RedAndWhiteThommo
Juniors
- Messages
- 581
Thommo - this is the best argument I have read on LU for you point of view, yet. In fact - it is just that - an argument. Your collegaues have spouted nothing but mere assertions. However, there is a key factual oversight in your analysis.
The St George Dragons RLFC and the Illawarra Steelers RLFC are defunct as far as the NRL first grade comp goes. Neither has a license. They merged and the resulting club St George Illawarra RLFC has the license. But good try.
With regards the Olympics - clearly Australasia won medals - not Australia or New Zealand as those countries were not there in singular form. Just a hybrid ad hoc regional team. If a World XI beats the Australian Cricket team with Shoiab al Hasan in the side can Bangladesh claim the victory? No, they cannot. Same for the Olympics. Bangladesh may celebrate Shaqib's success - but not as their own. Same for the Olympics.
With regards constitutional matters - a constitution creates the birth of a new country. The country exists from when they constitutional is judically recongised and the country ceases to exist when no longer judicially recongised. The land and people of that land clearly have a history prior to the constitution and post the end of the consitution but that particular nation does not. Quite simple really.
Timing can be perplexing. For instance - take the USA. There were Americans in North America before July 4, 1776. But they were not part of the USA. The USA was not recongised as a nation until 1783. Their famous constitution was brought into force in 1788 replacing previous ad hoc constitutions. The nation we know as the today as the USA was formed in 1788. Sure the people celebrate the history leading upto the event (July 4) - but that history is the background to the new nation, as that particular nation did not exist during the war of independence. It just set the scene for the new nations birth.
Bit like St George Illawarra RLFC reallyUnited States and United Clubs. New entities.
But both the AOC and the IOC recognise the Australian medals won in these olympiads, including recognition of Fanny Durack as the first Australian female gold medalist. We even count in the official Australian gold medal tally the 1912 4x200 freestyle relay which included a Kiwi.
You can not ignore the history that predates the formation of an organisation - it is an integral part. We don't consider Ned Kelly a mad Irishman or a Victorian. Matthew Flinders was not a sunburned pom. We proudly display our Boer War artifacts athe Australian War Memorial. We count achievements prior to 1901 as part of Australian story, even for those that were born before the Commonwealth began.
We have grown up with this, it is recognised in texts and documented history. It forms the basis of much of our legal history and jurisprudence. It goes to the very nature of our culture. Why is it so hard to fathom that other members of a Joint Venture choose to also celebrate their history in full, including the wins, the losses, the heroes and the villians?
The St George Illawarra RLFC has a proud history that predates its formation in 1998. It is a histroy that can not be ignored - it can be envied (as it apparently is on this forum) but it can not be put aside. Followers of the JV partners lived the history and have seen it grow into what it is today - you can try to tell them to forget it and not associate those memories and achievements with the current evolved entity but ultimately it is down to those with standing (fans, players, sponsors) to decide how it will be celebrated.
