"It’s very realistic to say that we’ll have a second team in Brisbane in 2023": V'landys

[flippikat]

Jets will probably cannibalise the Broncos more than Dolphins. Ipswich has plenty of Broncos fans.

Firehawks will probably cannibalise Broncos and Titans, as Logan has Broncos fans in most of its suburbs and Titans fans in the southern that became part or Logan in 2007. I see a lot of Cowboys fans in Logan. Whenever NRL merchandise is sold in shops of Logan's northern suburbs the two hottest selling teams are Broncos and Cowboys.

Dolphins could be the safe bet for the Broncos and Titans, but they would be more successful playing their games in Moreton Bay, which they cannot do because there's no suitable stadium in the region.

To be honest, there seems to be a feeling out there that the NRL has chosen it's preferred bid already - the Dolphins, because of it's minimal impact on Broncos & Titans, with the NRL cutting them a deal where they play at Suncorp until they get their own stadium up to standard.

It's kinda sad that factor could drive the decision, because a Dolphins bid seems far more likely to drift towards the fringe of the city (more and more home games on the outskirts) than the other two.. which would be ok if they were the 3rd Brisbane team, but not ideal for a 2nd Brisbane team.

[Edit] One more thing.. it's a bit silly to worry about a 2nd Brisbane team cannibalising Broncos supporter base, when the Broncos have been doing a great job the last few years turning their own fans off them..

 

[MugaB]

To be honest, there seems to be a feeling out there that the NRL has chosen it's preferred bid already - the Dolphins, because of it's minimal impact on Broncos & Titans, with the NRL cutting them a deal where they play at Suncorp until they get their own stadium up to standard.

It's kinda sad that factor could drive the decision, because a Dolphins bid seems far more likely to drift towards the fringe of the city (more and more home games on the outskirts) than the other two.. which would be ok if they were the 3rd Brisbane team, but not ideal for a 2nd Brisbane team.

[Edit] One more thing.. it's a bit silly to worry about a 2nd Brisbane team cannibalising Broncos supporter base, when the Broncos have been doing a great job the last few years turning their own fans off them..

Not like you can't bring in the firehawks or jets later on to be a permanent city/suncorp tenant, after dolphins move north, so if anything its a great way to bolster a supporter base in Brisbane city before shifting outwards some half decade later if stadium upgrades in qld get the nod, then repeat the process in the other direction, had it been in reverse maybe not the way to go to start as a moreton bay or ipswich club, then moving to suncorp. Starting with the firehawks doesn't seem like a good way to branch out around the city, if there is an appetite for more clubs there

 

[flippikat]

Not like you can't bring in the firehawks or jets later on to be a permanent city/suncorp tenant, after dolphins move north, so if anything its a great way to bolster a supporter base in Brisbane city before shifting outwards some half decade later if stadium upgrades in qld get the nod, then repeat the process in the other direction, had it been in reverse maybe not the way to go to start as a moreton bay or ipswich club, then moving to suncorp. Starting with the firehawks doesn't seem like a good way to branch out around the city, if there is an appetite for more clubs there

I think what you're describing could be what the NRL is looking at - starting a 2nd Brisbane team with most home games at Suncorp (and a couple of lower-pulling games out at their traditional home base) - then once their own stadium is up to spec, flipping that ratio & having most games at their traditional home - with only the blockbuster games (Queensland derbies, games against top of the table sides)

That could see a pathway for the Dolphins & Jets to be Brisbane 2 & 3.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Firehawks and Dolphins would be a good addition. I'd go with Firehawks in 2023 due to their location and catchment in eastern suburbs and Logan through the Easts Tigers, who've been around since 1930s. Add Dolphins in 10 years time, provided a 25k stadium is built for them in Moreton Bay. Their brand is strong and dates back to the 1940s.

Easts (Firehawks) don't have anything to do with South Brisbane and Logan though. They are an Inner East Brisbane club.

It's kind of irrelevant though as
- the new club will be call the Brisbane somethings
- they will be playing out of Suncorp
- no bid would be trying to draw their entire following from their traditional Q Cup supporter base
- future generations of kids (which is what this is all about) won't care where the Dolphins, Jets or Tigers traditionally played or represented, they will see a big club representing Brisbane, playing out of Suncorp in the National league.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Not like you can't bring in the firehawks or jets later on to be a permanent city/suncorp tenant, after dolphins move north, so if anything its a great way to bolster a supporter base in Brisbane city before shifting outwards some half decade later if stadium upgrades in qld get the nod, then repeat the process in the other direction, had it been in reverse maybe not the way to go to start as a moreton bay or ipswich club, then moving to suncorp. Starting with the firehawks doesn't seem like a good way to branch out around the city, if there is an appetite for more clubs there

I think what you're describing could be what the NRL is looking at - starting a 2nd Brisbane team with most home games at Suncorp (and a couple of lower-pulling games out at their traditional home base) - then once their own stadium is up to spec, flipping that ratio & having most games at their traditional home - with only the blockbuster games (Queensland derbies, games against top of the table sides)

That could see a pathway for the Dolphins & Jets to be Brisbane 2 & 3.

This is an interesting take and could very well be the direction that is taken. Redcliffe (North), Broncos (City), Ipswich (West) and Gold Coast (South) is a good spread in South-East QLD by around 2050. Add the Cowboys and QLD is sorted.

 

[flippikat]

This is an interesting take and could very well be the direction that is taken. Redcliffe (North), Broncos (City), Ipswich (West) and Gold Coast (South) is a good spread in South-East QLD by around 2050. Add the Cowboys and QLD is sorted.

The positive is that it gives Brisbane 2 & then Brisbane 3 a chance to win fans city-wide in their first few seasons, and those fans could stick once they take more games back to their spiritual home - especially if the big games are still at Suncorp.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Easts (Firehawks) don't have anything to do with South Brisbane and Logan though. They are an Inner East Brisbane club.

It's kind of irrelevant though as
- the new club will be call the Brisbane somethings
- they will be playing out of Suncorp
- no bid would be trying to draw their entire following from their traditional Q Cup supporter base
- future generations of kids (which is what this is all about) won't care where the Dolphins, Jets or Tigers traditionally played or represented, they will see a big club representing Brisbane, playing out of Suncorp in the National league.

They have junior clubs in Rochedale South/Preistdale, Springwood, Flagstone and one proposed for Yarrabilba.

 

[MugaB]

They have junior clubs in Rochedale South/Preistdale, Springwood, Flagstone and one proposed for Yarrabilba.

So? Roosters have junior clubs in central coast, penrith have many clubs spread west of bathurst, none of that matters, what soes matter is that the general public knows that there's a 2nd brisbane team, then if they move west or north or south in this case then so be it, but Suncorp is the home ground regardless of who they represent

 

[mongoose]

This is an interesting take and could very well be the direction that is taken. Redcliffe (North), Broncos (City), Ipswich (West) and Gold Coast (South) is a good spread in South-East QLD by around 2050. Add the Cowboys and QLD is sorted.

I still like the idea of Sunshine Coast down the track. Very fast growing region and the support would be as strong as north QLD.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

So? Roosters have junior clubs in central coast, penrith have many clubs spread west of bathurst, none of that matters, what soes matter is that the general public knows that there's a 2nd brisbane team, then if they move west or north or south in this case then so be it, but Suncorp is the home ground regardless of who they represent

Logan is a fast growing city and situated between Brisbane and Gold Coast. If you want to travel to Gold Coast from Brisbane or vice versa, which thousands of people do each day for work, then it's in the ideal location for Brisbane 2 to market itself through roadside banners on the motorway and main streets. Plenty of people from Brisbane and Gold Coast also work in Logan.

Easts Tigers are the only club that has ties with Logan, and it stretches back decades through the Rochedale Tigers and Springwood Tigers. It's also the only bid that's located south-east of the CBD, which is a booming area with high rises going up everyday and under attack from AwFuL. It's also close enough to Lang Park to draw a reasonable amount of spectators on a Thursday or Friday night.

A strong team representing south-east Brisbane and Logan will provide good rivalries with the Broncos and Titans, with fans able to travel to Lang Park and Robina Stadium. It's hard to do that with Dolphins and Jets.

Dolphins would be more successful as a regional club representing Moreton Bay, but they need a stadium in Moreton Bay to do that and enter the competition after Brisbane 2 has bedded itself down as a strong team solidifying Brisbane.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

I still like the idea of Sunshine Coast down the track. Very fast growing region and the support would be as strong as north QLD.

If Redcliffe want to create an instant rivalry with Gold Coast, one that really gets underneath the skin of locals, they should rebrand their NRL bid as the Sunshine Coast Dolphins.

Titans wanted to be the Dolphins before Redcliffe took legal action.

 

[Perth Red]

Crushers drew crowds because they were neutral start up attracting from the whole brisbane region. It sounds to me like whichever of the three bids wins is going to have limited geographical appeal to a relatively limited area? That’s probably going to make it very hard to draw the 20k plus a Brisbane2 club should be drawing.

 

[flippikat]

Crushers drew crowds because they were neutral start up attracting from the whole brisbane region. It sounds to me like whichever of the three bids wins is going to have limited geographical appeal to a relatively limited area? That’s probably going to make it very hard to draw the 20k plus a Brisbane2 club should be drawing.

Given how the Tigers are sinking on the field, and their nomadic nature, maybe the NRL should demote them to NSW Cup and promote Brisbane Tigers into the competition (still 16 teams, no need for them to do that clunky Firehawks rebrand), then add Redcliffe & NZ 2? *shrugs*

 

[Perth Red]

Given how the Tigers are sinking on the field, and their nomadic nature, maybe the NRL should demote them to NSW Cup and promote Brisbane Tigers into the competition (still 16 teams, no need for them to do that clunky Firehawks rebrand), then add Redcliffe & NZ 2? *shrugs*

If we are going to add more clubs from existing heartlands we don’t want clubs that struggle to draw 13k. Only a club that appeals to the whole of brisbane is going to get an active fanbase of 20k plus. If we wants sydneys suburban problems replicated in brisbane then yours sounds a good way to go about it,

 

[flippikat]

If we are going to add more clubs from existing heartlands we don’t want clubs that struggle to draw 13k. Only a club that appeals to the whole of brisbane is going to get an active fanbase of 20k plus. If we wants sydneys suburban problems replicated in brisbane then yours sounds a good way to go about it,

Fair point, however all 3 remaining "Brisbane 2" bids have suburban/Queensland Cup side roots, with the Firehawks just leaning more towards a "whole of city" approach due to their origins being in a central location, and their brand-change to avoid a collision with Wests Tigers.

The only bid that was completely suburb-neutral ended up merging with the Jets bid, amid tons of feedback that their brand was plastic, and their proposed club had no roots.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

If we are going to add more clubs from existing heartlands we don’t want clubs that struggle to draw 13k. Only a club that appeals to the whole of brisbane is going to get an active fanbase of 20k plus. If we wants sydneys suburban problems replicated in brisbane then yours sounds a good way to go about it,

I don't think the ARLC gives a stuff if Brisbane 2 averages more than 13k. All they care about is the value it provides to the broadcasters so we can get more money when the rights are up for grabs.

 

[Perth Red]

I don't think the ARLC gives a stuff if Brisbane 2 averages more than 13k. All they care about is the value it provides to the broadcasters so we can get more money when the rights are up for grabs.

They will when the club cant break even and gets in financial strife due to a ltd fanbase.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

They will when the club cant break even and gets in financial strife due to a ltd fanbase.

Leagues Club will be there to keep it in the black during its formulative years. Hopefully Firehawks are given the licence. Theyy're the most likely of the three bids to generate a strong supporter base in the City of Brisbane, especially in the southern/eastern suburbs which is where most people live.

 

[Perth Red]

Leagues Club will be there to keep it in the black during its formulative years. Hopefully Firehawks are given the licence. Theyy're the most likely of the three bids to generate a strong supporter base in the City of Brisbane, especially in the southern/eastern suburbs which is where most people live.

That depends on how much money the LC is making in PROFIT. Sharks, Dragons et al will tell you having a LC isnt any sort of guarantee that you've got millions is spare cash lying around. Souths and Storm got rid of theirs to concentrate on non LC revenue growth which has made them profitable.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

That depends on how much money the LC is making in PROFIT. Sharks, Dragons et al will tell you having a LC isnt any sort of guarantee that you've got millions is spare cash lying around. Souths and Storm got rid of theirs to concentrate on non LC revenue growth which has made them profitable.

Rabbitohs and Storm are owned by strong figures who have connections with the big end of town.

We'll have to wait five or ten years after Brisbane 2 enters the competition to know how viable they will be in the long-term. There's no guarantee that the new club will pull 20k from day one, or
ever, regardless of whether it's in the middle of a heartland city with a neutral brand or based in the other suburbs.

The norm for professional RL-RU clubs around the world is to average well under 20k.