New Zealand 2 will deal a massive blow to NZ rugby

[Te Kaha]

The main point to participation numbers is that those kids that play at a young age tend to be fans for life.

And that does nothing to keep playing numbers up. It's all well and good to keep people engaged on TV, but if that's all you are doing then you have already admitted defeat.
Playing the contact versions of these games is in the end all that matters. If less and less kids play the games each year, and that is certainly the case in NZ and it seems Aussie, then no amount of "participation figures" featuring non contact versions of the games will save the game.
The problem with Team contact sports opposed to individual ones is that you need a certain number to have a game.
It only takes one or two kids short of 26 before all the remaining kids can no longer play the proper game. When teams start to default because they don't have enough players then clubs start to fold when the remaining players go elsewhere. This continues then even the professional game is gone because there are no longer youngsters to select.
It is naive, even stupid, to think this can't happen, because it is happening here right now.

 

[Wb1234]

Another nrl fan

 

[Matua]

Another nrl fan

How many times do we have to tell you lot that there's not the same animosity between league and rugby in NZ so this really is no big deal? It's really not worthy a post in this thread.

I had that same jersey in the early 90s, wasn't really an Illawara fan (I supported Manly due to the coach and a bunch of players being NZers) when I bought it on sale on holiday in Sydney, but then I followed them after that. They used to have a number of Italian surnamed players.

 

[Wb1234]

How many times do we have to tell you lot that there's not the same animosity between league and rugby in NZ so this really is no big deal? It's really not worthy a post in this thread.

I had that same jersey in the early 90s, wasn't really an Illawara fan (I supported Manly due to the coach and a bunch of players being NZers) when I bought it on sale on holiday in Sydney, but then I followed them after that. They used to have a number of Italian surnamed players.

Sounds like the Steelers had more fans in nz than in Wollongong

Graham lowe was petty avg as manly coach

mattu ridge was a champion

 

[Wb1234]

Harris-Tavita coming home on two-year deal from 2024

Chanel Harris-Tavita to be a One New Zealand Warrior again after signing two-year contract.

www.warriors.kiwi

How can they fit him and shek in an already good backline

 

[SpaceMonkey]

Another nrl fan

Pretty sure he always was- was one of those guys that nobody would’ve been too surprised if he’d switched codes at some point. Would’ve killed it at League too.

 

[Perth Red]

And that does nothing to keep playing numbers up. It's all well and good to keep people engaged on TV, but if that's all you are doing then you have already admitted defeat.
Playing the contact versions of these games is in the end all that matters. If less and less kids play the games each year, and that is certainly the case in NZ and it seems Aussie, then no amount of "participation figures" featuring non contact versions of the games will save the game.
The problem with Team contact sports opposed to individual ones is that you need a certain number to have a game.
It only takes one or two kids short of 26 before all the remaining kids can no longer play the proper game. When teams start to default because they don't have enough players then clubs start to fold when the remaining players go elsewhere. This continues then even the professional game is gone because there are no longer youngsters to select.
It is naive, even stupid, to think this can't happen, because it is happening here right now.

Yes and no, theres a pretty strong argument that, in terms of ensuring a pipeline of talent for the professional level, you need X amount of kids playing and equally importantly a decent scouting system and development pathway for the elite kids.

We have some areas that have just as many kids as other areas playing but few making NRL, and some others who are producing a lot. That isnt just a numbers thing, its multi faceted.

What that magical number is is much harder to predict.
NFL, for example, picks from only a relatively small pool of colleges that produces 300 odd players a year for NFL. It doesn't actually need that many 15-17year olds playing to feed a 20 club comp in the NRL. Throw in areas we could be scouting and spending more on pathways in, like NZ, and the talent generation, despite reduced overall male numbers, isnt an issue it would seem.

 

[SpaceMonkey]

Harris-Tavita coming home on two-year deal from 2024

Chanel Harris-Tavita to be a One New Zealand Warrior again after signing two-year contract.

www.warriors.kiwi

How can they fit him and shek in an already good backline

Good chance he’ll be at hooker or #13

 

[Te Kaha]

NFL, for example, picks from only a relatively small pool of colleges that produces 300 odd players a year for NFL. It doesn't actually need that many 15-17year olds playing to feed a 20 club comp in the NRL. Throw in areas we could be scouting and spending more on pathways in, like NZ, and the talent generation, despite reduced overall male numbers, isnt an issue it would seem.

Are you kidding me? Seriously? "relatively small pool of colleges that produces 300 odd players a year for NFL".. what you neglect to mention is the literally thousands of schools that feed into those "relatively small pool of colleges" so that college players are already the best of the best. That's hundreds of thousands of kids who are whittled down to the thousands that play college ball, that is in turn whittled down to NFL players.

There is nowhere near the population of people let alone kids who want to play to duplicate that.

 

[Perth Red]

Are you kidding me? Seriously? "relatively small pool of colleges that produces 300 odd players a year for NFL".. what you neglect to mention is the literally thousands of schools that feed into those "relatively small pool of colleges" so that college players are already the best of the best. That's hundreds of thousands of kids who are whittled down to the thousands that play college ball, that is in turn whittled down to NFL players.

There is nowhere near the population of people let alone kids who want to play to duplicate that.

And we dont have 32 teams of 50 man squads that need furnishing. There are 70k college football players a year. Only small % of these nominate for the NFL draft (around 3000) and only 300 or so get picked up.

We dont actually know how many 16-18 year old RL players around the world there are. Let alone how many it takes to keep a quality 20 team comp in the NRL going. But you make a good point about the US system, it takes the best of the kids, puts them in the best college programs which produces talent. NRL needs to be doing the same, at moment we are mainly leaving it to LC's and NRL clubs to develop the talent. That leaves a lot of young talent by the way side along the journey. Despite some issues the U20's comp seemed to be a better answer than the current system. You could add non NRL clubs to a better resourced U20's comp in PNG, NZ and Aus and draft or have clubs pick players from there. That'd be a start.

 

[Wb1234]

And we dont have 32 teams of 50 man squads that need furnishing. There are 70k college football players a year. Only small % of these nominate for the NFL draft (around 3000) and only 300 or so get picked up.

We dont actually know how many 16-18 year old RL players around the world there are. Let alone how many it takes to keep a quality 20 team comp in the NRL going. But you make a good point about the US system, it takes the best of the kids, puts them in the best college programs which produces talent. NRL needs to be doing the same, at moment we are mainly leaving it to LC's and NRL clubs to develop the talent. That leaves a lot of young talent by the way side along the journey. Despite some issues the U20's comp seemed to be a better answer than the current system. You could add non NRL clubs to a better resourced U20's comp in PNG, NZ and Aus and draft or have clubs pick players from there. That'd be a start.

Nrl does that

for each kid that makes nrl hundreds have missed out along the way

 

[titoelcolombiano]

I didn't say that the warriors have 'a' junior team. I said they have a full NRL pathway full of teams that are stacked with home grown talent which is absolutely true and the number of NZ players flowing into the other NRL clubs from NZ is at an all time high.

We get it, you love Union and you feel threatened.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

He switched to fulfil his dreams of being an All Black, which he did

enough said

 

[Wb1234]

Izzy and Alex train at the same gym. Alex is ex rugby league

 

[Matua]

I didn't say that the warriors have 'a' junior team. I said they have a full NRL pathway full of teams that are stacked with home grown talent which is absolutely true and the number of NZ players flowing into the other NRL clubs from NZ is at an all time high.

We get it, you love Union and you feel threatened.

Do you have stats for that? I doubt there'd be more now than there was at the height of the U20s. Or do you only mean 1st grade?

 

[Matua]

enough said

If his name wasn't Roger Tuivasa-Scheck there's no way he'd be an AB. I'm a big fan of RTS and was glad he gave it a shot but he didn't really have a chance of really making after he couldn't play the NPC in 2021.

He made the team on his league rep, which I don't have a problem with, there's been worse players than him play tests too. Interestingly enough Brad Thorn did the same thing too, made the ABs on his rep, wasn't very good, took a year off, then came back and made it on his own merits and become a bloody good AB. Can't coach for shit though.

But in all honesty RTS is lucky to make the Blues bench. I wish that NZR and the Warriors would just make a deal so he could come back to league asap. They may actually do that once the Super comp is over if the Warriors have any cap space (which I have no idea about).

 

[titoelcolombiano]

If his name wasn't Roger Tuivasa-Scheck there's no way he'd be an AB. I'm a big fan of RTS and was glad he gave it a shot but he didn't really have a chance of really making after he couldn't play the NPC in 2021.

He made the team on his league rep, which I don't have a problem with, there's been worse players than him play tests too. Interestingly enough Brad Thorn did the same thing too, made the ABs on his rep, wasn't very good, took a year off, then came back and made it on his own merits and become a bloody good AB. Can't coach for shit though.

But in all honesty RTS is lucky to make the Blues bench. I wish that NZR and the Warriors would just make a deal so he could come back to league asap. They may actually do that once the Super comp is over if the Warriors have any cap space (which I have no idea about).

So you are saying that the world famous All Black jersey is just handed to a guy that was lucky to make the Blues bench? My, how RU has fallen

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Do you have stats for that? I doubt there'd be more now than there was at the height of the U20s. Or do you only mean 1st grade?

Just talking first grade

 

[Matua]

So you are saying that the world famous All Black jersey is just handed to a guy that was lucky to make the Blues bench? My, how RU has fallen

Ah, so you just want to troll. Fair enough, might be time for a rest from this thread again anyway.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Ah, so you just want to troll. Fair enough, might be time for a rest from this thread again anyway.

Well, I mean... would an All Black jersey in the past just be handed to a RL player that wasn't good enough for the Blues bench? Or is the value of the jersey the same and RTS was good enough to make it?