New Zealand 2 will deal a massive blow to NZ rugby

[Matua]

Well, I mean... would an All Black jersey in the past just be handed to a RL player that wasn't good enough for the Blues bench? Or is the value of the jersey the same and RTS was good enough to make it?

Your comment is as inane as me making a statement that league is fallen because a fat failed rugby player who was playing semi pro rugby is now a first grade league player.

The ABs took a punt on one of the best NZ league players ever and it didn't come off. Players are picked on potential all the time, remember Sione Mata'utia is a Kangaroo.

Feel free to make a bigger deal out of it than it is if it makes you feel better.

 

[Te Kaha]

And we dont have 32 teams of 50 man squads that need furnishing. There are 70k college football players a year. Only small % of these nominate for the NFL draft (around 3000) and only 300 or so get picked up.

We dont actually know how many 16-18 year old RL players around the world there are. Let alone how many it takes to keep a quality 20 team comp in the NRL going. But you make a good point about the US system, it takes the best of the kids, puts them in the best college programs which produces talent. NRL needs to be doing the same, at moment we are mainly leaving it to LC's and NRL clubs to develop the talent. That leaves a lot of young talent by the way side along the journey. Despite some issues the U20's comp seemed to be a better answer than the current system. You could add non NRL clubs to a better resourced U20's comp in PNG, NZ and Aus and draft or have clubs pick players from there. That'd be a start.

That's only part of the problem. The numbers are still declining here in the 8-12 and 12-16 year old groups, the fact the 16-18 year olds are declining at a faster rate is only the immediate threat. In ten years the supply may very well just run out.

 

[Te Kaha]

I didn't say that the warriors have 'a' junior team. I said they have a full NRL pathway full of teams that are stacked with home grown talent which is absolutely true and the number of NZ players flowing into the other NRL clubs from NZ is at an all time high.

We get it, you love Union and you feel threatened.

You have a great set of blinkers on there. "A full NRL pathway" means absolutely nothing if the clubs that feed in to that are no longer around to supply the juniors. Of course you don't care about League in NZ, you only care about Australia like the rest of your circle jerk.

enough said

Aww having to crop a comment out of context to try and win a point... how pathetic. He failed in his dream to represent the All Blacks at the world cup.

So you are saying that the world famous All Black jersey is just handed to a guy that was lucky to make the Blues bench? My, how RU has fallen

And now making things up? Really?

 

[Gobsmacked]

Your comment is as inane as me making a statement that league is fallen because a fat failed rugby player who was playing semi pro rugby is now a first grade league player.

The ABs took a punt on one of the best NZ league players ever and it didn't come off. Players are picked on potential all the time, remember Sione Mata'utia is a Kangaroo.

Feel free to make a bigger deal out of it than it is if it makes you feel better.

I watched a bit of a Union show as they were talking about RTS . The entire panel agreed that he hadn't been given a fair shot because he was picked in the wrong position and should have been fullback. A bit of " but he didn't possess a kicking game " and " there were plenty great players that didn't to start with either " .
The reality is there's no possible way he didn't have the talent to make the All Blacks. His running game could match it with the best across the world in any code - even the NFL.
But...
Rugby union can be unkind to those that run the ball as an individual and you could forfeit possession, meaning RTS biggest attribute was also in some instances a liability.

So picked out of position in a game he wasn't suited to.
There's players today in Union that are killing it, at their absolute peak but that doesn't mean they'd make it in League because a lot aren't suitable .
Same goes for League.
It's a stupid premise that " o your League guy can't make it!" Or " your Union guy can't make it!"
They're different sports!
Horses for courses!

Next we'll be bashing Rafael Nedal because he no good at squash ffs
It's just dumb.

 

[Matua]

I watched a bit of a Union show as they were talking about RTS . The entire panel agreed that he hadn't been given a fair shot because he was picked in the wrong position and should have been fullback. A bit of " but he didn't possess a kicking game " and " there were plenty great players that didn't to start with either " .
The reality is there's no possible way he didn't have the talent to make the All Blacks. His running game could match it with the best across the world in any code - even the NFL.
But...
Rugby union can be unkind to those that run the ball as an individual and you could forfeit possession, meaning RTS biggest attribute was also in some instances a liability.

So picked out of position in a game he wasn't suited to.
There's players today in Union that are killing it, at their absolute peak but that doesn't mean they'd make it in League because a lot aren't suitable .
Same goes for League.
It's a stupid premise that " o your League guy can't make it!" Or " your Union guy can't make it!"
They're different sports!
Horses for courses!

Next we'll be bashing Rafael Nedal because he no good at squash ffs
It's just dumb.

For people who hate rugby I think you and your mate Ws watch more rugby shows/YT/Twitter than what I do.

Yes it is a stupid premise, which was exactly the point I was making, a point I've also made earlier in the thread.

I don't agree with the panel though, fullback is a crowded position, whereas there was less depth at second five when he moved across. It would have been harder to justify his selection last year as a fullback. The decision also wouldn't have been made in isolation either, he would have been involved in it, and if he really wanted to play fullback that would have been part of the discussion.

The majority of rugby fans were hoping that RTS would succeed, I think he's probably more liked than any other league player in NZ.

Also, your comment about rugby being unkind to those who run the ball is just not true. Comments like this just suggest an appearance that you don't really understand the game.

Also also, I'm not sure who was bashing RTS for your Nadal analogy.

No matter what RTS will end his career as a dual code international, something that a guy like Craig Innes didn't even though he fully should have (he got caught up in the Super League war and wasn't released for the Kiwis).

 

[titoelcolombiano]

You have a great set of blinkers on there. "A full NRL pathway" means absolutely nothing if the clubs that feed in to that are no longer around to supply the juniors. Of course you don't care about League in NZ, you only care about Australia like the rest of your circle jerk.



Aww having to crop a comment out of context to try and win a point... how pathetic. He failed in his dream to represent the All Blacks at the world cup.



And now making things up? Really?

1. The Warriors pathways are full of talented young NZ players and the number of NZers flowing to other NRL clubs is at an all time high. Clearly you are deliberately painting the game as being in a dire situation because you want it to be and there have been plenty of sources provided in this thread that contradict your comments.

2. His dream was to play for the All Blacks, he did it. Job done...

3. Was responding to Matua that said he was only really good enough to make the Blues' bench.... yes, was just ''handed'' an All Blacks jersey?? Are they really that cheap these days?

 

[Te Kaha]

1. The Warriors pathways are full of talented young NZ players and the number of NZers flowing to other NRL clubs is at an all time high. Clearly you are deliberately painting the game as being in a dire situation because you want it to be and there have been plenty of sources provided in this thread that contradict your comments.

You really are one limited individual. You are so enamoured by what you see you can't fathom what's underneath, you lack of insight is really laughable. And then there is your confirmation bias... wow.
There have been many reports in this thread about declining player numbers. Not just a small decline, but one that is causing teams and clubs to fail. Just because you are happy with what you see now you don't care about what happens in the future. The game below NRL level IS in dire straights in NZ using any metric you have, that you don't care about that speaks volumes.

2. His dream was to play for the All Blacks, he did it. Job done...

He has spoken plenty of times about his "dream" to play for the All Blacks at the World Cup in france later this year, he failed at that, and wont even be able to do that in League either.

3. Was responding to Matua that said he was only really good enough to make the Blues' bench.... yes, was just ''handed'' an All Blacks jersey?? Are they really that cheap these days?

Which is you being a trolling imbecile, taking what he said out of context. RTS was selected on the reputation of being one of the best League players on the planet to see if he could handle International competition. He wanted to make the World Cup squad and and the All Blacks selectors therefore gave him a step up to see if he could. He didn't succeed, and is now playing as a bench player for the Blues.
As for cheap? You consider being one of the best League Players in the world isn't good enough for the All Blacks? You think All Blacks are just naturally better than the Best the NRL has to offer? weird, but OK.

 

[Gobsmacked]

You really are one limited individual. You are so enamoured by what you see you can't fathom what's underneath, you lack of insight is really laughable. And then there is your confirmation bias... wow.
There have been many reports in this thread about declining player numbers. Not just a small decline, but one that is causing teams and clubs to fail. Just because you are happy with what you see now you don't care about what happens in the future. The game below NRL level IS in dire straights in NZ using any metric you have, that you don't care about that speaks volumes.




He has spoken plenty of times about his "dream" to play for the All Blacks at the World Cup in france later this year, he failed at that, and wont even be able to do that in League either.



Which is you being a trolling imbecile, taking what he said out of context. RTS was selected on the reputation of being one of the best League players on the planet to see if he could handle International competition. He wanted to make the World Cup squad and and the All Blacks selectors therefore gave him a step up to see if he could. He didn't succeed, and is now playing as a bench player for the Blues.
As for cheap? You consider being one of the best League Players in the world isn't good enough for the All Blacks? You think All Blacks are just naturally better than the Best the NRL has to offer? weird, but OK.

What is wrong with you?
Why is every post personal insults?

If you hold everyone in such poor regard, why engage with them?

You don't have to be on here mate.

 

[Te Kaha]

What is wrong with you?
Why is every post personal insults?

If you hold everyone in such poor regard, why engage with them?

You don't have to be on here mate.

I only hold idiots in "poor regard". Gross stupidity irks me... and this thread is full of it, from the very first post.

I know i don't have to be here, but its a community service to point out where people are being stupid, lying or just posting rubbish.

If you lot actually took the time to do proper research on the state of the game here you would see I am 100% correct. Instead you lot post "attack" posts because you know the basis of the thread is not only wrong, it's now moot, since there wont be an NZ2.

 

[Gobsmacked]

I only hold idiots in "poor regard". Gross stupidity irks me... and this thread is full of it, from the very first post.

I know i don't have to be here, but its a community service to point out where people are being stupid, lying or just posting rubbish.

If you lot actually took the time to do proper research on the state of the game here you would see I am 100% correct. Instead you lot post "attack" posts because you know the basis of the thread is not only wrong, it's now moot, since there wont be an NZ2.

So you've just decided to spend your twilight years yelling at whoever you disagree with .
Good for you.

 

[Te Kaha]

So you've just decided to spend your twilight years yelling at whoever you disagree with .
Good for you.

Yellling? its... on... an... internet... web... page.... there is no yelling.... I swear you get dumber with each post.

And it's hardly my twilight years... i plan to live forever,

 

[Perth Red]

Is there actually anywhere that shows participation rates for rugby league in nz? the nzrl annual report isnt showing much detail

 

[The Great Dane]

I only hold idiots in "poor regard". Gross stupidity irks me... and this thread is full of it, from the very first post.

I know i don't have to be here, but its a community service to point out where people are being stupid, lying or just posting rubbish.

If you lot actually took the time to do proper research on the state of the game here you would see I am 100% correct. Instead you lot post "attack" posts because you know the basis of the thread is not only wrong, it's now moot, since there wont be an NZ2.

A good portion of it is ignorance, not stupidity.

The distinction is important.

 

[Te Kaha]

A good portion of it is ignorance, not stupidity.

The distinction is important.

That much is true, however wilful ignorance IS stupidity. Not believing clear evidence when it's put in front of you because you only believe in what your confirmation bias allows you to, is just plain stupid.

 

[Te Kaha]

Is there actually anywhere that shows participation rates for rugby league in nz? the nzrl annual report isnt showing much detail

They stopped adding it in the early 2000's. it was depressing reading I spose. If you have a login to Sports NZ I am told you can get them there, but that costs and you need a legitimate reason to be there.

 

[Gobsmacked]

For people who hate rugby I think you and your mate Ws watch more rugby shows/YT/Twitter than what I do.

Yes it is a stupid premise, which was exactly the point I was making, a point I've also made earlier in the thread.

I don't agree with the panel though, fullback is a crowded position, whereas there was less depth at second five when he moved across. It would have been harder to justify his selection last year as a fullback. The decision also wouldn't have been made in isolation either, he would have been involved in it, and if he really wanted to play fullback that would have been part of the discussion.

The majority of rugby fans were hoping that RTS would succeed, I think he's probably more liked than any other league player in NZ.

Also, your comment about rugby being unkind to those who run the ball is just not true. Comments like this just suggest an appearance that you don't really understand the game.

Also also, I'm not sure who was bashing RTS for your Nadal analogy.

No matter what RTS will end his career as a dual code international, something that a guy like Craig Innes didn't even though he fully should have (he got caught up in the Super League war and wasn't released for the Kiwis).

Mate , I played a few games of Union as a kid. I know perfectly well that if I go on a run stepping and weaving trying to beat defenders on my own, I'll probably end up laying the ball back for it to get pinched.
That's the game. Possession is contested at the conclusion of every tackle.
In League I could run as hard as I wanted, where I wanted and try to break the tackle to the last second we no fear of loosing Possession for my team. Furthermore, I got to start in space with the defenders 10 meters back meaning I had time and space to sum things up. My back rowers would be jockeying ONLY to be a pass option as opposed to shadowing behind me ready to clear the ruck and maintain possessions.

If you don't think there's a gigantic difference in how you can attack between the 2 sports, I'd suggest you have NO idea what you are talking about.

 

[Te Kaha]

Mate , I played a few games of Union as a kid. I know perfectly well that if I go on a run stepping and weaving trying to beat defenders on my own, I'll probably end up laying the ball back for it to get pinched.
That's the game. Possession is contested at the conclusion of every tackle.
In League I could run as hard as I wanted, where I wanted and try to break the tackle to the last second we no fear of loosing Possession for my team. Furthermore, I got to start in space with the defenders 10 meters back meaning I had time and space to sum things up. My back rowers would be jockeying ONLY to be a pass option as opposed to shadowing behind me ready to clear the ruck and maintain possessions.

If you don't think there's a gigantic difference in how you can attack between the 2 sports, I'd suggest you have NO idea what you are talking about.

That is hardly and endorsement of your "knowledge" of the game. All this... " if I go on a run stepping and weaving trying to beat defenders on my own, I'll probably end up laying the ball back for it to get pinched."... says is that you didn't have any faith in your teammates and weren't a team player or you played in a team that didn't know what it was doing. If you were good enough to do that then there should have been teammates ready to maintain position, to either clean out the ruck or recieve the pass. This thread clearly shows you don't actually know what you are talking about at least half the time.

 

[Matua]

Mate , I played a few games of Union as a kid. I know perfectly well that if I go on a run stepping and weaving trying to beat defenders on my own, I'll probably end up laying the ball back for it to get pinched.
That's the game. Possession is contested at the conclusion of every tackle.
In League I could run as hard as I wanted, where I wanted and try to break the tackle to the last second we no fear of loosing Possession for my team. Furthermore, I got to start in space with the defenders 10 meters back meaning I had time and space to sum things up. My back rowers would be jockeying ONLY to be a pass option as opposed to shadowing behind me ready to clear the ruck and maintain possessions.

If you don't think there's a gigantic difference in how you can attack between the 2 sports, I'd suggest you have NO idea what you are talking about.

The bold is a straw man, I didn't say there wasn't a difference.

But none of that screed you just wrote translates to rugby being unkind to players who run the ball. Which was the point being discussed, not your straw man.

 

[Perth Red]

Mate , I played a few games of Union as a kid. I know perfectly well that if I go on a run stepping and weaving trying to beat defenders on my own, I'll probably end up laying the ball back for it to get pinched.

You'd get dropped from the side for not kicking the ball at every opportunity!

 

[Wb1234]

Your comment is as inane as me making a statement that league is fallen because a fat failed rugby player who was playing semi pro rugby is now a first grade league player.

The ABs took a punt on one of the best NZ league players ever and it didn't come off. Players are picked on potential all the time, remember Sione Mata'utia is a Kangaroo.

Feel free to make a bigger deal out of it than it is if it makes you feel better.

Nrl training made te whare what he is

he’s still really unfit and struggled with the game