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The KKK are a perversion of a generally peaceful faith (not people, faith).

Daesh are representative of a violent faith whereas the moderates (referred to as the "Muslims" in the second picture) are a perversion of a generally violent faith.

All that picture shows is that people cannot distinguish between the faith itself and certain groups who choose to practice it.
 

Gronk

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Like who? Saudi Arabia? Turkey? Egypt?

You mean the Sunni states that are taking advantage of the Sunni (Daesh) uprising to attack the minorities they have a qualm with (Houthi, Alawite, Kurds etc)?

Yet again you show that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

Or do you mean the Shia? (Do you even know who they are? Or the difference without having to go and read my previous posts or googling it before replying?)

Do you mean Iran? Is that who you mean? Or the Syrian government?

Which Arab states are going to do this, Gronk? Exactly which states. Be specific in your answer as to who and how.

LOL. Like I have the geopolitical answer for the middle east. It's been bubbling along forever. One thing I do know is that your interweb peacock strutting suggesting you "know" the answer is unconvincing to say the least. You don't, so get your hand off it.

I have listened and read a few things stated by those experienced in these international affairs and it seems that the way forward is for a negotiated cease fire in the Syrian civil war. That's no mean feat as they have been trying for 3 years. Once they have a cease fire they need to have a political solution to Assad, which may or may not involve removing him.

This is what they are doing at the G20 right now. Putin will play a big part in that solution.

The aim would be for millions of Syrians to return to their country and that they can feel safe.

An arab lead peace keeping force seems to be they way to go, they say, after that they are hopefully able to repopulate Syria and help them re-build. I read that some 8 million homes have been destroyed.

As for ISIS, who knows. There has been some success in the past week by Kurdish forces recapturing Sinjar based on a ground assault backed by US air strikes. Similar battles may well recapture more villages and cities, but it will do little to slow the terrorist momentum that they seem to have ATM.

ISIS, like Al Queda, will be eroded over time but probably never eliminated. Strong muslim leadership (from muftis and parents) is required there to stop their ability to recruit vulnerable and naive youths as easy as they have been.
 
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strider

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I saw a doco on tv once (might have been 60 minutes even) where a film crew with a kurdish group captured some ISIL merkins and interviewed them.

They said they intentionally used blunt knives when cutting people's heads off cos it would take longer and hurt more.

The day I saw that was the day I was convinced that these merkins can never be "tamed" or persuaded to stop their barbaric ways .... they are deranged f**kwits with truly evil f**ked up minds .... there is a massive difference between a soldier killing for what they think is a purpose and butchering people's heads off.

And tbh I fail to see how there will ever NOT be some group in the middle east doing evil shit .... every time one group of f**kwits gets knocked down the next group pops up ..... i think its dellusional to think thats ever going to stop
 

Twizzle

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Are you serious Twiz comparing the two? Does it have to be explained to you or are you deliberately being mischievous ?

ISIS are no more Muslims than the KKK are Christians, both hide behind a so called religion to try and justify their pathetic actions.

In other news Australia takes in its first round of Syrian refugees into Perth today.
 

Twizzle

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I saw a doco on tv once (might have been 60 minutes even) where a film crew with a kurdish group captured some ISIL merkins and interviewed them.

They said they intentionally used blunt knives when cutting people's heads off cos it would take longer and hurt more.

The day I saw that was the day I was convinced that these merkins can never be "tamed" or persuaded to stop their barbaric ways .... they are deranged f**kwits with truly evil f**ked up minds .... there is a massive difference between a soldier killing for what they think is a purpose and butchering people's heads off.

And tbh I fail to see how there will ever NOT be some group in the middle east doing evil shit .... every time one group of f**kwits gets knocked down the next group pops up ..... i think its dellusional to think thats ever going to stop

unintelligent, shallow, a void in their life, easily lead, brain washed

I could go on, not much else to do living in the desert
 

Gronk

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I saw a doco on tv once (might have been 60 minutes even) where a film crew with a kurdish group captured some ISIL merkins and interviewed them.

They said they intentionally used blunt knives when cutting people's heads off cos it would take longer and hurt more.

The day I saw that was the day I was convinced that these merkins can never be "tamed" or persuaded to stop their barbaric ways .... they are deranged f**kwits with truly evil f**ked up minds .... there is a massive difference between a soldier killing for what they think is a purpose and butchering people's heads off.

And tbh I fail to see how there will ever NOT be some group in the middle east doing evil shit .... every time one group of f**kwits gets knocked down the next group pops up ..... i think its dellusional to think thats ever going to stop

Agree. Those f**kers cannot be tamed.

I saw a doco about a lawyer to arranges for women to be freed from ISIS by using contacts within Raqqa and getting them out in darkness. The tales of systematic rape of young teenage girls was horrifying. They not only kidnap young girls to use as sex slaves, but they also kidnap older women and keep them alive for blood donation.
 

strider

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why aren't the KKK christians? ..... they follow the faith - they are christians - they are also merkins

people shouldn't get all defensive of their faith/religion because there are f**kwits who also follow it .... they need to accept that following that faith doesn't automatically make you something special
 

Twizzle

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They are not Christians, they cherry pick certain things that suit their agenda. Christians dont kill and slaughter black people.

They call themselves Christians but they don't act like Christians, any more than ISIS pretend to be Muslims. ISIS have killed more Muslims than non Muslims.
 

strider

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unintelligent, shallow, a void in their life, easily lead, brain washed

I could go on, not much else to do living in the desert

so what's ever going to stop that? ... we'll go and build them some rec centres in the middle of the desert like we do in western sydney? .... cool

to me there seems to be far too many people being readily brain washed - and obviously they are not all from the desert
 

Gronk

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why aren't the KKK christians? ..... they follow the faith - they are christians - they are also merkins

people shouldn't get all defensive of their faith/religion because there are f**kwits who also follow it .... they need to accept that following that faith doesn't automatically make you something special

Agree. Let's not forget the horrific crimes in Northern Ireland between the Protestants and Catholics.

Then you have the murder of women and Drs in the USA surrounding abortion clinics.

Thank f**k the merkins at Westboro church do not follow up their hate with actions like ISIS. They hate everyone too.

westboro.jpg
 

Twizzle

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so what's ever going to stop that? ... we'll go and build them some rec centres in the middle of the desert like we do in western sydney? .... cool

to me there seems to be far too many people being readily brain washed -

From what I have read form our military "experts" we should have stayed and done the job properly ie: complete obliteration. There were enough left in IRAQ to fester and recruit new members and like you said, called them what you like all sorts of different names and labels at the end of the day, they are just terrorists

strider said:
and obviously they are not all from the desert

yeh, true, but thats where they all originate
 

strider

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They are not Christians, they cherry pick certain things that suit their agenda. Christians dont kill and slaughter black people.

They call themselves Christians but they don't act like Christians, any more than ISIS pretend to be Muslims. ISIS have killed more Muslims than non Muslims.

I saw a small bit of that Q&A show last night ... and the dude on the end of the panel said - don't discount religion in all this, its a very strong motivating force ..... I agree

what i've seen of religious texts, they are all over the f**kin place and people are just constantly interpretting them .... some chose to interpret bits they want - pick and chose what suits their purpose - they are still following what they believe is the religion, even if others don't think so
 

Parra47

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I saw a doco on tv once (might have been 60 minutes even) where a film crew with a kurdish group captured some ISIL merkins and interviewed them.

They said they intentionally used blunt knives when cutting people's heads off cos it would take longer and hurt more.

The day I saw that was the day I was convinced that these merkins can never be "tamed" or persuaded to stop their barbaric ways .... they are deranged f**kwits with truly evil f**ked up minds .... there is a massive difference between a soldier killing for what they think is a purpose and butchering people's heads off.

And tbh I fail to see how there will ever NOT be some group in the middle east doing evil shit .... every time one group of f**kwits gets knocked down the next group pops up ..... i think its dellusional to think thats ever going to stop
Agreed. And so bloody ordinary to see some people are almost seeming to find excuses to defend their pure evil.
 

Gronk

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Can you believe that it's been revealed this AM that both Ch7 & Ch9 morning shows are paying Pauline Hanson for her commentary on this issue ?

Would love to hear their reasons. In the public interest ? A necessary contribution to the debate or ratings at any cost ?
 

Suitman

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My take on this is that this is a war that cannot be won.
I think it was George Bush Snr who coined the phrase "War on Terror".
Any day, any time, anywhere, they can strike. It is impossible to know when and where, even though we know why.
They are an enemy that will always be prevalent, no matter how many air strike sorties are flown, or how many sleeper cells are flushed out and eliminated.
It is a fruitless exercise to attempt to win this "war". We will never win. But neither will they. They will continue to be an inconvenient, destructive nuisance for as long as we all live. Munich and Entebbe were just the beginning 50 years ago, and we are no closer to overpowering terrorism than we were then.
Sadly, this is the world we now live in.
The only weapon I have is vigilance.

Suity
 

Gronk

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I was held hostage by Isis. They fear our unity more than our airstrikes

Nicolas Hénin

As a proud frenchman i am as distressed as anyone about the events in paris. But i am not shocked or incredulous. I know islamic state. I spent 10 months as an isis hostage, and i know for sure that our pain, our grief, our hopes, our lives do not touch them. Theirs is a world apart.
Most people only know them from their propaganda material, but i have seen behind that. In my time as their captive, i met perhaps a dozen of them, including mohammed emwazi: Jihadi john was one of my jailers. He nicknamed me “baldy”.

7235440.jpg


even now i sometimes chat with them on social media, and can tell you that much of what you think of them results from their brand of marketing and public relations. They present themselves to the public as superheroes, but away from the camera are a bit pathetic in many ways: Street kids drunk on ideology and power. In france we have a saying – stupid and evil. I found them more stupid than evil. That is not to understate the murderous potential of stupidity.
All of those beheaded last year were my cellmates, and my jailers would play childish games with us – mental torture – saying one day that we would be released and then two weeks later observing blithely, “tomorrow we will kill one of you.” the first couple of times we believed them but after that we came to realise that for the most part they were bullshitters having fun with us.
They would play mock executions. Once they used chloroform with me. Another time it was a beheading scene. A bunch of french-speaking jihadis were shouting, “we’re going to cut your head off and put it on to your arse and upload it to youtube.” they had a sword from an antique shop.
They were laughing and i played the game by screaming, but they just wanted fun. As soon as they left i turned to another of the french hostages and just laughed. It was so ridiculous.

After all that happened to me, i still don’t feel isis is the priority. To my mind, assad is the priority

it struck me forcefully how technologically connected they are; they follow the news obsessively, but everything they see goes through their own filter. They are totally indoctrinated, clinging to all manner of conspiracy theories, never acknowledging the contradictions.
Everything convinces them that they are on the right path and, specifically, that there is a kind of apocalyptic process under way that will lead to a confrontation between an army of muslims from all over the world and others, the crusaders, the romans. They see everything as moving us down that road. Consequently, everything is a blessing from allah.
With their news and social media interest, they will be noting everything that follows their murderous assault on paris, and my guess is that right now the chant among them will be “we are winning”. They will be heartened by every sign of overreaction, of division, of fear, of racism, of xenophobia; they will be drawn to any examples of ugliness on social media.

Central to their world view is the belief that communities cannot live together with muslims, and every day their antennae will be tuned towards finding supporting evidence. The pictures from germany of people welcoming migrants will have been particularly troubling to them. Cohesion, tolerance – it is not what they want to see.
Why france? For many reasons perhaps, but i think they identified my country as a weak link in europe – as a place where divisions could be sown easily. That’s why, when i am asked how we should respond, i say that we must act responsibly.
And yet more bombs will be our response. I am no apologist for isis. How could i be? But everything i know tells me this is a mistake. The bombardment will be huge, a symbol of righteous anger. Within 48 hours of the atrocity, fighter planes conducted their most spectacular munitions raid yet in syria, dropping more than 20 bombs on raqqa, an isis stronghold. Revenge was perhaps inevitable, but what’s needed is deliberation. My fear is that this reaction will make a bad situation worse.
While we are trying to destroy isis, what of the 500,000 civilians still living and trapped in raqqa? What of their safety? What of the very real prospect that by failing to think this through, we turn many of them into extremists? The priority must be to protect these people, not to take more bombs to syria. We need no-fly zones – zones closed to russians, the regime, the coalition. The syrian people need security or they themselves will turn to groups such as isis.
Canada withdrew from the air war after the election of justin trudeau. I desperately want france to do the same, and rationality tells me it could happen. But pragmatism tells me it won’t. The fact is we are trapped: Isis has trapped us. They came to paris with kalashnikovs, claiming that they wanted to stop the bombing, but knowing all too well that the attack would force us to keep bombing or even to intensify these counterproductive attacks. That is what is happening.
Emwazi is gone now, killed in a coalition air strike, his death celebrated in parliament. I do not mourn him. But during his murder spree, he too followed this double bluff strategy. After murdering the american journalist james foley, he pointed his knife at the camera and, turning to the next intended victim, said: “obama, you must stop intervening in the middle east or i will kill him.” he knew very well what the hostage’s fate would be. He knew very well what the american reaction would be – more bombing. It’s what isis wants, but should we be giving it to them?
The group is wicked, of that there is no doubt. But after all that happened to me, i still don’t feel isis is the priority. To my mind, bashar al-assad is the priority. The syrian president is responsible for the rise of isis in syria, and so long as his regime is in place, isis cannot be eradicated. Nor can we stop the attacks on our streets. When people say “isis first, and then assad”, i say don’t believe them. They just want to keep assad in place.
At the moment there is no political road map and no plan to engage the arab sunni community. Isis will collapse, but politics will make that happen. In the meantime there is much we can achieve in the aftermath of this atrocity, and the key is strong hearts and resilience, for that is what they fear. I know them: Bombing they expect. What they fear is unity.

http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...-islamic-state-paris-attacks?CMP=share_btn_tw
 
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