New Zealand 2 will deal a massive blow to NZ rugby

[Perth Red]

Nzru annual report is due out anytime soon, will be interesting to see their financial performance and if it’s changed.

 

[The Great Dane]

It's weird, I kind of feel sorry for RU in NZ, if it really is struggling that is. I have no sympathy for RU in Australia though. The sport represents everything that is wrong with society - elitism, classist attitudes, nepotism, exclusivity. The crazy thing is that they don't seem to have even attempted to change their ways over the years. They are so stuck In their thinking that they are superior to RL simply because they are followed and played by by posh merkins and RL is followed and played by the riff raff.

Sure it manifests differently, but all the same could be said of RL in this country as well.

RL is dominated exclusively by a tight-knit old boys club, who are selected and promoted into power based on their connections and background. Any person who doesn't fit in that group that finds themselves in a position of power is hounded out as quickly as possible with accusations of not being a "RL person" and being incapable of understanding the game, etc (e.g. David Smith).

It largely heads in the other direction, but I don't think anybody reasonable would deny the classism that exists in traditional RL cycles in Australia. It's also undeniable that it's systematically stunted RL's growth and potential for generations.

The ARLC and NRL both run aggressively exclusive operations that are so blinkered that you may as well not exist if you live in the wrong post code. You're going to struggle to get ahead in RL if you live west of Bathurst or south of Wagga for example and good f**king luck if you live outside of NSW or Qld. How did it go again; “Forget wasting millions in rusted-on AFL states", or something like that.
Furthermore the NRL and RL organisations regularly participate in openly discriminatory practises and nobody with any power or a platform within the sport bats an eyelid, shit they'll openly try to justify their lack of principles with all sorts of irrational mental gymnastics. . . Cough, e.g. All Stars and indigenous carnivals, cough. . .

Elitism ✓
Classism ✓
Nepotism ✓
Exclusionary practices ✓

 

[final say]

Sure it manifests differently, but all the same could be said of RL in this country as well.

RL is dominated exclusively by a tight-knit old boys club, who are selected and promoted into power based on their connections and background. Any person who doesn't fit in that group that finds themselves in a position of power is hounded out as quickly as possible with accusations of not being a "RL person" and being incapable of understanding the game, etc (e.g. David Smith).

It largely heads in the other direction, but I don't think anybody reasonable would deny the classism that exists in traditional RL cycles in Australia. It's also undeniable that it's systematically stunted RL's growth and potential for generations.

The ARLC and NRL both run aggressively exclusive operations that are so blinkered that you may as well not exist if you live in the wrong post code. You're going to struggle to get ahead in RL if you live west of Bathurst or south of Wagga for example and good f**king luck if you live outside of NSW or Qld. How did it go again; “Forget wasting millions in rusted-on AFL states", or something like that.
Furthermore the NRL and RL organisations regularly participate in openly discriminatory practises and nobody with any power or a platform within the sport bats an eyelid, shit they'll openly try to justify their lack of principles with all sorts of irrational mental gymnastics. . . Cough, e.g. All Stars and indigenous carnivals, cough. . .

Elitism ✓
Classism ✓
Nepotism ✓
Exclusionary practices ✓

This is the biggest load of garbage in the history of the forum.

Rugby league is hands down the most inclusive sport on the planet!
I could literally give you hundreds of current players or staff that prove just that.

This post has no basis in reality.

 

[MugaB]

This is the biggest load of garbage in the history of the forum.

Rugby league is hands down the most inclusive sport on the planet!
I could literally give you hundreds of current players or staff that prove just that.

This post has no basis in reality.

Welcome to the insights of TGD, total windbaging and converluded to the max

 

[Canard]

Sure it manifests differently, but all the same could be said of RL in this country as well.

RL is dominated exclusively by a tight-knit old boys club, who are selected and promoted into power based on their connections and background. Any person who doesn't fit in that group that finds themselves in a position of power is hounded out as quickly as possible with accusations of not being a "RL person" and being incapable of understanding the game, etc (e.g. David Smith).

It largely heads in the other direction, but I don't think anybody reasonable would deny the classism that exists in traditional RL cycles in Australia. It's also undeniable that it's systematically stunted RL's growth and potential for generations.

The ARLC and NRL both run aggressively exclusive operations that are so blinkered that you may as well not exist if you live in the wrong post code. You're going to struggle to get ahead in RL if you live west of Bathurst or south of Wagga for example and good f**king luck if you live outside of NSW or Qld. How did it go again; “Forget wasting millions in rusted-on AFL states", or something like that.
Furthermore the NRL and RL organisations regularly participate in openly discriminatory practises and nobody with any power or a platform within the sport bats an eyelid, shit they'll openly try to justify their lack of principles with all sorts of irrational mental gymnastics. . . Cough, e.g. All Stars and indigenous carnivals, cough. . .

Elitism ✓
Classism ✓
Nepotism ✓
Exclusionary practices ✓

You only have to look at the fact that admitting another Sydney team is basically the number 1 expansion option being talked about in the RL media, fanbase and administrators

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Sure it manifests differently, but all the same could be said of RL in this country as well.

RL is dominated exclusively by a tight-knit old boys club, who are selected and promoted into power based on their connections and background. Any person who doesn't fit in that group that finds themselves in a position of power is hounded out as quickly as possible with accusations of not being a "RL person" and being incapable of understanding the game, etc (e.g. David Smith).

It largely heads in the other direction, but I don't think anybody reasonable would deny the classism that exists in traditional RL cycles in Australia. It's also undeniable that it's systematically stunted RL's growth and potential for generations.

The ARLC and NRL both run aggressively exclusive operations that are so blinkered that you may as well not exist if you live in the wrong post code. You're going to struggle to get ahead in RL if you live west of Bathurst or south of Wagga for example and good f**king luck if you live outside of NSW or Qld. How did it go again; “Forget wasting millions in rusted-on AFL states", or something like that.
Furthermore the NRL and RL organisations regularly participate in openly discriminatory practises and nobody with any power or a platform within the sport bats an eyelid, shit they'll openly try to justify their lack of principles with all sorts of irrational mental gymnastics. . . Cough, e.g. All Stars and indigenous carnivals, cough. . .

Elitism ✓
Classism ✓
Nepotism ✓
Exclusionary practices ✓

Defend Rugby Union at all costs

 

[mongoose]

Sure it manifests differently, but all the same could be said of RL in this country as well.

RL is dominated exclusively by a tight-knit old boys club, who are selected and promoted into power based on their connections and background. Any person who doesn't fit in that group that finds themselves in a position of power is hounded out as quickly as possible with accusations of not being a "RL person" and being incapable of understanding the game, etc (e.g. David Smith).

It largely heads in the other direction, but I don't think anybody reasonable would deny the classism that exists in traditional RL cycles in Australia. It's also undeniable that it's systematically stunted RL's growth and potential for generations.

The ARLC and NRL both run aggressively exclusive operations that are so blinkered that you may as well not exist if you live in the wrong post code. You're going to struggle to get ahead in RL if you live west of Bathurst or south of Wagga for example and good f**king luck if you live outside of NSW or Qld. How did it go again; “Forget wasting millions in rusted-on AFL states", or something like that.
Furthermore the NRL and RL organisations regularly participate in openly discriminatory practises and nobody with any power or a platform within the sport bats an eyelid, shit they'll openly try to justify their lack of principles with all sorts of irrational mental gymnastics. . . Cough, e.g. All Stars and indigenous carnivals, cough. . .

Elitism ✓
Classism ✓
Nepotism ✓
Exclusionary practices ✓

I get what you're saying but for RL I think it's more a lack of ambition and knowing it's place so to speak, which has been instilled over generations and partly helped along by Union types and probably even AFL types. Yes, I'm painting RL as a victim. The glass ceiling as steve mascord puts it.

 

[final say]

 

[flippikat]

Sure it manifests differently, but all the same could be said of RL in this country as well.

RL is dominated exclusively by a tight-knit old boys club, who are selected and promoted into power based on their connections and background. Any person who doesn't fit in that group that finds themselves in a position of power is hounded out as quickly as possible with accusations of not being a "RL person" and being incapable of understanding the game, etc (e.g. David Smith).

It largely heads in the other direction, but I don't think anybody reasonable would deny the classism that exists in traditional RL cycles in Australia. It's also undeniable that it's systematically stunted RL's growth and potential for generations.

The ARLC and NRL both run aggressively exclusive operations that are so blinkered that you may as well not exist if you live in the wrong post code. You're going to struggle to get ahead in RL if you live west of Bathurst or south of Wagga for example and good f**king luck if you live outside of NSW or Qld. How did it go again; “Forget wasting millions in rusted-on AFL states", or something like that.
Furthermore the NRL and RL organisations regularly participate in openly discriminatory practises and nobody with any power or a platform within the sport bats an eyelid, shit they'll openly try to justify their lack of principles with all sorts of irrational mental gymnastics. . . Cough, e.g. All Stars and indigenous carnivals, cough. . .

Elitism ✓
Classism ✓
Nepotism ✓
Exclusionary practices ✓

Exactly. Most places outside of NSW & Queensland are treated as an afterthought, or just some kind of amusement.

Especially if it's a big population centre without an NRL team (oh maybe you'll get a game or two each year.. maybe we'll expand sometime, maybe you'll be considered for those spots... blah blah blah)

 

[jim_57]

You only have to look at the fact that admitting another Sydney team is basically the number 1 expansion option being talked about in the RL media, fanbase and administrators

Another one that sticks out to me is any time recently when asked about stadiums V’landys says something along the lines of “we’re focusing on suburban stadiums, we’re built on tribalism, those stadiums are the heart and soul of those suburbs” etc.

Completely ignores over half the teams in the comp with those statements.

 

[final say]

Exactly. Most places outside of NSW & Queensland are treated as an afterthought, or just some kind of amusement.

Especially if it's a big population centre without an NRL team (oh maybe you'll get a game or two each year.. maybe we'll expand sometime, maybe you'll be considered for those spots... blah blah blah)

I don't think that's fair.
NSW and QLD make up more than half of Australia's population and like 90% of the NRL 's following , history and revenue.!..
The media in NSW and QLD.. shock horror.. write articles on... NSW and QLD and fans in NSW and QLD.. shock horror are interested in teams there..

If areas outside of there want attention and games, that's the responsibility of their Reporters, their public and their funding and their government..

Dispite this conflict of interest, we have games in Melbourne, Vegas, Fiji Christchurch and Hamilton.. Mudgee, Cairns and Mackay... Darwin..

 

[final say]

Another one that sticks out to me is any time recently when asked about stadiums V’landys says something along the lines of “we’re focusing on suburban stadiums, we’re built on tribalism, those stadiums are the heart and soul of those suburbs” etc.

Completely ignores over half the teams in the comp with those statements.

So you expect him to represent ALL areas in every media statement?? Ridiculous.
In other statements refers to the importance of the NZ market and PNG.. puts a game in Vegas ffs..

Cherry picking for some obscure confirmation biases much?

 

[flippikat]

I don't think that's fair.
NSW and QLD make up more than half of Australia's population and like 90% of the NRL 's following , history and revenue.!..
The media in NSW and QLD.. shock horror.. write articles on... NSW and QLD and fans in NSW and QLD.. shock horror are interested in teams there..

If areas outside of there want attention and games, that's the responsibility of their Reporters, their public and their funding and their government..

Dispite this conflict of interest, we have games in Melbourne, Vegas, Fiji Christchurch and Hamilton.. Mudgee, Cairns and Mackay... Darwin..

Yeah, but you don't GROW the game - and it's revenue - by concentrating mainly on somewhere that already delivers the vast majority of business.

As far as the games in far flung areas, that's all subject to the whims of clubs - just ask the folk of Adelaide who haven't had a game there in some time, or us in Wellington who've had our one game per year dropped as the Warriors get bedazzled by the prospect of that 1 game a year being in Christchurch's flash new covered stadium.

 

[final say]

Yeah, but you don't GROW the game - and it's revenue - by concentrating mainly on somewhere that already delivers the vast majority of business.

As far as the games in far flung areas, that's all subject to the whims of clubs - just ask the folk of Adelaide who haven't had a game there in some time, or us in Wellington who've had our one game per year dropped as the Warriors get bedazzled by the prospect of that 1 game a year being in Christchurch's flash new covered stadium.

I totally agree with most of what you've said. I think there periods of history here , nz and in the northern hemisphere that have done the opposite though in trying to grow to fast that has been at the detriment of the game - We really couldn't afford to carry those expansions and it's almost cost us the game entirely ( super rugby is only now learning this..)
We should appreciate that the current administration has learned those lessons and is making careful and calculated moves in the right direction I believe. Some can argue and rightly that we have room to grow wider and faster but it's a safety first I'm afraid.

NZ is the biggest most obviously neglected area that also represents Rugby league's biggest opportunity!
I'm the person advocating for immediate expansion across NZ !
Christchurch to me seems an obvious choice for another team but the frustration felt by those in Wellington should be redirected to local government in the form of a modern rectangular stadium.
If Wellington possessed adequate facilities, I don't we'd be having this discussion. In fact, if it had have possessed a te kah type stadium or plans to build one.. they could have been team 16 instead of the Gold Coast.

 

[flippikat]

I totally agree with most of what you've said. I think there periods of history here , nz and in the northern hemisphere that have done the opposite though in trying to grow to fast that has been at the detriment of the game - We really couldn't afford to carry those expansions and it's almost cost us the game entirely ( super rugby is only now learning this..)
We should appreciate that the current administration has learned those lessons and is making careful and calculated moves in the right direction I believe. Some can argue and rightly that we have room to grow wider and faster but it's a safety first I'm afraid.

NZ is the biggest most obviously neglected area that also represents Rugby league's biggest opportunity!
I'm the person advocating for immediate expansion across NZ !
Christchurch to me seems an obvious choice for another team but the frustration felt by those in Wellington should be redirected to local government in the form of a modern rectangular stadium.
If Wellington possessed adequate facilities, I don't we'd be having this discussion. In fact, if it had have possessed a te kah type stadium or plans to build one.. they could have been team 16 instead of the Gold Coast.

We honestly screwed-up by going "multi-use" for the railyards stadium (now known as Sky Stadium, Wellington)

It should have been a rectangular stadium, a direct replacement for Athletic Park - designed for footy codes only, with either a roof built-in from day 1 OR provision for one as a future development stage to be easily added.

Cricket already has a great ground in the Basin Reserve, a few new stands & decent floodlighting would have done the trick easily.

 

[SpaceMonkey]

We honestly screwed-up by going "multi-use" for the railyards stadium (now known as Sky Stadium, Wellington)

It should have been a rectangular stadium, a direct replacement for Athletic Park - designed for footy codes only, with either a roof built-in from day 1 OR provision for one as a future development stage to be easily added.

Cricket already has a great ground in the Basin Reserve, a few new stands & decent floodlighting would have done the trick easily.

Unfortunately that build happened at just the wrong time when multi use was still the trend. 5 years later and I think it’s have been a rectangular build.

 

[final say]

We honestly screwed-up by going "multi-use" for the railyards stadium (now known as Sky Stadium, Wellington)

It should have been a rectangular stadium, a direct replacement for Athletic Park - designed for footy codes only, with either a roof built-in from day 1 OR provision for one as a future development stage to be easily added.

Cricket already has a great ground in the Basin Reserve, a few new stands & decent floodlighting would have done the trick easily.

Yeah it's a real shame.

 

[flippikat]

Unfortunately that build happened at just the wrong time when multi use was still the trend. 5 years later and I think it’s have been a rectangular build.

Yeah, the decisions by Hamilton to keep dedicated cricket & rugby grounds & not combine them, and Dunedin to separate the two sports (moving from multi-use Carisbrook to Forsythe-Barr for footy and University Oval for cricket) were pivotal in our thinking re: stadium planning.

 

[final say]

Yeah, the decisions by Hamilton to keep dedicated cricket & rugby grounds & not combine them, and Dunedin to separate the two sports (moving from multi-use Carisbrook to Forsythe-Barr for footy and University Oval for cricket) were pivotal in our thinking re: stadium planning.

In 2008 we had 100 years of Rugby league and a test match between Australia and NZ was on that I went to. They held it at the SCG for nostalgic reasons.. I'll never attend a game of Rugby League again at a f**king oval! Couldn't see squat! Waste of money!
I can't blame anyone for being apprehensive towards any kind of expansion where the ground is oval...

 

[The Great Dane]

I get what you're saying but for RL I think it's more a lack of ambition and knowing it's place so to speak, which has been instilled over generations and partly helped along by Union types and probably even AFL types. Yes, I'm painting RL as a victim. The glass ceiling as steve mascord puts it.

That's a nice rationalisation, but it's wrong.

Basically every RL personality with a platform or in a position of power is traditionalist, parochial, and protectionist. The exceptions to that rule over the last century could be counted on your hands. It's not that they're incapable of broadening their scope and looking further afield, or that they lack ambition, it's that they simply don't care to do so.

I also think it's a massive stretch to blame RU, even more so the AFL, for those attitudes outside of a relative handful of very specific events and examples (e.g. WWII France) the majority of which aren't relevant to the Australian context.