"It’s very realistic to say that we’ll have a second team in Brisbane in 2023": V'landys

[Jim Rockford]

What a surprise PR. Your alt likes your post yet again.

 

[flippikat]

the tension between a Sydney suburban comp and creating a national one has been there since the arl formed and started to look at making space in the mid 80’s. It’s evolution.

That's the crux of the issue here.

What we have is an "in between" structure - more than the old suburban model, but less than a full national (indeed full trans-Tasman) competition.

We've been stuck in a transitional stage since 1982!

I actually think the solution might just be to expand to 20+ teams and let attrition work it's way through any over-saturated markets, as you suggested.

It's a horribly chaotic & ad hoc way to get there, but in the absence of any will to make a planned transition I guess that's all we can reasonably expect.

 

[Jim Rockford]

It's fascinating watching this mentally unhinged loser have a conversation with himself.

 

[flippikat]

It's fascinating watching this mentally unhinged loser have a conversation with himself.

Hehehehe.. I'm rather bemused how you've flown past trying to construct a logical argument to defend your worldview.. past personal abuse.. and into some bizarro conspiracy theory that @Perth Red and myself are the same person!

It's almost as if you can't believe that two league fans (one in Perth, one in Wellington) can't share the same view that the competition needs serious restructuring.

Well, believe it. We're part of the world of league fandom that exists outside NSW & Queensland - and we're pretty frustrated at being little more than an afterthought.

 

[Jim Rockford]

What I find hilarious is that I thought you were like your cowardly friend PR hiding behind the Ignore Function. Seems like you are a lot more worried about what I think than you are prepared to admit.

 

[flippikat]

What I find hilarious is that I thought you were like your cowardly friend PR hiding behind the Ignore Function. Seems like you are a lot more worried about what I think than you are prepared to admit.

Hiding? No, just tired of arguing with you when it just ended in abuse.

I unblocked you when I realised it just meant huge holes in the conversation.. making it damn hard to keep track of things.

 

[Jim Rockford]

Hiding? No, just tired of arguing with you when it just ended in abuse.

I unblocked you when I realised it just meant huge holes in the conversation.. making it damn hard to keep track of things.

Well if that version of reality makes you feel better then stick with it. It will line up with your skewed view on how the game should be.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

That's the crux of the issue here.

What we have is an "in between" structure - more than the old suburban model, but less than a full national (indeed full trans-Tasman) competition.

We've been stuck in a transitional stage since 1982!

I actually think the solution might just be to expand to 20+ teams and let attrition work it's way through any over-saturated markets, as you suggested.

It's a horribly chaotic & ad hoc way to get there, but in the absence of any will to make a planned transition I guess that's all we can reasonably expect.

If only the original Superleague vision got up with the ARL running the game and the SL creating four or five Sydney Super franchises to replace the traditional brands (that would live on in the NSWRL). I know the immediate objection to this, tradition... tribalism etc. But I honesly think 24 years on that we would have 5 big Sydney clubs playing at the big stadiums and a thriving relatively well attended NSWRL (think Newtown Jest and Shute Shield rivalry games) played at the traditional grounds.

This way we could have super clubs AND tradition & tribalism, just not in the same comp like we are trying to do now.

 

[flippikat]

If only the original Superleague vision got up with the ARL running the game and the SL creating four or five Sydney Super franchises to replace the traditional brands (that would live on in the NSWRL). I know the immediate objection to this, tradition... tribalism etc. But I honesly think 24 years on that we would have 5 big Sydney clubs playing at the big stadiums and a thriving relatively well attended NSWRL (think Newtown Jest and Shute Shield rivalry games) played at the traditional grounds.

This way we could have super clubs AND tradition & tribalism, just not in the same comp like we are trying to do now.

I think that's exactly what should have happened. Traditional Sydney clubs being shareholders in new teams - with the new teams being self-governing in themselves (ie no boardroom factions between the different shareholder clubs just causing strife like we've seen with joint ventures in the last two decades).

Silent partners, if you will - with all the ex-NSWRL clubs in the 2nd tier NSW Cup - a traditional competition, well funded & covered in the media.

Brisbane had to subsume their traditional clubs into a 2nd tier when the Broncos kicked-off, and Auckland with the Warriors (although NZ was always very much a poor cousin), so why not Sydney?

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Promotion & relegation is based on on field performance. The commercial factors & whatever else you mention are irrelevant - I think you like arguing.

I've given you two examples. You can find more if you care to look

The teams with the richest owners would sign the best players, coaches and have the best training facilities to keep them in the EPL. If there's only 6 teams in London and 14 outside of it, despite London being England's largest city by a mile, then there isn't enough money and fans to support 7 or more.

Does the EPL have a salary cap?

 

[Perth Red]

Hiding? No, just tired of arguing with you when it just ended in abuse.

I unblocked you when I realised it just meant huge holes in the conversation.. making it damn hard to keep track of things.

i often wonder if posters like jim are as abusive and unpleasant in real life, of if the anonymity of the internet gives them a sense of bravery they don’t have in real life? I’ve got him on ignore as he contributes nothing to a discussion. ignore is the forum version of moving away from the bar when you end up sat next to an obnoxious loud mouth.

 

[Jim Rockford]

i often wonder if posters like jim are as abusive and unpleasant in real life, of if the anonymity of the internet gives them a sense of bravery they don’t have in real life? I’ve got him on ignore as he contributes nothing to a discussion. ignore is the forum version of moving away from the bar when you end up sat next to an obnoxious loud mouth.

No little boy. I'm totally reasonable until I encounter pathetic little losers like you and your buddy flippikat. You had better believe that if we were standing face to face I would have no problem at all telling you what a worthless piece of shit you are.

 

[Pippen94]

If only the original Superleague vision got up with the ARL running the game and the SL creating four or five Sydney Super franchises to replace the traditional brands (that would live on in the NSWRL). I know the immediate objection to this, tradition... tribalism etc. But I honesly think 24 years on that we would have 5 big Sydney clubs playing at the big stadiums and a thriving relatively well attended NSWRL (think Newtown Jest and Shute Shield rivalry games) played at the traditional grounds.

This way we could have super clubs AND tradition & tribalism, just not in the same comp like we are trying to do now.

Game would be dead without well established Sydney teams. You know super league failed don't you?!

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Game would be dead without well established Sydney teams. You know super league failed don't you?!

Super League drew higher attendances than ARL.

 

[Pippen94]

The teams with the richest owners would sign the best players, coaches and have the best training facilities to keep them in the EPL. If there's only 6 teams in London and 14 outside of it, despite London being England's largest city by a mile, then there isn't enough money and fans to support 7 or more.

Does the EPL have a salary cap?

You're drawing conclusion on something you know very little about & looking at premier league through NRL lens or whatever ur thinking.
London has many pro teams. Just because some aren't in top division doesn't mean they don't have a fanbase or lack coin. Fulham & QPR are owned by billionaires!!
Nature of p/r means some clubs go up or down but it's not a Darwinian example of optimum number of clubs from one city. To many factors at play to determine that.

 

[Pippen94]

Super League drew higher attendances than ARL.

& ARL had all clubs the biggest rugby league market wanted to see. ARL wins

 

[The Mad Hatter]

It's fascinating watching this mentally unhinged loser have a conversation with himself.

I don’t always agree with PR but for the 10 years I’ve been here, he’s made a lot of good observations and doesn’t deserve to be derided tbh.

 

[flippikat]

& ARL had all clubs the biggest rugby league market wanted to see. ARL wins

That's a subjective opinion being used to counter an objective FACT.
Superleague had bigger crowds.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

& ARL had all clubs the biggest rugby league market wanted to see. ARL wins

Then how come their attendances were shit?

 

[MugaB]

Game would be dead without well established Sydney teams. You know super league failed don't you?!

My team went to superleague, and im grateful they did, if not for them maybe there is no team far out west of sydney, and we'd be as fkd as north sydney are, and there is a majority of reasons why Sydney won't expand in NSW ever again, im also glad that the warriors, cowboys and somewhat reds did also too, as they are places that RL needs to be at top flight, had they not gone to SL they'd all be where the crushers and chargers were, and unfortunately the reds didn't last, but in hindsight dropping perth and bris2 wasn't the way to go, as we now in the next decade will be finally back to expanding there again.
Personally im not an advocate for rationalization, but since its happened, we've only gone backwards up until now, if anything we need to expand moreso, get upto 20 clubs, then see if there's any need for NSWRL clubs to rationalize to further expand or relocate, i feel there's a good spread of teams in Sydney, but a need to move a few permanently in better locations of future growth, like tigers in Campbelltown/Liverpool and Roosters North of the Bridge, atleast in terms of public fan days, weekly training and junior catchments, being in concord and bondi doesn't serve the greater sydney area, like the other sydney clubs do, besides "souths" is basically the city.
Even after we get to 20 clubs, with maybe SEQ3, SEQ4, Cairns-PNG, and NZ2, i can see 2 teams from sydney like tigers or roosters for example taking up lucrative opportunities in Wa & Sa, but not now and not until we get to 20 teams and a better finances that aren't soley reliant on broadcast money, the foundation clubs need to stand, they are the draw cards of the competition, and all current clubs need to stand as they are the brands of the NRL, but WHERE they stand is another question entirely, im all for expansion, and a few relocales but only if the club itself wants to thru necessity, but no mergers or rationalization