Parramatta Eels sign Josh Papalii for 2014

[hybrideel]

400k is the upper limit of what i think he's worth in the salary cap. If we can organise another 100k in 3rd parties to keep him, great. (and in fairness for all i know of Parra's 500k deal, $150k of it could be third party which makes the 330-350k reasonable from their perspective)

IF we match parra's offer dollar to dollar against our cap and it's 500k against our cap. We've paid overs. Simply as that.

That could be where the differing figures come from. One is quoting salary cap figures where another is including 3rd party. BTW i wasn't referring to you, more some of the comments on the NRL thread

 

[bartman]

:lol: "saga"... the quotes were there at the start of the media coverage!

Signed sealed and (almost) delivered - just a few Canberra journos and club officials madly trying to save face (perhaps ahead of club elections?).

 

[parra pete]

Pete I've heard this to but the story I've heard is that they're upset that he insists on showering with the team after games .

You would not find a more respected bloke in the NRL than Dave Furner. Strong person..good bloke, excellent coach....and a good family man...Don't come much better than him, he is a straight shooter, and that's what I like about him as a coach, and as a bloke..

 

[Pete Cash]

you assume everything you read from a Canberra journo is fact and now you are doing the same with your CEO

the bloke is clearly trying to save face and make it look like Parra broke the bank in getting him to sign

I'm going off a direct quote from Ken Edwards where he said Stuart told papalii to take parras contract back to the raiders and we quote didn't get near it.

Unless....your own club is also trying to make it seem like you broke the bank for some reason I think its time to accept that you guys did break the bank (third party top ups withstanding)

 

[Pete Cash]

:lol: "saga"... the quotes were there at the start of the media coverage!

Signed sealed and (almost) delivered - just a few Canberra journos and club officials madly trying to save face (perhaps ahead of club elections?).

Club elections at the raiders lmao. If there is one club that doesn't really care what the fans thinks its the raiders. This is the same board that said furner could lose 30 games in a row and he is safe.

 

[bartman]

Bartman, i'd love to hear the sound grabs of those words... And i mean this entirely as not to offend Josh, but anyone who has heard the guy speak to the media will tell you those are very strange quotes.

Given he wasnt there at the media conference, but was in Canberra preparing for a trail, i might suggest that when he signed the deal, some two weeks ago (before perhaps his 2nd thoughts come into play) his manager drafted a written statement and Papalii signed it to be read out at the appropriate time.

Mate, that's how the whole thing works these days. You don't give your ok (in front of your mum!) for a media release with quotes to go out unless it's a done deal. Waiting for sound grabs is of little consequence these days, when it's kids that aren't used to fronting the media etc.

You can deny it if you like. Say we're in denial at losing a talented footballer. Both fan bases can play the denial game against the other if they choose, but the facts are if it was as clear cut and dry as you are pretending, we wouldnt be having this dicussion.

Happened heaps of times to us, lost promising players early signing with other clubs - you can't keep them all every time. It's just that the current rules provide uncertainty until Round 13 or June 13 or whatever it is.... As Gold said, when it's us we get angry and the people in the club that slipped up!

The longer Papalii stays mum on this, the more it seems like the Raiders side of things, has serious merit.

Nah, imo it just means he doesn't want to cause any more of a stir amongst his playing mates and current employers than signing the next deal already has - do you blame him for staying silent now, and trying to focus on his footy while his home club run around chasing their tail?

 

[Raider_69]

http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/league-news/papalii-picks-parramatta-20130222-2ex7t.html

:lol:nah i can't see the similarities

As your own man admitted, a bloke who has experience in comms and media. It is not uncommon for someone to have ok'd a pre prepared to be released at a certain time. In fact it's extremely common.

I'm saying that Papalii might have accepted Canberra couldnt match the offer, not knowing his manager had not really kept the Raiders correctly informed, made his decision to sign with Parramatta, ok'd the statement and since that time (2 weeks ago is when it seems he signed the deal) Canberra have since come to the party and have up'd their offer and working on upping it further, which has Papalii now having 2nd thoughts.

If he wasnt having second thoughts, why wouldnt he talk to a journo and say "all this stuff is nonsense mate, im heading to parra, end of story"... my gut feeling is he's staying quiet on advise from his manager... and there is no reason to do that unless he is keen for the Raiders to get a deal for him... and if that's what he wants he would be ill advised to state so publically because if the Raiders cant do the deal, he's already pissed off his future employer and their fan base before he's even started there.

That could be where the differing figures come from. One is quoting salary cap figures where another is including 3rd party. BTW i wasn't referring to you, more some of the comments on the NRL thread

i think there is a reasonable chance you are right. The 500k a yer might be total value, where as the 330-350k mark is maybe what is costed to Parra's salary cap. At this stage no one really knows what's going on, other than there is clearly more to this story than an open and shut signing.

Im not saying he will be playing for the Raiders in 2014. In fact i think the favourite right now is him going to Parra, but if we can find the money to match parra's offer, it changes the ball park and it becomes a choice of where Papalii would rather be. Money is no longer an issue.

The Raiders are working hard to give him that choice, and by virtue of that hard work, pressure on him to stay. Parramatta are putting pressure on him to come via media releases and the CEO coming out stomping his foot about how it's all locked up and no issues despite knowing his contract isnt worth a pinch of shit until Round 13.

 

[Joshuatheeel]

I'm with the Raider bloke.

Nothing demonstrates Josh's firm commitment to stay in Canberra than signing a three year deal with another club and releasing a media statement about looking forward to joining them.

It's like he has committed to the green machine for life when you think about it.

:lol::lol:

Gee this saga makes me realise how good Souths fans took it when we signed sandow

 

[El Diablo]

As your own man admitted, a bloke who has experience in comms and media. It is not uncommon for someone to have ok'd a pre prepared to be released at a certain time. In fact it's extremely common.

I'm saying that Papalii might have accepted Canberra couldnt match the offer, not knowing his manager had not really kept the Raiders correctly informed, made his decision to sign with Parramatta, ok'd the statement and since that time (2 weeks ago is when it seems he signed the deal) Canberra have since come to the party and have up'd their offer and working on upping it further, which has Papalii now having 2nd thoughts.

If he wasnt having second thoughts, why wouldnt he talk to a journo and say "all this stuff is nonsense mate, im heading to parra, end of story"... my gut feeling is he's staying quiet on advise from his manager... and there is no reason to do that unless he is keen for the Raiders to get a deal for him... and if that's what he wants he would be ill advised to state so publically because if the Raiders cant do the deal, he's already pissed off his future employer and their fan base before he's even started there.



i think there is a reasonable chance you are right. The 500k a yer might be total value, where as the 330-350k mark is maybe what is costed to Parra's salary cap. At this stage no one really knows what's going on, other than there is clearly more to this story than an open and shut signing.

Im not saying he will be playing for the Raiders in 2014. In fact i think the favourite right now is him going to Parra, but if we can find the money to match parra's offer, it changes the ball park and it becomes a choice of where Papalii would rather be. Money is no longer an issue.

The Raiders are working hard to give him that choice, and by virtue of that hard work, pressure on him to stay. Parramatta are putting pressure on him to come via media releases and the CEO coming out stomping his foot about how it's all locked up and no issues despite knowing his contract isnt worth a pinch of shit until Round 13.

still with conspiracy theory

there is not one quote attributed to him saying he has had second thoughts yet you believe this over quotes saying he's leaving :lol:

 

[Raider_69]

Happened heaps of times to us, lost promising players early signing with other clubs - you can't keep them all every time. It's just that the current rules provide uncertainty until Round 13 or June 13 or whatever it is.... As Gold said, when it's us we get angry and the people in the club that slipped up! /QUOTE]

Couldnt agree more, and if he sticks true to his deal with you guys, ill say well done to you and good luck to him. Got nothing against the kid for leaving or against Parra for identifying a talent and going out and getting him. That's business. As you say, we cant keep them all. We've offered a fair and reasonable deal, and we're trying to get more, if we cant or even if we can and he decides he's a man of principle or he is just dead keen on the oppertunity there and wants to honor the Parramatta deal, so be it. That's life.

You wont hear me complaining about Parra pinching our guys, or bagging Papalii... All im saying is that it's not a done deal yet and my club are fighting tooth and nail to keep him... if the kid genuinely wasnt interested in staying at the Raiders, why would we bother? We'd put our energies into Sam Williams, Jared Croker and Joel Thompson.

I dont know where he'll be playing in 2014, but all im saying is i dont think you guys should count your chickens quite yet. There is some irregularities with this thing that dont add up for this to be an open and shut case of him definitely heading to Parramatta, and it seems very much as if the Raiders believe if they get the money together, they will get their man.

We'll see how it shakes out. Which ever way it goes, someone has got one hell of a football player and this ridiculous round 13 rule needs to change.

 

[Raider_69]

still with conspiracy theory

there is not one quote attributed to him saying he has had second thoughts yet you believe this over quotes saying he's leaving :lol:

I believe in looking at the case and following the logic.

Why would the Raiders be working over time to arrange 3rd party deal's for Papalii unless they thought there was a genuine chance it might help them keep him? We are a public service town, very little corporate dollars... it wouldnt make much sense to pass the cap around to what few companies are willing for a bloke who's signed for another team, unless there is genuine reason to believe it may help retain him.

No conspiracy theory. Just logic. Keep burying your head El Diablo and pretending the tug of war isnt happening. But it is. And at this stage is could very conceivably go either way (though i concede Parra are well in front but we are chasing hard). Maybe when you pull it out, this will all be over and he'll be yours... or maybe we wont. I tend to think we'll know sooner, rather than later

 

[bartman]

Sure, all good.

You wont hear me complaining about Parra pinching our guys, or bagging Papalii... All im saying is that it's not a done deal yet and my club are fighting tooth and nail to keep him... if the kid genuinely wasnt interested in staying at the Raiders, why would we bother? We'd put our energies into Sam Williams, Jared Croker and Joel Thompson.
To save face? To try and show those other guys (who I presume haven't had negotiations opened with them yet either) that your club does care about locking them up and is capable of getting organised so they don't have to take the first good offer that comes their way? When are your club elections due again? Enough reasons?

I don't think anyone's counting their chickens, but the player, his agent and his mum have all agreed to terms after apparently giving Canberra the final option.... It'll be a massive turnaround for the kid to do the dirty on the contract now, and - apart from the reasons above - I wouldn't get too excited about why your club is appearing to convince him to stay.

We'll see how it shakes out. Which ever way it goes, someone has got one hell of a football player and this ridiculous round 13 rule needs to change.

Agree. When the same thing happens to the next player - maybe one of ours, maybe another one of yours - it should be enough for the ARLC to realise the f**k-up.

 

[bartman]

Club elections at the raiders lmao. If there is one club that doesn't really care what the fans thinks its the raiders. This is the same board that said furner could lose 30 games in a row and he is safe.

Ah, so not a very active membership base then? Oh well....

 

[El Diablo]

I believe in looking at the case and following the logic.

Why would the Raiders be working over time to arrange 3rd party deal's for Papalii unless they thought there was a genuine chance it might help them keep him? We are a public service town, very little corporate dollars... it wouldnt make much sense to pass the cap around to what few companies are willing for a bloke who's signed for another team, unless there is genuine reason to believe it may help retain him.

No conspiracy theory. Just logic. Keep burying your head El Diablo and pretending the tug of war isnt happening. But it is. And at this stage is could very conceivably go either way (though i concede Parra are well in front but we are chasing hard). Maybe when you pull it out, this will all be over and he'll be yours... or maybe we wont. I tend to think we'll know sooner, rather than later

it looks like the corporates got involved on their own and not by request of the Faiders

why didn't they care till now?

Papalii should have a good luck at the way your mob have treated him

like dirt

 

[Raider_69]

Mate, that's how the whole thing works these days. You don't give your ok (in front of your mum!) for a media release with quotes to go out unless it's a done deal. Waiting for sound grabs is of little consequence these days, when it's kids that aren't used to fronting the media etc.

Nah, imo it just means he doesn't want to cause any more of a stir amongst his playing mates and current employers than signing the next deal already has - do you blame him for staying silent now, and trying to focus on his footy while his home club run around chasing their tail?

On the first point, i would agree. Except i suspect that statement was drafted before the current issues were raised. Current issue's being Canberra's revised contract and attempts to get 3rd party deals. Which takes the dollars and cents away from it, and it comes back to where he'd prefer to be.
You guys cited T-rex earlier, how he was really desperate to stay but ultimately you guys couldnt get it done, do you think had you guys been able to find the cash to match Manly's offer, he'd have left? I dont think so. That's where i think we stand with Papalii, if we can match, he might stay. If we cant, he will be gone.

2nd point. That could be the case but local journo's with proven track records of knowing what is going on inside canberra camp, not one of them, about 3-4 of them, have all suggested their sources are saying he's having 2nd thoughts. He might well be just focusing on football and this is all one big smoke storm... but there is a hell of a lot of smoke for no fire in that case, wouldnt you agree?

We've got journo's talking about him having 2nd thoughts, we've got reports of his manager misleading the raiders on his offer, we've got 3rd parties rallying to the cause and we've got a Raiders CEO saying yesterday it's his belief Papalii wants to stay and we're very committed to getting the dollars together to make that possible..

A lot of smoke Bartman.

 

[bartman]

On the first point, i would agree. Except i suspect that statement was drafted before the current issues were raised. Current issue's being Canberra's revised contract and attempts to get 3rd party deals. Which takes the dollars and cents away from it, and it comes back to where he'd prefer to be.

Why didn't the Raiders do that for him first time around though?

You guys cited T-rex earlier, how he was really desperate to stay but ultimately you guys couldnt get it done, do you think had you guys been able to find the cash to match Manly's offer, he'd have left? I dont think so. That's where i think we stand with Papalii, if we can match, he might stay. If we cant, he will be gone.

Others will disagree but I reckon Williams would have gone. Same with Mateo and Inu - there can be a lot of crocodile tears about deciding to leave a club that you still have to play out the season for, so I wouldn't be convinced by any such protestations - or even the absence of any new statements at all.

2nd point. That could be the case but local journo's with proven track records of knowing what is going on inside canberra camp, not one of them, about 3-4 of them, have all suggested their sources are saying he's having 2nd thoughts. He might well be just focusing on football and this is all one big smoke storm... but there is a hell of a lot of smoke for no fire in that case, wouldnt you agree?

I'd put the lot of smoke down to the reasons I outlined above - saving face, feeding the friendly journos and putting in a more public effort this time to convince the other guys (and sponsors, and board opponents/membership if that applies) that it's not all downhill from here. Our club would probably be forced into the same thing if Hayne decided to take up/announce an offer elsewhere.

 

[parra-matters]

Just because the raiders are saying they are out chasing 3rd party deals doesn't mean they are. Just like because a "statement" said that Josh was looking forward to coming to parramatta doesn't mean he said it from his mouth.
It could be a case of Josh saying he was 100% sure anymore so parra went announced his signing or the raiders really didn't show enough interest or money at the time josh and his manager were looking to secure his future.
infact no one here knows what is 100% true and neither do the media, they are only fed what ethier club wants the public to hear.

 

[Raider_69]

Fair enough mate, i will disagree but ultimately both of us are hoping for the best and somewhat ignoring factors that dont suit that argument.

As said, we'll see how this thing shakes out but one thing I'm pretty certain of, and that's not even Josh Papalii knows where he'll be playing football in 2014 right now.
I think we will know by round 1 kick off, if Canberra haven't got a deal sorted by then, they probably will have given up and will concede defeat and begin focusing on the other important guys we've got off contract. Interesting 2 weeks ahead i think.

 

[Pete Cash]

Ah, so not a very active membership base then? Oh well....

The membership base has zero voting rights mate. The raiders are essentially a dictatorship.

 

[mickdo]

3rd party deals my arse. Pull your finger out Schubert.