What's new
The Front Row Forums

Register a free account today to become a member of the world's largest Rugby League discussion forum! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Memo to Walker Smith...(And some others)

Utey

Coach
Messages
19,328
True EEL said:
the bigger picture is the trophy cabinet - and it's bare..........

True but I really think what he has done with the club warrants him to see out his entire contract.
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
78,832
Suitman said:
Actually, there have been very few people blaming him totally for yesterday, far less than expected.
Even WS has acknowleged the players aren't totally blameless, several times.

But WS is getting fed up with Smith's ongoing record. His tolerance is lower than yours. So what. You both have valid opinions and that is that. I just don't understand why the Smith lovers get so incensed by those who want him to go.
Its not as if they don't have a fair argument these days.

Suity

Yes I think people are very much putting the blame pretty much entirely on one person....and I think its way off line.....Smithy can take some blame, but not all of it - I think we came out hard and played very well after he would have talked to the players (the start and just after half time).....but somewhere after that the wheels fell off - the inexperienced guys paniced and the experienced ones couldn't make things happen.
 

True EEL

Bench
Messages
4,857
strider said:
What I don't understand is that people are so blinded by there passion for removing Brian Smith that they don't even acknowledge any other factors.

People are dead set blaming all of yesterday on the coach....but I saw a bunch of players making silly mistakes and rushing things....I don't want these players removed - they were trying their best - I just think many of them were young and inexperienced and paniced.....thats no ones fault - its just that sh*t happens.

i'm sorry

but does sh*t just happen to.......the same club, same coach in the same games (ie. preliminary finals and grand finals) for a period of almost 10 years, whilst there has been a steady stream of different players from year to year to the very same club under the very same coach during that very same period of time

i don't think so......i'm sorry but although it has apparently already been used, the term "common denominator" sprang immediately to my mind yesterday when i was trying to come to grips with what was happening

to quote Chef......"ive seen this kind of thing before"...........

has anybody seen Groundhog Day??????
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
78,832
True EEL said:
the bigger picture is the trophy cabinet - and it's bare..........


Well that why we all argue isn't it.

You guys can't handle anything less than a big trophy to show for the work put in.

I personally don't believe you have to win the big trophy to have been successful.....as I have said over and over - most ppl expected us to finish top 4 at best....so I think we had a successful year.
 

True EEL

Bench
Messages
4,857
<UPtheEELS> said:
True but I really think what he has done with the club warrants him to see out his entire contract.

well at the risk of being flammed - i don't

i said all off-season and all year that i would give credit to him when credit was due and i dillegently did throughout the season

but yesterday was just unforgivable...........there is no way in the world that should have happened - let alone happen AGAIN

i also said, let's see what he does with these new players, give him the year and see how it goes, well the year was great, but the end of it was another implosion - can we make Rugby League like baseball and bring in "pinch coaches" or a "closer" to coach in finals

he must just say something to them that puts them off - there is no other explanation - how could it keep happening in such games with different players in different years and against different opposition?????

give me an answer to that???
 

True EEL

Bench
Messages
4,857
strider said:
Well that why we all argue isn't it.

You guys can't handle anything less than a big trophy to show for the work put in.

I personally don't believe you have to win the big trophy to have been successful.....as I have said over and over - most ppl expected us to finish top 4 at best....so I think we had a successful year.

well Strider if your being honest - fair enough and i commend you

but, what i expected and what i consider success would be an honest, capable and professional display - not unbelieve ineptitude from the best team in the comp......AGAIN in a big game!!!!!!

i would have been content if we lost 18-16 or 22-12 or something, anything where they put in an acceptable effort that was somehwere near their potential and deserved respect - but that was awful

and i can tell you one thing......some fans may want trophies and others like yourself do not - but i bet DF, BS and the players wanted a big shiny trophy
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
78,832
we'd ALL like a big shiny trophy - but I am not prepared to turn on people because they don't get it when I KNOW they are working their butts off to try and get it.

yeah we played crap.....so did North Queensland a few weeks ago (infact they were substantially more f**ked than us) - unfortunatley they got a 2nd chance to make up for their f**k ups and we didn't
 

Suitman

Post Whore
Messages
55,320
strider said:
we'd ALL like a big shiny trophy - but I am not prepared to turn on people because they don't get it

You seem to be turning on people who don't necessarily share your opinion though.

Suity
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
78,832
Suitman said:
You seem to be turning on people who don't necessarily share your opinion though.

Suity

Suity - I generally think you are a good bloke - but please don't play Mr Impartial Observer role in this....we know where you stand on this issue.


I am not "turning" on anyone.

I have NOT started any threads to get stuck into people.

Am I not entitled to my opinion?

Some people think its all good and fun to get stuck into Smithy - don't give a crap whether the endless public bashings affect him personally....but they get all upset if someone bites back......if people want to throw stones then they better get themselves a good shield to hide behind when they get thrown back!
 

Ant

Juniors
Messages
478
I have always felt it was harsh to blame one person for the problems of many. Yes no Brian Smith side has ever won a GF, and yes yesterday was a terrible eels performance. But gee he gets sides that not many people rate at the start of seasons a long way.

At the start of this year as many people tipped us to miss the top 8 as to make it, I don't think anyone had us in the top 4. We may have finished minor premiers, but I think we were just one of 6 good sides this season. We had some good moments but we weren't absolute stand outs for long periods.

I don't think people looked closely enough at our previous two results. We overcame brisbane at the back end of the game, after losing Hindmarsh. We then beat Manly without Hindmarsh and Fui. People jumped on us. But I think those games masked what effect the loss of Hindmarsh and to a lessor extent Fui had on our team. He is our only international player our only regular rep player.

Brisbane lost their last 7 straight games (ours was their 5th of these).
Manly lost 10 of their last 12 games (wins against canberra reserve grade side, and you guessed it Brisbane). Yes we won without Hindy, but against the two sides in the poorest form in the whole comp, arguably at the time the 2 worst sides in the comp.

Suddenly we play a side that is not a no hoper. Yes the tigers smashed them in the first week of the finals, but that was obviously a bit an off night for the cowboys. They have won 6 of their last 9, 3 losses only to saints and twice to tigers the two teams in the best form. They had also been their as a group last year. They were also tipped by many to be a GF winner this year.

Yet people don't take into account that sort of stuff, instead they simply say Brian Smith lost and there's another one to add to the pile.

Yes the eels were out of sorts on sunday, so were the dragons on saturday. There is plenty that goes into explaining the eels poor performance. Placing too much emphasis on the coach is off the mark for mine.

For mine Brian Smith has only ever actually coached two very good side, the 93 dragons and 01 eels.

Now it has been said that dragons were narrow favs in that match, well I'd say it was about 50-50. But it was a close game an 8 point margin, and for mine the turning point was the first set of six. Their best prop stevens nearly had his thumb torn off trying to tackle lazo and missed all bar 30 seconds of the game. Thats a tough loss.

In 2001, I think the eels were undeserved odds on favs. Newcastle didn't lose a game that season when Johns played, not a single one. So they were as good and proved actually better than the eels. The eels only went down by 6 after a horrible start.

I tend to think people don't actually analyse what goes on in inidividual seasons and matches before making their point.

In saying all that barring injury the eels have a genuine chance next year, and smith is getting on. If I was him I would make this my last shot.
 

Eelementary

Post Whore
Messages
56,773
That's all very nice and well.

But the other half of his job is to WIN Premierhsips.

In his 20 year history or whatever, how many times has he done that?

It's a worrying stat.
 

Sean7

Juniors
Messages
561
Ant said:
I have always felt it was harsh to blame one person for the problems of many. Yes no Brian Smith side has ever won a GF, and yes yesterday was a terrible eels performance. But gee he gets sides that not many people rate at the start of seasons a long way.

At the start of this year as many people tipped us to miss the top 8 as to make it, I don't think anyone had us in the top 4. We may have finished minor premiers, but I think we were just one of 6 good sides this season. We had some good moments but we weren't absolute stand outs for long periods.

I don't really think that counts this year. The only reason we weren't tipped by some to make the 8 was because our past two seasons were such a disaster, not because of the team he (Brian Smith) had available.

If he didn't make the semis with the team he had at his disposal this year, he should've been quite literaly shot. Top 4 was quite a reasonable expectation for this side.
 

Sean7

Juniors
Messages
561
strider said:
Well that why we all argue isn't it.

You guys can't handle anything less than a big trophy to show for the work put in.

I personally don't believe you have to win the big trophy to have been successful.....as I have said over and over - most ppl expected us to finish top 4 at best....so I think we had a successful year.

God, I hope that's not how Brian Smith feels.
 

lucablight

First Grade
Messages
6,285
Strider....if only everybody else was as level headed as you.
We all know it hurts but alot of you people who are whinging and moaning before would have gladly taken a place in the top 8 before and conceded anything more was a bonus. Sean you have only made one thread the entire year and disappeared when we started to go well. Where were you then?

http://forums.leagueunlimited.com/showthread.php?t=103507
 

lucablight

First Grade
Messages
6,285
Strider....if only everybody else was as level headed as you.
We all know it hurts but alot of you people who are whinging and moaning before would have gladly taken a place in the top 8 before and conceded anything more was a bonus. Sean you have only made one thread the entire year and disappeared when we started to go well.

http://forums.leagueunlimited.com/showthread.php?t=103507

Where were you then? You had pretty much conceded we wouldn't win the comp and now you're whinging because we didn't. Sure we didn't when he had the best opportunity in a while but to sack the coach over one bad game this year after everything else we accomplished is just wrong.
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
78,832
Eelementary said:
That's all very nice and well.

But the other half of his job is to WIN Premierhsips.

In his 20 year history or whatever, how many times has he done that?

It's a worrying stat.

No one is saying he is NOT trying his butt off to do that - and no one is saying they don't want that also.....all I am saying is that its bloody hard to win a premiership - yeah we should have taken our chances better when they came up - but at the end of the day we weren't good enough for a whole bunch of reasons.

Despite that - I think people should still have enough insight to see it was still a successful season despite the final disappointment.
 

Suitman

Post Whore
Messages
55,320
strider said:
- but at the end of the day we weren't good enough for a whole bunch of reasons.

That's the disappointing thing.

We WERE good enough but something went horribly, horribly wrong.

Suity
 

Suitman

Post Whore
Messages
55,320
strider said:
Suity - I generally think you are a good bloke - but please don't play Mr Impartial Observer role in this....we know where you stand on this issue.

Likewise, I enjoy reading all your stuff and actually think we are similar in a lot of ways. But, don't tell me what I think. Last year I was as angry as all hell with our performances and yes, I did want Brian gone. But as I have said on many occassions this season, he has made me look like a fool and I am happy about that. Consequently, I am happy for him to now see out his contract.

It's not a "Get out of Jail free" card as HJ likes to call it, its just that I am one of the few people around here to have the balls to say that maybe I got it wrong.
I still however believe that he is on his last chance next season. Nothing other than a Grand Final parade will convince me that we need Brian to stay around any longer. Even then, I still think he should go.
Whether the players love him or not, I suggest that the best thing this club could do in 2007 would be to bring some fresh ideas into the joint, some fresh passion, and some renewed enthusiasm. I have no doubt that even the players would be better for it.

So it is on record ok? Brian has my full support for season 2006.
Beyond that, he doesn't.

Suity
 

walker smith

Juniors
Messages
462
strider said:
No one is saying he is NOT trying his butt off to do that - and no one is saying they don't want that also.....all I am saying is that its bloody hard to win a premiership - yeah we should have taken our chances better when they came up - but at the end of the day we weren't good enough for a whole bunch of reasons.

Despite that - I think people should still have enough insight to see it was still a successful season despite the final disappointment.

If you went to a professional - say a lawyer - and time after time he failed to complete the task for which he was engaged, would you continue to engage him or go else where?

Or say you went to a plumber to fix something and nine times in a row he said he thought he fixed it, only to find later that it is still broken - despite the fact that he was a good bloke and despite the fact that he tried hard to fix it - would you look else where to have your problem fixed?

Most reasonable people would look anywhere else to get the problem fixed, especially if it provided recurring angst....
 

strider

Post Whore
Messages
78,832
walker smith said:
If you went to a professional - say a lawyer - and time after time he failed to complete the task for which he was engaged, would you continue to engage him or go else where?

Or say you went to a plumber to fix something and nine times in a row he said he thought he fixed it, only to find later that it is still broken - despite the fact that he was a good bloke and despite the fact that he tried hard to fix it - would you look else where to have your problem fixed?

Most reasonable people would look anywhere else to get the problem fixed, especially if it provided recurring angst....


The flaw in this statement is where our opinions differ.....the plumber is the only one responsible isn't he? - he's doing all the work - he's the man - unless Sydney Water screwed him over and cut my water off :lol:

You keep singling out one person in a team effort - sorry but I disagree with that.
 
Top