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God shall not be mocked

Who believes in God?

  • Yes

    Votes: 59 64.1%
  • No

    Votes: 33 35.9%

  • Total voters
    92
  • Poll closed .

1 Eyed TEZZA

Coach
Messages
12,420
The earliest references were the writings of Paul which is dated to around 60 AD. So the 2 centuries argument fails right there. Paul also makes plenty of references to the Gospels which obviously dates the gospels to earlier than 60 AD.
Josephus a Jewish historian also wrote about Jesus and Jesus is also included in the Mishna which is a Jewish account for court proceedings.
These are historical facts but many choose to ignore.

I wasnt comenting on the writings or the gospels in the Bible, but the actual bible itself.
 

eels_fan

First Grade
Messages
7,503
Christianity is a religion following the teachings of the Bible which prescribes how we should live. These teachings for example include that homosexuality is evil, if you don't believe gay people are evil then in mind you aren't Christian. I'm not saying people should express their opinion freely, but you can't call yourself Christian if you don't fully believe in the Bible

that is the most ridiculously stupid thing i've ever heard

Christianity is a belief in god. Not a belief in a book that has been translated and translated over thousands of years like a school yard game of chinese whispers.

Its imbeciles like you who believe everything you read to the enth degree that make this world so non-accepting of minorities.

Im a hetrosexual male who is in a loving relationship with a hetrosexual female, does that make me LESS evil than a homosexual male/female??

I hope and pray that one of your children turns out to be gay. Then we will see if you open your petty little mind and realise you have lived sheltered, pathetic existence, or you disown your own child. That, if anything, is a sin and non-christian action

Give yourself an uppercut

(Never thought i'd be getting in religious debate on this forum!!)
 

1 Eyed TEZZA

Coach
Messages
12,420
What do you think the Bible is made up of?

I know tha the bible is made up of writings and gospels, but they dont include all of the writings and gospels ever written, especially writings that dont describe Jesus as being more then just human. It only has writings that were decided by a few people, to be worthy. Do you get my point?
 

bartman

Immortal
Messages
41,022
You see I don't think you're Christians then. To me you are theists who are blindly following the first available religion, but then pick and choose what you want to take out of the teachings. If you don't believe in the Biblical God, why preach the Bible?

Hehe ....What an ironic response to Barty's comment about people being allowed to have their own views:sarcasm:
Glad I wasn't the only one to spot the irony there SC... maybe if 84 re-reads my post again, they might see they are illustrating the very point I was trying to make.

I'll say it again slowly... "Christianity is a broad church", meaning that there is no one "right" way of being a Christian. That's why there are upteen versions of Christianity (Catholic, Orthodox, Anglican, Methodist, Presbyterian, Baptist, Mormon, Lutheran, Evangelical, Pentecostal, Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons....) - anyone thinking their own versionof Christianity with it's own take on issues (such as whether homosexuality is a sin etc) is the "only correct way" is kind of missing the main points of it all imo.
 

N.Hindmarsh_Fan

Juniors
Messages
1,612
Wohoooo, what a thread!

I am not gonna get into the debate about creation vs evolution or science and relgion, as this is not what this thread was about in the first place.

I will say this though, there are many illinformed posters on this site, the biggest doozee was "The Bible was written 200 years after Jesus died" :lol:

Just some points i would like to mention

- I do not believe i have any moral highground, everyone is equal and i consider myself to be exactly like the next bloke!

- We should all love one another and this alone would solve most of the worlds problems, MickyD and Coach Sterling know me very very well and would tell you what sort of bloke i am

- You have a choice whether to believe in God or not, it is your decision to make and know one can make it for you

- I agree that religion should not interfere with these forums, that includes mockery and blasphemy (or is that ok?)

- I expressed an opinion and i do not want people to get worked up over it, just relax guys, God bless you all and carn you EELS!
 

stiffmeister

Bench
Messages
2,667
I'm with you brother

There is a god and I believe it 100%

Einstein once said that god is a subtle god.

Nothing came by accident as the world is too perfect.

The sun is at the right distance from the earth.

We look good ie we don't have 5 heads and 12 legs

People who believe in the big bang theory cannot answer who or what created the molecules that created the big bang.

There is a god as the world is too perfect for it to be created by accident

Who created the gases that was part of the big bang.

We are too perfect to be an accident. We breath, we think, we love. What proof do you want you aethiests? I can go on and on but I don't feel like it


Wohoooo, what a thread!

I am not gonna get into the debate about creation vs evolution or science and relgion, as this is not what this thread was about in the first place.

I will say this though, there are many illinformed posters on this site, the biggest doozee was "The Bible was written 200 years after Jesus died" :lol:

Just some points i would like to mention

- I do not believe i have any moral highground, everyone is equal and i consider myself to be exactly like the next bloke!

- We should all love one another and this alone would solve most of the worlds problems, MickyD and Coach Sterling know me very very well and would tell you what sort of bloke i am

- You have a choice whether to believe in God or not, it is your decision to make and know one can make it for you

- I agree that religion should not interfere with these forums, that includes mockery and blasphemy (or is that ok?)

- I expressed an opinion and i do not want people to get worked up over it, just relax guys, God bless you all and carn you EELS!
 
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strider

Post Whore
Messages
78,912
Just answering the actual question at hand .... No, I don't believe in God - cos God would have let Hindy win a premiership
 

stiffmeister

Bench
Messages
2,667
One more thing as I won't make further comments as I'm a busy man is some people worship the sun and not the creator of the sun.

Also another thing. God did not make us as robots. He gave us free will. Accordingly he will not go against your free will. You can be negligent and cross the road without looking left or right and get hit by a car and die. You cant blame god for this, instead blame your negligence.

Wars are not caused by god but by humans. Again if you want war you got it. Don't blame god as he won't interfere with mans free will.

Otherwise, we as may be robots.

Whatever road you choose is up to you, not god as he won't force it.

Anyway one day you will grow old and sickly and on your deathbed crying like a baby 'oh I'm going to die" I want god. Where's my god?

I rest my case.
 
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Messages
984
I am not gonna get into the debate about creation vs evolution or science and relgion, as this is not what this thread was about in the first place.

As far as I am concerned, you made an extremely bold statement saying blasphemy will continue to see premierships elude Parramatta, and then ignored any question to this statement, offering only a feeble:

"I am not gonna get into the debate . . ."

Weak as piss if you ask me.
 

stiffmeister

Bench
Messages
2,667
By Dr. Francis Collins
Special to CNN

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Editor's note: Francis S. Collins, M.D., Ph.D., is the director of the Human Genome Project. His most recent book is "The Language of God: A Scientist Presents Evidence for Belief."
ROCKVILLE, Maryland (CNN) -- I am a scientist and a believer, and I find no conflict between those world views.
As the director of the Human Genome Project, I have led a consortium of scientists to read out the 3.1 billion letters of the human genome, our own DNA instruction book. As a believer, I see DNA, the information molecule of all living things, as God's language, and the elegance and complexity of our own bodies and the rest of nature as a reflection of God's plan.
I did not always embrace these perspectives. As a graduate student in physical chemistry in the 1970s, I was an atheist, finding no reason to postulate the existence of any truths outside of mathematics, physics and chemistry. But then I went to medical school, and encountered life and death issues at the bedsides of my patients. Challenged by one of those patients, who asked "What do you believe, doctor?", I began searching for answers.
I had to admit that the science I loved so much was powerless to answer questions such as "What is the meaning of life?" "Why am I here?" "Why does mathematics work, anyway?" "If the universe had a beginning, who created it?" "Why are the physical constants in the universe so finely tuned to allow the possibility of complex life forms?" "Why do humans have a moral sense?" "What happens after we die?" (Watch Francis Collins discuss how he came to believe in God )
I had always assumed that faith was based on purely emotional and irrational arguments, and was astounded to discover, initially in the writings of the Oxford scholar C.S. Lewis and subsequently from many other sources, that one could build a very strong case for the plausibility of the existence of God on purely rational grounds. My earlier atheist's assertion that "I know there is no God" emerged as the least defensible. As the British writer G.K. Chesterton famously remarked, "Atheism is the most daring of all dogmas, for it is the assertion of a universal negative."
But reason alone cannot prove the existence of God. Faith is reason plus revelation, and the revelation part requires one to think with the spirit as well as with the mind. You have to hear the music, not just read the notes on the page. Ultimately, a leap of faith is required.
For me, that leap came in my 27th year, after a search to learn more about God's character led me to the person of Jesus Christ. Here was a person with remarkably strong historical evidence of his life, who made astounding statements about loving your neighbor, and whose claims about being God's son seemed to demand a decision about whether he was deluded or the real thing. After resisting for nearly two years, I found it impossible to go on living in such a state of uncertainty, and I became a follower of Jesus.
So, some have asked, doesn't your brain explode? Can you both pursue an understanding of how life works using the tools of genetics and molecular biology, and worship a creator God? Aren't evolution and faith in God incompatible? Can a scientist believe in miracles like the resurrection?
Actually, I find no conflict here, and neither apparently do the 40 percent of working scientists who claim to be believers. Yes, evolution by descent from a common ancestor is clearly true. If there was any lingering doubt about the evidence from the fossil record, the study of DNA provides the strongest possible proof of our relatedness to all other living things.
But why couldn't this be God's plan for creation? True, this is incompatible with an ultra-literal interpretation of Genesis, but long before Darwin, there were many thoughtful interpreters like St. Augustine, who found it impossible to be exactly sure what the meaning of that amazing creation story was supposed to be. So attaching oneself to such literal interpretations in the face of compelling scientific evidence pointing to the ancient age of Earth and the relatedness of living things by evolution seems neither wise nor necessary for the believer.
I have found there is a wonderful harmony in the complementary truths of science and faith. The God of the Bible is also the God of the genome. God can be found in the cathedral or in the laboratory. By investigating God's majestic and awesome creation, science can actually be a means of worship.
What is your take on this commentary? E-mail us
The opinions expressed in this commentary are those of the writer. This is part of an occasional series of commentaries on CNN.com that offers a broad range of perspectives, thoughts and points of view.
Your responses

CNN.com asked readers for their thoughts on this commentary. We received a lot of excellent responses. Below you will find a small selection of those e-mails, some of which have been edited for length and spelling.
Lorri Carlson, Prescott, Arizona
I am greatly encouraged to read about Dr. Francis Collins' intellectual and spiritual perspective. It is positively refreshing. A thinking person who recognizes the complementary relationship of faith in Jesus Christ and science! Thank you so much for making this article available.
Alan Goldstein, Powder Springs, Georgia
As is typical of believers, Collins was looking for answers, and when he didn't find them (or more likely didn't care for the answers he found), he turned to superstition. For example, what is the meaning of life? Science would say "Life has no meaning, other than the meaning we give to it." I think this is a wonderful answer, and immensely preferable to, life exists because god was bored. And that our sole purpose for existence is to please god enough, so that we may enter heaven and sing his praises for all eternity.
Hyukwoo Shin, Del Mar, California
It is no surprise to me that an accomplished scientist like Dr. Collins is a faithful believer because he asked himself the right questions. I see so many times atheists in science asking the wrong questions: "Can you prove that the bible is true or that God does exist?" The right questions are pointed out in this article: "What is the meaning of life?" "Why am I here?"
James Lampert, Fountain Valley, California
The best case of all for the existence of a supreme being is in the very laws of physics: the fact that physics HAS laws, and that those laws are knowable, internally consistent, and elegant.
Barbara Liang, Appleton, Wisconsin
Dr. Collins stated that in his late 20s he made a leap of faith and embraced the Christian teachings because he could no longer live with "uncertainties." An emotional quest for certainty and tranquility, no matter how beneficial to the individual, does not a factual system make. I am glad that Dr. Collins has the comfort of his beliefs, but his reasoning does not sound very scientific.
James Hastings, Franklin, Pennsylvania
Thanks for publishing this point of view. I don't agree with the author, but it was refreshing to read commentary that was different from the conventional wisdom published ad nauseum. Maybe this sort of writing should appear more often than "occasionally."
John Borland, Waukegan, Illinois
I am with Dr. Collins until he broaches the subject of Jesus. He poses questions about whether it is possible to reconcile Jesus' divinity with science, but he avoids answering them by devoting the remainder of the piece to evolution and the age of the earth. It seems to me that believing in Jesus, or any other divine prophet, requires an egocentric view of creation that goes far above and beyond Dr. Collins' argument for belief in God. To casually insert a reference to Jesus in this piece without addressing that issue seems to me to be an obvious attempt to blur the distinction. It makes the piece seem more like an advertisement for Christianity than a thoughtful discussion of spirituality.
Suzanne Spinelli, Middlebury, Connecticut
I agree with the scientist in the report, however, why is it only Judeo/Christian creation myth that can be 'real.' There are many different creation myths from the past until the present. I think it is offensive to negate all those other myths for the "one true 'real'" myth (depending on one's point of view). After all, who is to say which one is right? Could it be that they are all right in their own way?
Mara Alexander, Alexandria, Virginia
With a Ph.D. in the social sciences, I'd find it more surprising that scientists don't believe in a god or organizing principle of some sort. What we pursue is "truth," with the underlying belief that there is order in the universe if only we can discover it. I don't know that I especially believe in a berobed deity sitting up in Heaven, or in a literal version of the Bible, but I certainly do believe in a higher power of some sort.
 

ElectricEel

Juniors
Messages
352
I posted on one of the other threads and stated that mocking Jesus is not going to do the club any favours, I stick by my post.

I am a Christian and many of you are not and that is fine with me, but i will honestly tell you that as long as the members on these forums continue to mock Jesus, parra fans will be dissapoiinted year in and year out.

I believe this to be true and although most will disagree, if we make the final next year and this kind of blaphemy persists, we will lose again.

I am not going to be the forums most popular bloke after posting this, but that really does not bother me, so fire away.

Thanks

So, what about the Storm fans who no doubt at some stage would have blasphemed?


Please explain this!
 
Messages
11,677
If you think god would control a football teams fortunes because they have a fan who used to go by the name jesus you have a very poor understanding of your own religion.

So true. Most Christians actually have almost ZERO understanding of their religion. It is why I stopped attending Church and chose to follow my own spiritual path.

Jesus, evil, where doe sit say that? You are quoting Jewish law.

Christ was a Jew.

Anyways, here's the deal NHF:

If Christ had the choice between having a beer with myself or yourself, he'd be sitting down with me, and he'd be doing it because you're a f**ktard and I'm a tops bloke.

Actually, if Christ did return he'd probably be spending his time raining hellfire down upon the earth. Trust me, you wouldn't be spared.

You are a clueless idiot who has absolutely zero understanding of the reality of Jesus Christ. In that respect you are a perfect Christian.

Your opinion means JACK SQUAT. Funnily enough, when this whole thing first started a decade ago I made sure to contact a few people who have a real understanding of Christianity and they assured me it was all sweet.

Take your blinkers and run off to Church, little boy.
 

stiffmeister

Bench
Messages
2,667
[SIZE=+2][/SIZE][SIZE=-1]There you are cry babies, deleted

Go suck on your thumbs
[/SIZE]
 
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Messages
11,677
By the way, I voted Yes.

However, it's a very limiting poll. I'm guessing that most people would assume that a Yes vote automatically implies a Yes vote for Christianity. In my case it does not.

Just wanted to make that clear.
 
Messages
984
Please delete Stiffmeister's above post.

It is offensive, in the fact that it is agenda pushing and commercial.

Go find an evangelical forum if you want to peddle that sh*t.
 
Messages
11,677
Oh, let's not forget that "Thou shall not use the Lord's name in vain" is no longer a Commandment and is therefore no longer blasphemous.

Remember how Christ said that there is now only one Commandment? And how basically his coming was the New Covenant which automatically made the Old Covenant no longer valid?
 

Snoochies

First Grade
Messages
5,633
I am intrigued by peoples opinions of Moral Absolutes? Who or what defiones good and evil, do good and evil actually exist? Where did morals come from?
This is pointed more directly to those who don't believe in God as I am pretty sure I know the answer from those that do believe in God.
Any evidence to back up your claims would be great too.

n.b. This is not a question about tricking people or proving one persons view is better than another, am really intrigued.

Cheers.
 

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