OT: Current Affairs and Politics

[the phantom menace]

Whatever that stampy thing is, I dont like it!

We should make it the new club mascot, might scare some energy into our squad!

 

[Gronk]

Sorry to hijack, but I was mowing the lawns yesterday and doing my best to avoid NRL podcasts .

So I was listening to Stephen Fry on Audible read a f**k ton of short stories that chronologically developing the character of sherlock holmes, narrated by Dr watson. They were not even books in the early days, as they were novellas, published in magazines equivalent to The Bulletin or Readers Digest.

Don’t we all jump on the result and try and find facts to suit our narrative? Sherlock knew as much 130 years ago.

“It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts.”

Sherlock Holmes (well Arthur Conan Doyle)

-A Scandal in Bohemia 1891

 

[Gronk]

John Farnham lends his Voice in key moment for 'yes' campaign

Singer John Farnham has given permission for his anthemic song You're the Voice to become the soundtrack for the 'yes' campaign, saying he hopes it will

thenewdaily.com.au

 

[Gronk]

https://x.com/mikesington/status/1697997762607079745?s=61&t=q0pzBgfp65RbZZanL3hgyw

Trump throws Eric under the bus in his deposition. Happy Father’s Day.

 

[Bandwagon]

Cmon, Barry OFarrell and Nick Greiner stood down for what seemed like less, the Labor Party are incessant on their calls when they see an opportunity. Then again I think Minns is a used car salesman and Albo makes ScoMo look good, and as for Bowen .

Like it or not O'farrell perjured himself at ICAC giving testimony, the "it was just a bottle of wine" argument doesn't hold, because it wasn't the bottle of wine that brought him undone, it was lying about it.

As for Greiner, the circumstances were he gave Metherell (ex Liberal now independent ), a sitting member a plum job, that would preclude him from continuing to sit as a member, thus forcing a bye-election the Liberals expected to win handsomely, and increasing their numbers in the house.

Now I guess you could interpret that as "seems like less", but faced with the facts of the matters that seems more like partisan hackery than balanced judgement.

 

[Twizzle]

Because Suity has an obsession

 

[strider]

A lot what you say seems to side with the Russian side (propaganda ?) and that may or may not be true.

I have found a detailed essay on the war, which includes a history going back to the break up of the union, the changing regimes in Ukraine and what the looming admission to NATO meant to Russia.

I have also found some sources about the claimed persecution of pro-russian citizens in the dombas and on the neo-nazi thing.

These are not definitive sources, they are a starting point to get to the bottom of it. If you feel inclined to share your sources that offer a counter argument, then great. I have some interest in this because TBH someone in my circle recently said to me that “Ukraine started the War with Russia” . I asked him how that happened and he responded that he didn’t know, it was just what he had heard. I find that fascinating.

Was it inevitable? A short history of Russia’s war on Ukraine | Keith Gessen

The long read: To understand the tragedy of this war, it is worth going back beyond the last few weeks and months, and even beyond Vladimir Putin, writes Keith Gessen

www.theguardian.com

Vladimir Putin repeats false claim of genocide in Ukraine

Russia has given several reasons for launching a war against Ukraine. In a televised address announcing the military ass

www.politifact.com

Opinion | Ukraine's Nazi problem is real, even if Putin's 'denazification' claim isn't

Not acknowledging this threat means that little is being done to guard against it.

www.nbcnews.com

Russian Militia Has Links to American Neo-Nazi and Anti-Trans Figures

The leader of the anti-Putin Russian Volunteer Corps is publicly connected to American neo-Nazis Robert Rundo and Christopher Pohlhaus.

theintercept.com

Is there any truth to Russia's 'Ukrainian Nazis' propaganda? – DW – 12/03/2022

Russian propagandists are constantly saying Ukraine is full of Nazis, and posting alleged evidence online. DW's fact-checking team has investigated some of this supposed evidence.

www.dw.com

Commentary: Ukraine’s neo-Nazi problem

As Ukraine's struggle against Russia and its proxies continues, Kiev must also contend with a growing problem behind the front lines: far-right vigilantes who are willing to use intimidation and even violence to advance their agendas, and who often do so with the tacit approval of law...

www.reuters.com

I already posted links when we discussed this about a year ago. Feel free to go back find em and read em ... pretty sure the reuters link you posted was one of em.

You genuinely think only 1 side spreads propaganda? That whatever side you've chosen to land on is clean with no fibs to push their cause?

I have no doubt the russians talk shit .... and that putin is a merkin .... i also believe the usa, their powerful war machine and their heavily funded msm push their own agendas - ie propaganda. But we just lap it up cos they are "the good guys".

 

[Gronk]

I already posted links when we discussed this about a year ago. Feel free to go back find em and read em ... pretty sure the reuters link you posted was one of em.

You genuinely think only 1 side spreads propaganda? That whatever side you've chosen to land on is clean with no fibs to push their cause?

I have no doubt the russians talk shit .... and that putin is a merkin .... i also believe the usa, their powerful war machine and their heavily funded msm push their own agendas - ie propaganda. But we just lap it up cos they are "the good guys".

Ok I tried.

 

[Gronk]

A waste of money, I hear you say ?

https://x.com/6newsau/status/1698125940705112138?s=61&t=q0pzBgfp65RbZZanL3hgyw

 

[Eelogical]

A waste of money, I hear you say ?

https://x.com/6newsau/status/1698125940705112138?s=61&t=q0pzBgfp65RbZZanL3hgyw

View attachment 78878

Sure, if it’s a stand alone referendum and not tagged onto a federal election, which was my original point regardless of the topic at hand. From what I can see ol‘ mate Dutton is having a bet each way, a recognition without a voice. My own personal opinion is that if the country votes yes, then so be it. If no, then let it be and get on with what they were elected to do - governing the country.

 

[bazza]

Sure, if it’s a stand alone referendum and not tagged onto a federal election, which was my original point regardless of the topic at hand. From what I can see ol‘ mate Dutton is having a bet each way, a recognition without a voice. My own personal opinion is that if the country votes yes, then so be it. If no, then let it be and get on with what they were elected to do - governing the country.

It isn't like Pete is actually going to have another referendum if this one doesn't get up and he somehow becomes PM

 

[King-Gutho94]

I hope the watchdog ACCC absolute whack Qantas with both barrells.

What a scum/arrogant corporation they have become.

 

[Gronk]

I hope the watchdog ACCC absolute whack Qantas with both barrells.

What a scum/arrogant corporation they have become.

Selling tickets to already cancelled flights ? It's either incompetence or criminal. Take your pick.

 

[hindy111]

I already posted links when we discussed this about a year ago. Feel free to go back find em and read em ... pretty sure the reuters link you posted was one of em.

You genuinely think only 1 side spreads propaganda? That whatever side you've chosen to land on is clean with no fibs to push their cause?

I have no doubt the russians talk shit .... and that putin is a merkin .... i also believe the usa, their powerful war machine and their heavily funded msm push their own agendas - ie propaganda. But we just lap it up cos they are "the good guys".

In all the movies they make they are the heroes and save everyone.
But in saying that I still prefer the Yanks in control over China.

As far as economies go people think China is unstoppable. I personally don't think so. I think they have huge issues. One being the younger population don't want to have kids. They want the good life. Their system has also been set up for the industrial revolution. And well the next gen are all to educated and these jobs are beneath them. It's why factory workers their get paid more now then kids with degrees. They can't get cheap workers anymore. While other nations like India and Brasil are able to make things cheaper.
If an empire is going to crumble and fast I think China is at huge risk. It's probably not good for nations who are reliant on them either and that means us.

I've also wondered why Australia seems so interested now in stepping up their defense. Part of me think if China does crumble they might just go out with a bang and attack and that is our fear. While they are able to dominate economically everyone is happy. But what happens if their economy folds?

 

[Gronk]

I've also wondered why Australia seems so interested now in stepping up their defense.

What “Utopia” got wrong about China and defence policy | Lowy Institute

If Australia didn’t have a Defence Force, would China have turned to force rather than economic coercion?

www.lowyinstitute.org

Let’s reduce this issue to its essentials. Trade is what happens when one country wants something valuable from another. That “something” could be iron ore, or wine, or live cattle. But it could equally be that one government (Country A) wants another government (Country B) to do something. Maybe A wants to stop B from allying with a third party, or it wants B not to produce nuclear weapons. Whatever the motivation, when Country A wants something that Country B is not prepared to give away for free, then Country A has two options: it can negotiate with B, or it can coerce B, including with threats of force and even the use of force, if threats alone don’t work.

Even against defenceless countries, making violent threats is costly and risky.
Faced with this choice, Country A must decide which option is likely to get them what they want at the lowest cost. And one thing they need to weigh up is whether B can withstand and even retaliate to coercion. That’s what B’s armed forces are for. They exist to raise the potential cost of making threats, and thus to take that option off the table for A.

In other words, armed forces are necessary to incentivise foreign governments away from coercion and towards negotiation.

 

[Gronk]

These are allegations, so not facts.

MBS is Mohammed bin Salman, the Crown Prince.

 

[Twizzle]

It's why factory workers their get paid more now then kids with degrees. They can't get cheap workers anymore. While other nations like India and Brasil are able to make things cheaper.

well that's certainly not my experience and I deal with China on a daily basis, I gave up on India some time ago

China and India are chalk and cheese, India are all about the money and a certain amount of dishonesty, China has much more integrity and care about their product and I find their pricing much better not to mention their quality

 

[Chipmunk]

What “Utopia” got wrong about China and defence policy | Lowy Institute

If Australia didn’t have a Defence Force, would China have turned to force rather than economic coercion?

www.lowyinstitute.org

Let’s reduce this issue to its essentials. Trade is what happens when one country wants something valuable from another. That “something” could be iron ore, or wine, or live cattle. But it could equally be that one government (Country A) wants another government (Country B) to do something. Maybe A wants to stop B from allying with a third party, or it wants B not to produce nuclear weapons. Whatever the motivation, when Country A wants something that Country B is not prepared to give away for free, then Country A has two options: it can negotiate with B, or it can coerce B, including with threats of force and even the use of force, if threats alone don’t work.

Even against defenceless countries, making violent threats is costly and risky.
Faced with this choice, Country A must decide which option is likely to get them what they want at the lowest cost. And one thing they need to weigh up is whether B can withstand and even retaliate to coercion. That’s what B’s armed forces are for. They exist to raise the potential cost of making threats, and thus to take that option off the table for A.

In other words, armed forces are necessary to incentivise foreign governments away from coercion and towards negotiation.

I believe what you describe here is the entire premise of what is classified as foreign aid, which in it's complex ways is just trying to buy influence.

 

[Chipmunk]

In all the movies they make they are the heroes and save everyone.
But in saying that I still prefer the Yanks in control over China.

As far as economies go people think China is unstoppable. I personally don't think so. I think they have huge issues. One being the younger population don't want to have kids. They want the good life. Their system has also been set up for the industrial revolution. And well the next gen are all to educated and these jobs are beneath them. It's why factory workers their get paid more now then kids with degrees. They can't get cheap workers anymore. While other nations like India and Brasil are able to make things cheaper.
If an empire is going to crumble and fast I think China is at huge risk. It's probably not good for nations who are reliant on them either and that means us.

I've also wondered why Australia seems so interested now in stepping up their defense. Part of me think if China does crumble they might just go out with a bang and attack and that is our fear. While they are able to dominate economically everyone is happy. But what happens if their economy folds?

Good post. China has a few issues in it's future. It's demographics is not in the best shape as you have described.

ASEAN countries is where it's all going to happen for the rest of the century, and I think we have strong and even growing ties here that are going to help our cause.

 

[Gronk]

I believe what you describe here is the entire premise of what is classified as foreign aid, which in it's complex ways is just trying to buy influence.

I didn't describe anything. It's the lowy institute and their essay on why we need to keep up with the joneses.