Matty Johns on ACA

[Pika]

I just can't understand the cold attitudes here to this girl after watching that show.

If I was involved in something that, although not illegal, was morally wrong and resulted in destroying someones life to the point of commiting suicide. I would be devastated, and not just for my own skin.

Who are you to tell other adults that?

IF it was consensual at the time, there is no possible way the people involved could have known that down the track the young woman involved would be so emotionally scarred.

There are women out there who enjoy this stuff, believe it or not. Now if the act was consentual, how are the players to know the long term effects?

We all need to get off the high moral high horses and quit judging people for what they do behind closed doors.

This about consent.

Personally, I dont know who to believe.

 

[Karmawave]

There are women out there who enjoy this stuff, believe it or not.

A family friends flatmate is a homosexual male, and he was incredibly jealous of the consensual situation the girl was in actually :crazy:

In fact , most gay men wouldn't blink an eye to groups of 3,4,5,6,7, hell even 10 I don't think?

I'm no expert on the matter though - far from it. :lol:

 

[Karmawave]

And on a side note - what a champion bloke an unreal mate Brian Carney must be.

Flying out to be by Johns side.

What an amazing friend to have in a situation like that.

Its times like this you find out who your true mates are.

 

[borat]

Who are you to tell other adults that?

IF it was consensual at the time, there is no possible way the people involved could have known that down the track the young woman involved would be so emotionally scarred.

There are women out there who enjoy this stuff, believe it or not. Now if the act was consentual, how are the players to know the long term effects?

We all need to get off the high moral high horses and quit judging people for what they do behind closed doors.

This about consent.

Personally, I dont know who to believe.

Who are you to tell me what I can and can't think?

I stand by my post

If I was involved in something that, although not illegal,was morally wrong and resulted in destroying someones life to the point of commiting suicide. I would be devastated, and not just for my own skin.

Can you read that. If I, not you or anyone else. What I would do.

If my actions make you feel uneasy or uncomfortable then I would suggest that says alot more about you than anything else.

 

[Pika]

Ah yes, I see that now.

Apologies, you are certainly entitled to your opinion.

 

[K-Man]

A family friends flatmate is a homosexual male, and he was incredibly jealous of the consensual situation the girl was in actually :crazy:

In fact , most gay men wouldn't blink an eye to groups of 3,4,5,6,7, hell even 10 I don't think?

I'm no expert on the matter though - far from it. :lol:

Indeed. I have friends - male AND female; gay and straight - that have had group sex. Not one of those people has ever spoken about it in terms of how devastated and degraded they felt afterwards. If anything (prepare yourself for this Borat) they speak about it rather casually and how it was good fun. It doesn't make them weird for enjoying it, and it doesn't make the people they did it with predators (even if it was 4 men and 1 woman - that is THEIR choice).

How were the players supposed to know that a consenting woman would turn out to be so scarred by the events (and in saying this I am taking the assumption for the sake of argument that she was a consensual participant at the time)?

Borat would you have the same opinion on this if a bloke stepped forward and said he had been scarred and suicidal since a group of netball girls had group sex with him that at the time those girls thought he had really enjoyed?

If we all had to make guesses about how people will feel about certain activities in the future (especially of a sexual nature) even though those people appear happy to go through with them at the time - how we are supposed to do anything at all? Let's say a girl tells you to spank her during sex because she loves it, and you do it. Do you think it would be fair if she later told people that you had abused her?

 

[Karmawave]

K-Man the worlds filled with double standards.

Hypocrisy surrounds us.

Its almost fighting a losing cause, because there's often rules and expectations for 1 person, while someone else in the same situation is treated entirely different.

Unfortunately, its just the way it is, and I'm unsure if anything can ever change it - as wrong as it seems.

 

[borat]

How were the players supposed to know that a consenting woman would turn out to be so scarred by the events (and in saying this I am taking the assumption for the sake of argument that she was a consensual participant at the time)?

Borat would you have the same opinion on this if a bloke stepped forward and said he had been scarred and suicidal since a group of netball girls had group sex with him that at the time those girls thought he had really enjoyed?

If we all had to make guesses about how people will feel about certain activities in the future (especially of a sexual nature) even though those people appear happy to go through with them at the time - how we are supposed to do anything at all? Let's say a girl tells you to spank her during sex because she loves it, and you do it. Do you think it would be fair if she later told people that you had abused her?

K-Man, would you say the same thing if you went back to what you thought was a mates house for a few beers instead found 12 x 100Kg + homosexual footballers ready for a gangbang.

If that were me I would fight my way out. But thats not everyone. The girl suffered post traumatic stress disorder, can you understand that some people might be so scared and traumatised in that situation that they just shut there eyes and submit.

Just not objecting is not consent.

As I said before, In all probability Johns isn't guilty legally of anything. But to lead a star struck 19yo into that situation, have his fun and then leave her to his mates. How is that behaviour defensible.

 

[Medievalknight]

You should watch the 4 corners episode and then see if you still feel the same.

Johns and his buddy have convinced her to come back to their hotel rooms where half the team was waiting for her. They then proceeded to degrade her, treat her like a piece of meat for 2 hours. 12 big high profile blokes waiting for a 19 year old.

It was obvious from watching the show that this has ruined her. She was diagnosed with post traumatic stress disorder.

Seven yrs later???................its taken 7 yrs to diagnose has it, always knew kiwis were a bit behind the times..................but fair dinkum, taking 7 yrs to diagnose.


More like a way to make headlines and be known as the person who made a HIGH PROFILE footy star fall :crazy:

 

[Medievalknight]

convinced her to come back to their hotel rooms where half the team was waiting for her.

How do you know that this EXACT thing happened ............were you one of the unnamed.

And I did watch Four corners btw

 

[Karmawave]

Seven yrs later???................its taken 7 yrs to diagnose has it, always knew kiwis were a bit behind the times..................but fair dinkum, taking 7 yrs to diagnose.

To be fair, I think she was diagnosed with her medical conditions well before this came to light 7 years on last Monday evening on TV...

 

[borat]

For a start, I don't beleive it was ever stated exactly when she was diagnosed. The incident happened 7 years ago, not the diagnosis.

But even if it was, so what. I am not a doctor, are you?

From what I understand people can have post traumatic stress disorder for years without being properly diagnosed. Just like many other mental illnesses.

Do you want to question the diggers on Anzac day as well on how long it takes them to be diagnosed with post traumatic stress disorder?

 

[Medievalknight]

She says that she didn't consent to it. That she was convinced to come back to the hotel with 2 players and the rest quickly entered the room once they got there.

So she was held down physically was she??????????......................THATS NOT what she said on the version of the program i watched........Ru sure your name isnt Bourbon Bec by chance.

 

[antonius]

apparently there will be an item on tonights NBN News that shows one of the womans workmates relating what the woman said to her the day after the incident. It is quite revealing and backs up Johns account completely. 6.00pm NBN news.

 

[Pika]

K-Man, would you say the same thing if you went back to what you thought was a mates house for a few beers instead found 12 x 100Kg + homosexual footballers ready for a gangbang.

If that were me I would fight my way out. But thats not everyone. The girl suffered post traumatic stress disorder, can you understand that some people might be so scared and traumatised in that situation that they just shut there eyes and submit.

Just not objecting is not consent.

As I said before, In all probability Johns isn't guilty legally of anything. But to lead a star struck 19yo into that situation, have his fun and then leave her to his mates. How is that behaviour defensible.

You do not know this is true.

You know nothing about the girl other than her age. She could have been a virgin never kissed or she could have had group sex thousands of times before. Its an assumption that she was either lead into the situation, and that she was star struck.

Secondly, you also dont know that Johns was aware the situation would develop the way it did. From all accounts all three returned and ad no idea what was going to occur.

His behaviour is entirely defensible if she consented.

Consent is the only issue here, not the number of people involved.

It is indefensible if she did not consent. If that is the case it is a dispicable act and all involved ahould be charged.

Finally, in regards to post traumatic stress, we have no idea how the Doctor came to this diagnosis. It could be because of the sexual assult, or it could be because of overwhelming guilt, regret and remorse over her decisions that night. She may have been rejected by her peers an family because of what happened.

Fact is we do not know.

 

[Karmawave]

I mentioned earlier about my belief of what a great friend Brian Carney must be, but I think the support of Johns wife of Matthew might be a tad over-played.

When in damage control , one of the first things PR experts would do is line up the wife to sit side by side with him on TV. It paints a rosy picture on camera, but doesn't always reflect it off camera.

On the other hand, the first thing someone who studies body language would have noticed is Matthew Johns having his hand on his wives leg, while she doesn't touch him at back at all, all the while tilting her head away from him during the interview and never towards him.

I know at least to my untrained eyes, she was supporting him through gritted teeth.

 

[borat]

Originally Posted by borat
convinced her to come back to their hotel rooms where half the team was waiting for her.

How do you know that this EXACT thing happened ............were you one of the unnamed.

And I did watch Four corners btw

John's verision of events is that whilst having sex his 10 team mates filed into his room through the door and bathroom window.

At which point he left her there.

This is more palatable for you.

 

[Pika]

Originally Posted by borat
convinced her to come back to their hotel rooms where half the team was waiting for her.




John's verision of events is that whilst having sex his 10 team mates filed into his room through the door and bathroom window.

At which point he left her there.

This is more palatable for you.

He never said that mate.

 

[cram]

So she was held down physically was she??????????......................THATS NOT what she said on the version of the program i watched........Ru sure your name isnt Bourbon Bec by chance.

Again I am not going to get into the facts surrounding this case but I will say that just because someone is not held down does not mean they consented. Just because there is no physical force does not imply a willingness to participate or consent.

Just because someone consents initially does not mean that they can not withdraw that consent and in fact they can withdraw consent without muttering a word. They may in fact have a fear that to verbally withdraw consent may result in them being harmed.

I deal with children and adolescents everyday that have been sexually abused many of them have no physical force applied to their particular experience however, that does not mean they consent.

 

[borat]

You do not know this is true.

You know nothing about the girl other than her age. She could have been a virgin never kissed or she could have had group sex thousands of times before. Its an assumption that she was either lead into the situation, and that she was star struck.

Secondly, you also dont know that Johns was aware the situation would develop the way it did. From all accounts all three returned and ad no idea what was going to occur.

His behaviour is entirely defensible if she consented.

Consent is the only issue here, not the number of people involved.

It is indefensible if she did not consent. If that is the case it is a dispicable act and all involved ahould be charged.

Finally, in regards to post traumatic stress, we have no idea how the Doctor came to this diagnosis. It could be because of the sexual assult, or it could be because of overwhelming guilt, regret and remorse over her decisions that night. She may have been rejected by her peers an family because of what happened.

Fact is we do not know.

Johns & buddy took her there, had his fun and stepped out once his mates came in. Thats a fact.

http://www.theherald.com.au/news/local/news/general/the-aca-transcript/1512621.aspx?storypage=2


TG: And yet she went back to the room with two of you didn't she?



MJ: Yes.



TG: How could she in going back to the room with two of you have ended up being a willing participant in a queue of blokes at the foot of the bed having sex with her?


MJ: Well, at the time when we went back I was totally unaware that other people were coming into the room. At the point that they did, I stepped away from it.