Jack DeBelin

[The Silverdale Phantom]

What exactly are you on about with this " Japs" calming down comment ?

There's a thread for the coronavirus mate.

Well they are keen on their olympics.

My point was that jdb should still be doing his charity work despite his awful and what I think is his unfair and unjust treatment by the nrl.

 

[Timmay]

Plenty of Prima Facie cases bite the dust at trial.

We wouldn’t even have a court process if the cops were always right.

No shit Sherlock.

But your opinion about the NFSD being a "dog of a rule" is laughable - it was an airtight Judgement

If the Man Bun didn't like it he could've gone and had a cry and appealed to the Full Court of the Federal Court of Australia - but he didn't.

Regarding the Man Bun's crim charges, I mean c'mon, get real fella - he's drawn Haesler for f**ks sake. The only better draw in the land you could get would be Yehia (i.e., the best Judge in the State).

Jack's doing better than a lot of others (before all the Courts) - no sympathy here.

 

[The Silverdale Phantom]

Here is the official stats from boscar:


A bit out of date, but the fresh figures are similar.

So in all courts, the success rate of proving guilt is about 79%.

That leaves 21% or more than 1 in 5 found not guilty of the charge as alleged. These defendants were found to be innocent and should never have been charged.

That’s a significant figure and all things being equal, suggests to me at least that cops etc are making far too many errors.

And at the moment, we do not know where jdb sits in these stats and we should keep an open mind.

What we do know is that the nrl is finding fault by apportioning blame and instituting a penalty when it seems to me, there is no sound basis.

There is no evidence the policy is helping women in any way or changing behaviours.

 

[muzby]

Just when I thought it wasn’t possible you couldn’t be any thicker, you go and prove me wrong..

Bravo..

 

[st penguin]

Interesting thought, that it takes a man or a woman for that matter, to be swept along with the sentiment in the public arena to know how to treat women, or people in general.

I understand what you're saying though.

True, but I think it's overall a good thing how much things are improving.

On a slightly different note, I saw Back to the Future the other day. Holy shit...Marty's dad stalking Marty's future mum. Marty's plan to grope his mum, so his Dad can save the day. It's f**ked up. And that was a family movie! Things have changed.

 

[The Silverdale Phantom]

Just when I thought it wasn’t possible you couldn’t be any thicker, you go and prove me wrong..

Bravo..

I think we have a common ancestor somewhere along the line muzmeister.

 

[muzby]

I think we have a common ancestor somewhere along the line muzmeister.

I hope not..

 

[TruSaint]

Well they are keen on their olympics.

and ? so f**king what ?

You have a problem with the JOC ? Stay on thread mate.

 

[st penguin]

Here is the official stats from boscar:

View attachment 36336
A bit out of date, but the fresh figures are similar.

So in all courts, the success rate of proving guilt is about 79%.

That leaves 21% or more than 1 in 5 found not guilty of the charge as alleged. These defendants were found to be innocent and should never have been charged.

That’s a significant figure and all things being equal, suggests to me at least that cops etc are making far too many errors.

And at the moment, we do not know where jdb sits in these stats and we should keep an open mind.

What we do know is that the nrl is finding fault by apportioning blame and instituting a penalty when it seems to me, there is no sound basis.

There is no evidence the policy is helping women in any way or changing behaviours.

So, a few things:

1. Not guilty is not the same as "proven innocent". There might be a tonne of evidence against the defendant, but the jury is only 98% convinced.
2. Just because the defendant is found not guilty does not mean they should not have been charged. The prima facie evidence is assessed at the committal trial, but during the trial there might be further evidence or witnesses that will change the outcome.
3. I don't know if there is an ideal conviction rate. I mean, look at Japan or Russia, both have crazy high conviction rates - that's not necessarily a good thing!

 

[The Silverdale Phantom]

So, a few things:

1. Not guilty is not the same as "proven innocent". There might be a tonne of evidence against the defendant, but the jury is only 98% convinced.
2. Just because the defendant is found not guilty does not mean they should not have been charged. The prima facie evidence is assessed at the committal trial, but during the trial there might be further evidence or witnesses that will change the outcome.
3. I don't know if there is an ideal conviction rate. I mean, look at Japan or Russia, both have crazy high conviction rates - that's not necessarily a good thing!

I disagree, if the charge fails, you are considered to be entirely innocent of that charge. There’s no proportionally based guilt or innocence. You walk!

 

[The Silverdale Phantom]

and ? so f**king what ?

You have a problem with the JOC ? Stay on thread mate.

I’m trying but you keep abusing me as does muzby.

Both of you need to get a room.

Otherwise, leave me alone and stay on topic yourself.

 

[Timmay]

That leaves 21% or more than 1 in 5 found not guilty of the charge as alleged.

Aaaaaaand that's why we have criminal defence lawyers.

Clap clap for the handicapped - thanks for playing fella.

 

[TruSaint]

I’m trying but you keep abusing me as does muzby.

Both of you need to get a room.

Otherwise, leave me alone and stay on topic yourself.

stop talking shite and I will.

 

[TruSaint]

I disagree, if the charge fails, you are considered to be entirely innocent of that charge. There’s no proportionally based guilt or innocence. You walk!

Nope.

Innocent means that you did not commit the crime. Not Guilty means that there was not sufficient evidence to determine that you did commit the crime.

 

[The Silverdale Phantom]

Nope.

Innocent means that you did not commit the crime. Not Guilty means that there was not sufficient evidence to determine that you did commit the crime.

That’s not in any legal book or legislation in nsw. If it is, then post it here you flip......and stay on topic.

If you paid for that legal education, you need to ask 7/11 for your money back.

ps ( from a dictionary):

 

[Timmay]

That’s not in any legal book or legislation in nsw. If it is, then post it here you flip......and stay on topic.

ps ( from a dictionary):

View attachment 36346

Christ all f**king mighty, fella. Were you born this stupid or did you work hard at it?

A f**king dictionary is not a legal dictionary lol.

The LexisNexis Concise Australian Legal Dictionary (LexisNexis Butterworths, 5th edition, 2014), at page 329, defines 'innocent' as "[f]ree from guilt or wrongdoing. 'Innocent' is not synonymous with 'not guilty'; a jury may not be convinced that the accused is guilty beyond reasonable doubt, yet not be convinced of his or her innocence. However, the presumption of innocence tends to blur the distinction between the two."

If you're a poor person (which I think you are) and you cannot afford to purchase the above legal dictionary because you are poor and have no money, feel free to read the extracts from the High Court of Australia judgement in Bartho v The Queen (1978) 19 ALR 418; 52 ALJR 520, here. Bartho is the authority, to this day, on innocent =/= not guilty.

You need to smarten up...

 

[blue bags]

You’re still saying that someone deserves special treatment because they can play football.

He’s not remanded in custody, along with being able to train ready to head back on the field at any minute.
.

any person is free to train, fitness, even prisoners train, even prisoners on death row, Guantanamo bay terrorist prisoners train

 

[muzby]

any person is free to train, fitness, even prisoners train, even prisoners on death row, Guantanamo bay terrorist prisoners train

Indeed they are.. I’m not sure the equipment & systems the average Joe has access to is as good as a professional sporting team..

Relatively sure the systems and equipment in the prison system, inc Guantanamo, wouldn’t be as good either..

 

[The Silverdale Phantom]

Christ all f**king mighty, fella. Were you born this stupid or did you work hard at it?

A f**king dictionary is not a legal dictionary lol.

The LexisNexis Concise Australian Legal Dictionary (LexisNexis Butterworths, 5th edition, 2014), at page 329, defines 'innocent' as "[f]ree from guilt or wrongdoing. 'Innocent' is not synonymous with 'not guilty'; a jury may not be convinced that the accused is guilty beyond reasonable doubt, yet not be convinced of his or her innocence. However, the presumption of innocence tends to blur the distinction between the two."

If you're a poor person (which I think you are) and you cannot afford to purchase the above legal dictionary because you are poor and have no money, feel free to read the extracts from the High Court of Australia judgement in Bartho v The Queen (1978) 19 ALR 418; 52 ALJR 520, here. Bartho is the authority, to this day, on innocent =/= not guilty.

You need to smarten up...

Before you make your submissions in the future, you’d better check this decision dingbat.


And that’s straight from the book the judges rely upon. Check it out yourself.

Mmmm...And I’d say jdb is presumed to be innocent.

I suppose you have a problem with that too?

 

[blue bags]

Plenty of Prima Facie cases bite the dust at trial.

We wouldn’t even have a court process if the cops were always right.

Statistically, they get it wrong every now and again. They put people on the wrong charges, they don’t have or are able to adduce the evidence they need, sometimes they have been found to be corrupt ( very rare but it happens), the prosecution sometimes get the law wrong, they’ve been known to charge the wrong people. It goes on and on. They are not perfect, they make mistakes like everyone else.

That’s just fact, not speculation and it’s not opinion.

I’ve made my points about the nrl and their stupidity in implementing something they should stay well out of.

Peoples lives are being ruined totally unnecessarily.

NRL has the rights to protect the NRL