was brought up, my father had to deal with problems in his early adulthood that non of you here could ever imagine. He moved countries and started a new life, got married, had children and 3 of his children are at uni (the last 1 sitting his HSC now).

Timmy didnt deal with his problems well and that cost him, media speculation made it harder for him but no one forces a drink in your hand and he knew very well it was wrong after being put on an alcohol ban. He was very lucky not to have his contract ripped up even thou he never assulted anyone.

My father moved countries several times, with young children. He also suffered from a brain tumour the size of a mandarine which thank f**king God was removed (and the chemotherapy actually worked, sending him into remission). Then, not even a month later, he suffered a pulmonary embolism as a result of deep vein thrombosis - the clot spread to his lungs and nearly killed him. To top it off, a fortnight later his father passed away - on his birthday.

 

[Eelementary]

Caylo, also, its very important for every player to take full-responsibility for their roll in the team game and one of those rolls is the organiser. How many teams won the GF over the past 100 years without a chief in control, particularly the last 30 years???? What about Sterling what do you think he was doing for 80 minutes while surrounded by one of the best attacking squads in NRL history when the Eels won the GF 1981/82/83/86??????

The structures put in place by Brian Smith 2005 and Michael Hagan 2007 was for Tim to organise the next wave of attacks so he stood back while the 6 got involved in the second phase plays until he called for the ball.

DA will have a different structure for Robson & Timmy to play under next year if they both play for the Eels. Timmy is not a hog for the ball. He was their number 1 go to man and it was expected of him and was coached that way 2005 to early 2008. This does not mean that Timmy always plays like this. You seem to overlook the fact that Timmy is a very clever player... he actually has a brain for footy and can easily adapt if given the opportunity. I think most Eels fans (critics or not) will be shocked how well Timmy will play under DA and PO.

Boooooooooooo Casper

That's fine and dandy, but will he stop acting like a tool if he throws a bad pass which is dropped? That's something I never respected him for - he'd throw a hospital pass to his teammate, who'd get smashed and drop the ball and then he would have the gall to unleash his fury on them

You can label it as "competitiveness", but I prefer to see it as a big ego.

 

[Eelementary]

You say Morris had a fantastic year but then Timmy didnt. Putting it in perspective we had a brilliant backline with guys like Tahu, Hayne, Inu, Burt, Grothe and B.Smith all in good form. I would hope that Morris could have some try assist to his name, but Tim kicking game and organising skills are the most pleasing things from his 2005 year over him leading the try assists.

How would Robson and Morris go in the halves, how would Robson and Finch go in the halves? Those two would have to be the worst halves pairing I could fathom simply beause their is not point of attack. Robson fits our team and he is play wonderfully, Im not taking that away from him, Robson is doing his job and doin it very very well.

BUT without Hayne and Mortimer there I doubt he is capable of making the big plays through a game for 80min. Tim Smith had that ability and that is why it makes him a better halfback, maybe not a better fit for parramatta but a better halfback when you consider a halfbacks role.

I disagree completely.

Aside from one and three quarter good seasons where he showed any sort of form, he was pedestrian. His kicks weren't finding grass, he wasn't going for a repeat set when he should have and he was taking the wrong option in attack.

People want to talk about Robson's inability to kick - last I checked, he put in a perfectly placed and weighted kick for Mortimer's first try on Friday as he was being tackled. He's also finding the grass regularly with his kicks. Defensively he is peerless. And then there is the structure the team shows - largely due to his influence over the team.

Robson has improved in leaps in bounds. I think the big issue here is that people forget that he's played approximately 20 First Grade games his entire life, and , because he's 25, they expect him to be better than he is. He's a rookie just like Mortimer. Except older. And he's coming along nicely - at least he's shown he's a team player by throwing a bad pass and not blowing up at his mates.

 

[Raudonikis]

yeah but robsons bad passes are to morts feet so he couldnt very well blow up at anyone

 

[Gronk]

I can't believe people think that Tim Smith can slot in for Robson. Part of the reason we are going so good is our solid defence around the ruck. Robbo tackles like a backrower. Morts made 30 on Friday and never missed a beat.

Tim Smith is a SPEED HUMP in defence. Isn't he back in Oz right now undergoing another shoulder operation / post op rehab ?

Do I need to raise the grog and the black dog ?

Short memory, must have a, shooooort memory....